Writing Basics Chat - conflict Topic: Writing and Pacing Conflict
Subject: Writing Basics Chat - conflict
Author: Writing Basics
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Topic: Writing and Pacing Conflict
Wednesdays
11 p.m. ET (8 p.m. PT), Writers Den
Writing Basics - Topics for new and experienced writers to develop or review basic writing skills through discussion and practical exercises. Moderated by HOST WRTR LINDA, HOST WRTR RGUGAT, greeted by (alternate) HOST WRTR SPKLD1, mail contact: HOST WRTR STAR.
Writing Basics Chat Logs Available
The following list is valid as of the upload date, with more entries posted periodically as they become available. If you would care to access a file or topic older than listed here, please see the description for the uploads prior to the date on end of this list for installment information. If you still cannot locate the chat log desired email HOST WRTR SPKLD1 or the current moderators of Writing Basics to make your request.
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03/21/01 - Character Profiles. (Contains Sample Bio Sheet.)
03/14/01 - Naming Characters.
03/07/01 - Selecting a Point of View.
02/28/01 - Journaling to beat writer's block and be more observant.
02/21/01 - Tips on using proper Grammar
02/14/01 - Writing Body Movements.
02/07/01 - Writing and Pacing Conflict
01/31/01 - Gerunds, Infinitives and Participles; verbs that behave like nouns.
01/24/01 - Stepping from Idea to Story
01/17/01 - Verbs and Tense
*01/10/01 - Where to start: Organization.
*Use this date and topic as a link to the older set of uploads.
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Subject: Writing Basics Chat - conflict
Author: Writing Basics Chat
Uploaded By: HOST WRTR SPKLD1
Date: 8/25/2000
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Topic: Conflict
Wednesdays
11 p.m. ET (8 p.m. PT), Writers Den
Writing Basics - Topics for new and experienced writers to develop or review basic writing skills through discussion and practical exercises. Moderated by HOST WRTR LINDA, HOST WRTR RGUGAT, greeted by (alternate) HOST WRTR SPKLD1, mail contact: HOST WRTR STAR.
Writing Basics Chat Logs Available
The following list is valid as of the upload date, with more entries posted as they become available. If you would care to access a file or topic older than this list or not included here, email HOST WRTR SPKLD1 or the current moderators of Writing Basics to make your request.
All files are ASCII text for PC, with carriage return and line-feed characters on every line. Gaps in dates are indicated by the dashes, removing those logs of a non-specific topic or having techincal difficulties.
08/23/00 - Description: Writing With Emotion
08/16/00 - Creating Characters
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07/19/00 - Background and Setting
07/12/00 - The Plot
07/05/00 - Word Games
06/28/00 - Conflict
06/21/00 - Point Of View
06/14/00 - Writing Nonfiction
06/07/00 - Naming Characters
05/31/00 - Characterization: Heros and Villains
05/24/00 - Novels (part 2)
05/17/00 - Novels
---
05/03/00 - Creating Characters
04/26/00 - Writing Trivia Game
04/19/00 - Dialog
04/12/00 - Copy Editing
04/05/00 - Writing on Demand
03/29/00 - Mystery Writing with guest Harlon Coben
03/22/00 - Art of Marketting
---
03/01/00 - Character Profiles
02/23/00 - TV Writing with guest LostFootage
---
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HOST WRTR Linda: Welcome to Writing Basics. I hope everyone has a good time
tonight.
HOST WRTR Linda: Tonight we will be discussing conflict
HOST WRTR Linda: what it is
HOST WRTR Linda: what is is meant to do
HOST WRTR Linda: how and when to write it
HOST WRTR Linda: and how to resolve it.
StoryLen: The very existence of conflict rests on the assumption of a flow,
an orderliness to the
StoryLen: things in this world.
Host Wrtr RGugat: The A2Panther, Rebecca, Protocol, Please?
StoryLen: Conflict is a disturbance of that order.
SeabornDan: Conflict..hmm.. that's when I bring up the idea of having sex
with my wife
HOST WRTR Linda: This is an interactive module so please type ! or ? for
comments or questions
The A2Panther: <---bows head... sorry...
SeabornDan: oops
HOST WRTR Linda: and take privte chat to IM's at this point.
StoryLen: ! retroactively
HOST WRTR Linda: lol
EFHolstein: I am IMing bill clinton even as we speak
HOST WRTR Linda: To move a story along and keep a readers interest
HOST WRTR Linda: we have to have drama. In order to have drama
HOST WRTR Linda: we need conflict.
StoryLen: !
HOST WRTR Linda: Conflict is tension orr discord. How many other
definitions of conflict
HOST WRTR Linda: can we come up with?
HOST WRTR Linda: Story, ga
StoryLen: You were right, this is pretty basic; I have deja vu of HS English
right now.
MRSFRENCHY: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: OK Story, we start with the beginning and build from there.
StoryLen: k
HOST WRTR Linda: MRSFRENCHY, ga
MRSFRENCHY: Could conflict be a problem that the main character encounters?
MRSFRENCHY: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes MRS. That would be one type of conflict. Conflict
establishes
HOST WRTR Linda: the focus of the action or suspense to follow. There are
many
HOST WRTR Linda: types of conflict and you will use many of them at the same
time.
MRSFRENCHY: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: A problem encountered is one type of conflict. Add a few
more?
HOST WRTR Linda: MRS, ga
MRSFRENCHY: At the same time? ga
Jackatbrun: !
Kathi Smith 116: !
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes, at the same time. It would be a boring story if there
were only
Host Wrtr RGugat: !
HOST WRTR Linda: one point of conflict to deal with. I'll go over the types
in a minute but first
HOST WRTR Linda: let's hear from Jack, then Kathi. Jack, ga
Jackatbrun: Everyone should analyze their favorite story for conflicts.
Romeo & Juliet has conflicts on
Jackatbrun: several levels: btn Prince and community; btn Capulets and
Montagues; between]
SeabornDan: !
Jackatbrun: Romeo and Juliet. All are solved in the death and
Jackatbrun: love of those two "star-crossed" lovers. ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Exactly Jack. Romeo and Juliet is a good example of
multiple conflicts.
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathy, ga
Kathi Smith 116: Inner struggle is an interesting form of conflict /GA
Host Wrtr RGugat: internal conflict -- the protagonist wrestles with his
Host Wrtr RGugat: conscience, his desire to stay alive, to take the
Host Wrtr RGugat: "easy" way, etc. ===> GA
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathy, that is always a good one. We will talk about that
in more detail tonight.
Kathi Smith 116: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: RG
Host Wrtr RGugat: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Sea, ga
SeabornDan: Conflict is man against man, man against circumstance or events,
or even a mental struggle
SeabornDan: with himself
SeabornDan: just a couple of examples. ga
HOST WRTR Linda: That is a good definition, Sea.
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathi
Kathi Smith 116: Can there be too much conflict in a story? /GA
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes, Kathy. Too much or poor timing make a big difference.
HOST WRTR Linda: Let's talk about conflict via confrontation first.
HOST WRTR Linda: Action may or may not be involved.
HOST WRTR Linda: The confrontation may be with a person or and idea
HOST WRTR Linda: or with a corporation.
HOST WRTR Linda: It may be the result of a difference in values. One
example
HOST WRTR Linda: Mom confronts a daughter who is doing poorly in school
while
HOST WRTR Linda: dad confronts his boss at work over a coverup.
HOST WRTR Linda: In the meantime, the teenage son is in the midst of a brawl
and has a broken
HOST WRTR Linda: nose and the mother-in-law is due to arrive any minute for
vacation.
HOST WRTR Linda: To spice it up a little more, we have a raging forest fire
HOST WRTR Linda: and the wind is picking up.
HOST WRTR Linda: At what point did this become too much or is it all
possible?
R2532: /
Seti X: !
Kathi Smith 116: !
Host Wrtr RGugat: !
HOST WRTR Linda: R2532, ga
Berrins: !
R2532: it became too much w the fire...who would be scolding their dau at
time?
R2532: and the fire makes all the rest inconsequential
HOST WRTR Linda: Hmm, you may be right R2. On the other hand, there are
forest fires burning in my
HOST WRTR Linda: area right now and I'm on line.
HOST WRTR Linda: Seti
Seti X: it's okay to have back story but too muchis too much
Seti X: your scenario ought to be starring tom cruise
R2532: but are you having a serious discussion with your daughter? If the
fire is that far away whu
HOST WRTR Linda: Seti, you hit the mark. There are mini conflicts and mini
drama's going
HOST WRTR Linda: on but to present them all on the same page or within the
same
Seti X: yup...levels of interest
HOST WRTR Linda: paragraph detracts from them all.
R2532: or is your mother in laws neighbnorhood on fire? What is the
connection?
SeabornDan: !
HOST WRTR Linda: (R2, it was backgroun as Seti caught)
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathi (que is Kaathi, R
Kathi Smith 116: That could all happen in real life, but stories must filter
reality to be believable /GA
Kathi Smith 116: (And context is everything in a story)
HOST WRTR Linda: G, Berrins, Sea) If I missed anyone, let me know.
Berrins: It's possible if some of the confrontations are connected. The son
is fighting the boy who
Berrins: is responsible for the daughter being behind in school
Kathi Smith 116: !
Host Wrtr RGugat: you missed me
Berrins: The dad is confronting the boss, who is responsibvle for the ifre
HOST WRTR Linda: Excellent Berrins
HOST WRTR Linda: RG
Berrins: ga
Host Wrtr RGugat: too much for a short story, but it could be done in a
Host Wrtr RGugat: novel -- assuming that timing is used judiciously to
Host Wrtr RGugat: schedule the tradgedies. ===> Linda, May I assume
Host Wrtr RGugat: the forest fire is NOT in your back yard? GA
HOST WRTR Linda: lol, no not right in the yard but a few miles away.
SeabornDan: Berrins made same point I was going to make... fire could be set
involving dad's cover up
HOST WRTR Linda: Very good Sea. Youu have picked up a very important point.
HOST WRTR Linda: If you use multiple conflicts
HOST WRTR Linda: even if they ar not directly connnected
HOST WRTR Linda: you do have to weave a few of them into cohesion with the
other
HOST WRTR Linda: conflicts that are going on.
HOST WRTR Linda: That gives you a smooth flow and
HOST WRTR Linda: helps keep your pace.
SeabornDan: Combine all the topics into one complete story... I see about 12
ways to interweave every
HOST WRTR Linda: Don't forget, conflicts do not esclate in a linear manner.
SeabornDan: one of the characters.
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes, Sea. It has been done many times and very well too.
Berrins: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: Conflicts escalate
HOST WRTR Linda: then back off, then you ratchet up the tension again. You
keep the main
HOST WRTR Linda: point of conflict going up but you have to give your reader
time to take a
HOST WRTR Linda: breath.
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, ga
Berrins: How, then do so many multi-conflict stories seem to wrap up at the
end? Seems contrived.
The Inner Dingo: !
Host Wrtr RGugat: Berrins, !
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, at work do you have more than one thing going on
at a time? Someone is upset
HOST WRTR Linda: because the copier is jammed, someone else called out sick,
someone else forgot to finish a
HOST WRTR Linda: memo, things like that?
HOST WRTR Linda: RG, ga
Host Wrtr RGugat: Berrins, contrived conflict resolution is fine, so long
Host Wrtr RGugat: as the contriving can be attributed to the characters
Host Wrtr RGugat: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: (Those are background conflicts Berrins)
HOST WRTR Linda: The Inner Dingo, ga
The Inner Dingo: Fiction, by definition, is the willing suspension of
disbelief. Of course it's contrived.
HOST WRTR Linda: lol, good point
The Inner Dingo: That's you r job as the artist.
The Inner Dingo: your
SeabornDan: as the writer
HOST WRTR Linda: yup
Host Wrtr RGugat: ! The Inner Dingo,
The Inner Dingo: Yes?
HOST WRTR Linda: rg
Host Wrtr RGugat: Point == in here, we refer to writers as "We" or "us"
rather then "them"
Berrins: !
The Inner Dingo: Huh?
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, ga
Host Wrtr RGugat: we are the writers
Berrins: I suppose not all conflicts need resolution; just the main
character's.
Host Wrtr RGugat: including you
Host Wrtr RGugat: ga
The Inner Dingo: RG, I'm a published novelist.
Berrins: Makes for possible serial novels ...
Berrins: ga
Host Wrtr RGugat: The Inner Dingo, :)
The Inner Dingo: :)
HOST WRTR Linda: Confrontational conflict comes in many forms
The Inner Dingo: !
SeabornDan: Berrins.. that idea keeps comic books afloat
HOST WRTR Linda: it can be a rivalry or chase between characters
HOST WRTR Linda: it can be an inner stuggle of a character with himself
HOST WRTR Linda: it can be confronting the environment in a struggle to
survive
HOST WRTR Linda: or to overcome an injury or phobia
HOST WRTR Linda: or any combination of those plus a few more.
HOST WRTR Linda: The Inner Dingo, Ga
The Inner Dingo: Conflict is always a confrontation, within or without. The
point is to show the conflict,
The Inner Dingo: with all its ramifications, not tell about it.
The Inner Dingo: Having it resolved is a character-based problem.
HOST WRTR Linda: And that brings us to our next point. Play on the
emotions.
The Inner Dingo: When you have your characters firmly in place, their
persona will lead you to the
The Inner Dingo: resolution or lack of resolution. Keep in mind that not
all conflict is always resolved
Berrins: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: Good point
HOST WRTR Linda: The Inner Dingo
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, ga
The Inner Dingo: Thanks.
SeabornDan: !
Berrins: Just a thought- when is a confrontation not a conflict?
The Inner Dingo: !
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, confrontation is usually a conflict as far as I
can tell.
HOST WRTR Linda: Sea, ga
The Inner Dingo: and vice versa
Host Wrtr RGugat: !
Berrins: So how are the two different?
SeabornDan: Having a conflict resolved is a character based problem.. but
The Inner Dingo: !
SeabornDan: how the character resolves it is also a character-based
problem... may not always do
SeabornDan: it in a manner that is good
SeabornDan: or efficient
HOST WRTR Linda: (Que, Sea, Dingo, RG, then Dingo again.)
SeabornDan: Have to solve it how the character would solve it.
SeabornDan: Ga
The Inner Dingo: The difference between confrontation and conflict is simple
The Inner Dingo: Confrontation almost always has a final resolution.
Conflict almost never does.
HOST WRTR Linda: That is a wonderful way to put it Dingo!
The Inner Dingo: I make my living at this.
HOST WRTR Linda: RG
Host Wrtr RGugat: Confrontation is a conflict only if both parties make it
Host Wrtr RGugat: a conflict -- you could provide a simple, "yes, Sir"
Host Wrtr RGugat: ending to a confrontation..... GA
The Inner Dingo: Huh?
HOST WRTR Linda: True RG
The Inner Dingo: !
HOST WRTR Linda: It's still a conflict
The Inner Dingo: !
HOST WRTR Linda: but the confrontation part is over before it escalates
HOST WRTR Linda: Dingo
The Inner Dingo: Confrontation is not necessarily a conflict. You could
have two characters at odds, with
The Inner Dingo: both of them believing the same thing, but their styles
could provide agitation.
The Inner Dingo: Hence, there is a confrontation, but no substantive
conflict.
The Inner Dingo: Again, you're talking about personalities.
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes, but conflict (tension) is still there.
HOST WRTR Linda: ok, let's move on a bit since the clock is ticking.
The Inner Dingo: Not substantive, though. There is emotion, which provokes
the conflict.
HOST WRTR Linda: Immediacy gives dramatic impact
HOST WRTR Linda: and it's a crucial part of conflict.
HOST WRTR Linda: The fire is burning...not the fire was burning
HOST WRTR Linda: I mentioned earlier that to be effective
HOST WRTR Linda: you keep the tension growing
HOST WRTR Linda: you add more stress to the conflict
HOST WRTR Linda: One definition of conflict that was not mentioned
HOST WRTR Linda: is that the character confronts a problem and the outcome
is uncertain.
SeabornDan: !
Kathi Smith 116: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: If my conflict is a struggle with myself
HOST WRTR Linda: because I desperately need $100 and do not have a hope of
getting it legally
HOST WRTR Linda: but I'm basically a "good person" who would not steal
money...
HOST WRTR Linda: how can you escalate the tension or conflict in this
instance?
HOST WRTR Linda: Sea, we'll take your comment while everyone is thinking
that one over.
Berrins: Become a census taker ;-)
SeabornDan: It's a situation of "must" and "cannot." Action "must" be
taken... but situations prevail
HOST WRTR Linda: (lol Berrins)
HOST WRTR Linda: Yup Sea. I love those kinds of conflicts.
SeabornDan: so character "cannot" seemingly accomplish the goal... writer
has to have a way
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathi
Kathi Smith 116: Isn't the outcome always uncertain? Where's the suspense if
it's a sure thing? ?GA
Berrins: !
SeabornDan: that character can prevail... and keep reader interested.
HOST WRTR Linda: (OOPS, sorry Sea. You were not finished. My apologies)
SeabornDan: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes Sea. How to choose between two unacceptable choices.
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathi, the outcome is not always uncertain
HOST WRTR Linda: For instance, if a childs life depends on that $100 you can
be retty certain
Host Wrtr RGugat: !
HOST WRTR Linda: the money will be stolen if that is the only choice.
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins,
Berrins: Present them with an illegal, immoral opportunity to make some
cash; standard plot device
Berrins: that will stir it up. ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Yup Berrins. Or up the anti. The child will certainly die
if mom can't pay for the antidot
HOST WRTR Linda: antidote.
HOST WRTR Linda: RG, ga
Host Wrtr RGugat: YUP Escalation of this "honor" conflict can be
Host Wrtr RGugat: achieved by circumstances such as the character's
Host Wrtr RGugat: three year old daughter needs surgery to live and
Host Wrtr RGugat: there is no money . . . . GA
HOST WRTR Linda: Right, or...
HOST WRTR Linda: it can be very uncertain by having a less urgent reason for
the
HOST WRTR Linda: need for cash.
HOST WRTR Linda: Then you have to guess where the balance is.
Host Wrtr RGugat: !
HOST WRTR Linda: One of the best ways to escalate is to keep adding
uncertainties to the
HOST WRTR Linda: resolution of the conflict. i.e She finds the money but
might not make it to the hospital
HOST WRTR Linda: in time because of an accident.
Berrins: !
HOST WRTR Linda: RG, then Berrins.
Host Wrtr RGugat: ga
Berrins: Another way to escalate is to have the need for money
Berrins: come from a charater flaw
Berrins: and not an outside need
HOST WRTR Linda: Right Berrins or you could also create another crisis that
also needs that same money to
Berrins: Or have the opportunity to get the money come from a character flaw
(or conflict)
Berrins: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: resolve. Thus you have two conflicts and the character can
only
HOST WRTR Linda: resolve one.
HOST WRTR Linda: RG
Host Wrtr RGugat: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: ok
SeabornDan: !
HOST WRTR Linda: We have just enough time for two more comments or questions
before I wrap up.
HOST WRTR Linda: Sea, ga
SeabornDan: In my experience you can never have too many conflicts...
Berrins: lol
SeabornDan: How they are all resolved is the issue... I usually have a
minimum of 6 conflicts in the
SeabornDan: comics I write...
SeabornDan: per issue
SeabornDan: some may be solved immediately... some take many MANY issues to
finish
SeabornDan: some never. ga
HOST WRTR Linda: As long as you pace them correctly, multiple conflicts work
well. You have to be careful to
HOST WRTR Linda: NOT overwhelm the reader with too many at once and you also
HOST WRTR Linda: have to escalate the level of tension for each conflict
HOST WRTR Linda: at different times.
HOST WRTR Linda: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Any other questions or comments?
Berrins: How do you handle multiple POV confrontations- more than one
conflict?
SeabornDan: Yep, some conflicts are personal... some are on global scale.
Berrins: at the same confrontation...
Berrins: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, I'm not sure exactly what you mean. Can you give
an example
HOST WRTR Linda: ga
SeabornDan: !
Berrins: The Roshomon idea.
Berrins: Each person thinks a difernet reality is happening.
HOST WRTR Linda: oh, ok
HOST WRTR Linda: I don't think that would be multilple POV conflicts
HOST WRTR Linda: or confrontations.
HOST WRTR Linda: I would have to handle that as separate scenes within a
story, each
SeabornDan: Do you mean have a situation viewed by multiple characters..
each interpreting what they see
SeabornDan: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: (Sea, thanks for jumping in. That is how I took it)
SeabornDan: We say the Darryl Gates video of L.A. cops beating him... that
was our pov
HOST WRTR Linda: with their own type of conflict.
SeabornDan: Cops had a different pov before video was started to record...
HOST WRTR Linda: lolol they sure did
SeabornDan: jurors heard testimony and had their own pov
SeabornDan: Rioters had their pov
SeabornDan: we were disgusted with rioters... our pov of extra conflict..
Berrins: Maybe that's why legal/court dramas do so well..
HOST WRTR Linda: hahaha Berrins. Maybe.
SeabornDan: store owners experienced rioters and had their pov of that
conflict...etc/
HOST WRTR Linda: Everyone will view whatever conflic or confrontation you
write
HOST WRTR Linda: through their own eyes and with their own values.
HOST WRTR Linda: I hope you all enjoyed tonight. I have just a couple of
announcements
SeabornDan: What happened to Dingo, he does this for a living...
HOST WRTR Linda: RG, care to tell us about next week?
SeabornDan: Next week is backgrounds and settings, eh?
SeabornDan: I'll try to be more prepared next week.
SeabornDan: >")))>< ~~~
HOST WRTR Linda: (I'm not sure where Dingo went. Maybe this was a little
too confrontational for him ;-)
SeabornDan: hehehe
HOST WRTR Linda: lol Sea, you keep us on our toes.
HOST WRTR Linda: RG, next week?
SeabornDan: He couldn't deal with the conflict
Berrins: Thanks for an interesting session. Have a good week!
HOST WRTR Linda: You too Berrins.
HOST WRTR Linda: I will have some basic computer info in the next
HOST WRTR Linda: memo so watch for that.
SeabornDan: Where was Spkld1 this whole time?!
HOST WRTR Linda: I also plan to introduce a "clinic" night sometime this
fall
SeabornDan: E-mail from 21st says next week is backgrounds/settings.
HOST WRTR Linda: where we will try to fix ailing stories as a group.
SeabornDan: Linda, so you're gonna start assigning homework?
HOST WRTR Linda: Thanks Sea.
HOST WRTR Linda: Yup
HOST WRTR Linda: homework on the schedule. lol
SeabornDan: hmmm... been outa school so long... might have to cheat off
someone's paper...
HOST WRTR Linda: lolol
HOST WRTR Linda: Have a good night
SeabornDan: Good night everyone
SeabornDan: >")))>< ~~ gotta swim.. take care.. stay groovy
HOST WRTR Linda: You too
HOST WRTR Linda: Niters
HOST WRTR Linda: WELCOME TO WRITING BASICS
HOST WRTR Linda: tonights chat will be in protocol unless I cut you a break
now and then.
HOST WRTR Linda: We will be discussing conflict tonight, I hope
HOST WRTR Linda: to talk about what types of conflict are appropriaate to
your stories,
HOST WRTR Linda: how to build conflict
HOST WRTR Linda: and how to escalate existing conflict while introducing new
ones.
HOST WRTR Linda: It would be rare for any story to hae only one conflict at
one level.
HOST WRTR Linda: have
Junghouse: build conflict by not having your characters know what the other
wants.
HOST WRTR Linda: (peanut butter and jelly.....I'm gonna xxxx that kid!)
Junghouse: that means you are somewhat skizo
Junghouse: bad speeling errors
Junghouse: spelling
Junghouse: errors
HOST WRTR Linda: JUNG
HOST WRTR Linda: lol
Junghouse: yes
HOST WRTR Linda: So, to start you off, I'm going to give you an
Phillydude718278: hi room
Phillydude718278: are there published novelists in here
HOST WRTR Linda: example of the difference between tension and conflict.
HOST WRTR Linda: Philly, check you IM please.
Sryope2: (Everyone Hush, Linda is talking!!!)
Phillydude718278: my im
Phillydude718278: they are on
HOST WRTR Linda: Tension occurs as a result of action or potential action.
HOST WRTR Linda: Tension sets the stage for conflict.
Junghouse: that is too intellectual for me
HOST WRTR Linda: If you look at everyday life, you will find
Junghouse: i need to feel the pain
HOST WRTR Linda: you hae multiple examples of each in a day.
Junghouse: then I tcan think like someone in need
HOST WRTR Linda: Here's the examples;
HOST WRTR Linda: Saturday night, Greg fell down the stairs and dislocated
his kneecap..(action)
Junghouse: doesn't this stuff come form your gut
Junghouse: your own unrequited needs
HOST WRTR Linda: He laid on the floor screaming, waiting for the E
HOST WRTR Linda: EMT's
HOST WRTR Linda: (tension)
Junghouse: that's not exactly subtle
HOST WRTR Linda: When the EMT's were ready to move him, he resisted
HOST WRTR Linda: (conflict and action)
Junghouse: cause he was nuts
Junghouse: sorry
HOST WRTR Linda: until they gave him some morphine
HOST WRTR Linda: but then his mother became upset
HOST WRTR Linda: (tension)
HOST WRTR Linda: since morphine is a powerful drug.
HOST WRTR Linda: At the hospital, Greg's Xray
HOST WRTR Linda: have a few oddities (tension)
HOST WRTR Linda: Some areas of bone were not visible (tension) on the Xray
HOST WRTR Linda: The doctor put his kneecap back in place and suggested
HOST WRTR Linda: a followup on Monday.
HOST WRTR Linda: Monday comes, Greg goes to the doctor
HOST WRTR Linda: and hears the news, the blank spots in the Xray may be
cancer
HOST WRTR Linda: and he will need an MRI to confirm.
HOST WRTR Linda: What were the last two sentences? Conflict or tension?
Sryope2: tension
SaltyJack: Tension
Berrins: tension
Junghouse: dull as dish water
Sryope2: Jung if you can't be nice, go away
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes, this is getting tense. This is also real life.
HOST WRTR Linda: Add the fact that Greg is 15 years old
Junghouse: hey, i am an example of tension
HOST WRTR Linda: and you have a whole chapter of conflict and tension
HOST WRTR Linda: how does his mom act or react, what decisions have to be
made
HOST WRTR Linda: what if those decisions come down to being the lesser of
two unappealing choices?
SaltyJack: Like the last election?
MudderGG: ho ho
HOST WRTR Linda: hahaha Salty
HOST WRTR Linda: good one
Sryope2: (Hey Ben, Welcome)
HOST WRTR Linda: What I wanted to point out here
HOST WRTR Linda: is that you will have many levels and areas of conflict in
one
HOST WRTR Linda: story, involving the same character.
HOST WRTR Linda: In my example, Greg has all kinds of potential conflict
HOST WRTR Linda: he's a teen (so he's at odds with the world already)
JsmnStrm: (damn that AOL!)
HOST WRTR Linda: He won't want the necessary testing because it will hurt,
FalcnEdie: (Thanx Sry :-)
HOST WRTR Linda: he'll want to be somewhat compliant for his mom's sake
HOST WRTR Linda: but he won't get to have a big say in what
HOST WRTR Linda: will directly affect his future.
HOST WRTR Linda: His mom will have conflict such as
HOST WRTR Linda: being in denial and unable to face what's coming.
HOST WRTR Linda: She'll also be lookig for a reason when there is none
HOST WRTR Linda: and the pressure on her to make the decisions will be more
than she can deal with.
HOST WRTR Linda: Dad will be left with all the really nasty choices resting
HOST WRTR Linda: on his shoulders and may or may not come through it all
relatively
HOST WRTR Linda: unscathed but not unchanged.
HOST WRTR Linda: What I would like you to do
HOST WRTR Linda: is to take four pages of your current story
HOST WRTR Linda: and read them over out loud
HOST WRTR Linda: then identify at least 6 areas of conflict or tension (NOT
ACTION(
HOST WRTR Linda: in those four pages.
HOST WRTR Linda: )
HOST WRTR Linda: ;-)
HOST WRTR Linda: You can practice a little tonight by starting out
HOST WRTR Linda: with three areas of "tension" and escalating it to
conflict.
HOST WRTR Linda: okay, chat time now. lol
HOST WRTR Linda: Any questions so far?
Annie313B: nope
HOST WRTR Linda: lol Annie.
HOST WRTR Linda: We start slow, just those little pressures that might be
pushing or driving your
HOST WRTR Linda: character.
HOST WRTR Linda: Does he or she have to make a choice between doing
something unpleasant or doing something
Sryope2: more unpleasant?
HOST WRTR Linda: downright miserable?
HOST WRTR Linda: yup
HOST WRTR Linda: the choices you give your characters should not be the easy
ones like
HOST WRTR Linda: should I have vanilla ice cream or butter pecan
Sryope2: (chocolate)]
HOST WRTR Linda: make them chose between rocky road and praline!
Sryope2: lol
HOST WRTR Linda: choose
HOST WRTR Linda: sheesh
Berrins: shesh
HOST WRTR Linda: Seriously, the choices should never be clean or easy
ESP Sue Z: !
HOST WRTR Linda: They shouldn't always be major choices either.
Berrins: An easy choice has no tension- does all conflict beging with
tension?
HOST WRTR Linda: Small conficting choices lay the groundwork.
HOST WRTR Linda: ESP, ga
ESP Sue Z: The hardest choices psychologically are ones where each
possibility has good AND bad to it..
HOST WRTR Linda: Very good ESP.
ESP Sue Z: leads to waffling - or backtracking
ESP Sue Z: /
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes, when the character keeps second guessing the choices
made
HOST WRTR Linda: then you automatically increase the tension and add more
HOST WRTR Linda: areas for potential conflict.
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins,
HOST WRTR Linda: yes, there has to be
HOST WRTR Linda: tension for the conflict to be effective. Otherwise
HOST WRTR Linda: is really does come down to a choice between
HOST WRTR Linda: two unimportant items
HOST WRTR Linda: and there is no point in including that in your story, not
HOST WRTR Linda: evn for background.
HOST WRTR Linda: even
HOST WRTR Linda: Choices must mean something to the character
HOST WRTR Linda: they should also involve
HOST WRTR Linda: areas in which your character can grow
HOST WRTR Linda: or fail miserably.
HOST WRTR Linda: There should always be at least two possible
HOST WRTR Linda: outcomes (creating more tension)
HOST WRTR Linda: These minor conflicts should be going on ALL the time
HOST WRTR Linda: in your story line. If you are doing a Civil War story
HOST WRTR Linda: sub conflicts might include...
HOST WRTR Linda: where to steal a chicken because you haven't eaten in a
week
HOST WRTR Linda: where to find clean water while you are scouting out the
enemy camps
HOST WRTR Linda: where is it safe to build a fire without giving away your
position
HOST WRTR Linda: all these are minor but they do add tension and
HOST WRTR Linda: pressure. They also drive the urgency of your
HOST WRTR Linda: characters reactions when the bigger conflicts come up.
HOST WRTR Linda: The bigger conflicts involve the things that your character
values most.
HOST WRTR Linda: That may be family, love, money, honor
HOST WRTR Linda: or anything with a high emotional impact.
HOST WRTR Linda: Maybe your characters big conflict is sacrificing
HOST WRTR Linda: his own life to save someone else
HOST WRTR Linda: or to fight for an ideal.
HOST WRTR Linda: Questions? Answers?
HOST WRTR Linda: Neither!
Annie313B: nope
Kathi Smith 116: !
HOST WRTR Linda: Either everyone is asleep or I have failed (tension)
HOST WRTR Linda: lol
Kathi Smith 116: This is great stuff, Linda
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathi, ga
ESP Sue Z: zzz
Berrins: I'm thinking about pace- too much conflict can get tiring to read.
ESP Sue Z: (not serious!)
Annie313B: I get it.. is all.. so no ? from me
Kathi Smith 116: !
Sryope2: Excellent so far Linda, keep going
HOST WRTR Linda: I know ESP ;-)
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, absolutely essential point.
HOST WRTR Linda: Thank you for bringing that up.
MaggieOake: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: Too much major conflict or major tension does get tiring.
HOST WRTR Linda: That is why you need those sub-conflicts in the story.
They
HOST WRTR Linda: don't create major scenes or even big decisions but they
HOST WRTR Linda: do keep things moving.
Sryope2: !
HOST WRTR Linda: Kathi, ga
Kathi Smith 116: You can vary the pace by alternating tension and conflict,
right?
Kathi Smith 116: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Good tactic Kathi, that works well.
HOST WRTR Linda: Maggie, ga
MaggieOake: does mixing little tensions (where can I camp safely?) w/ big
tensions (did my beloved
MaggieOake: survive the big battle?) make for good pacing?/
HOST WRTR Linda: Yes Maggie, it does if it isn't overdone.
MaggieOake: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: You don't want to overshadow big conflicts with little ones
at the same time
HOST WRTR Linda: but you do need a few little ones to divert some of the
pressure.
MaggieOake: never mind, I just wanted you to say more &you're doing it. <G>
HOST WRTR Linda: lol
ESP Sue Z: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: Sryope, ga
Sryope2: I think it's important to introduce a little humor or lighter story
to balance the tension
Sryope2: For instance, I love the Mrs Polifax series
Sryope2: And it's a serious spy story, yet she wears a flowered hat and is
over 65
Sryope2: I think it balances the tension. ga
HOST WRTR Linda: My group is on the ball tonight. Very good Sryope!
Berrins: !
MaggieOake: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: Humor goes a looooooong way
HOST WRTR Linda: in keeping the balance and Sryope is right, you do need
some
HOST WRTR Linda: balance.
HOST WRTR Linda: Berrins, ga
Berrins: What Syrope is suggesting also provides contrast, highlighting the
conflict more
HOST WRTR Linda: YAY, they all have got it!!!!
Berrins: Plus, you can use the lighyter moments to give a character
something to strive fore
Berrins: Why conflict if you have only more conflict to strive for?
HOST WRTR Linda: I'm glad you are bringing these points up. They fit right
in and they all
HOST WRTR Linda: fit together to form a whole.
Sryope2: (Then it becomes like Danielle Steel. Yuck.)
HOST WRTR Linda: lol
HOST WRTR Linda: I missed a ? from ESP
ESP Sue Z: A story also needs a pause with something brighter happening -
where the protag thinks every
HOST WRTR Linda: ga
Annie313B: hey she makes big bucks
ESP Sue Z: thing's going to be OK - but just as she's basking in that, the
next tension hits (it's alwa
ESP Sue Z: always brightest just before the tornado hits <G>)
ESP Sue Z: ga
Berrins: (the "it's too good to last" feeling)
HOST WRTR Linda: Very good. I am beaming right now.
ESP Sue Z: yeh - the reader knows she's only 1/4 of the way through the
book! LOL
HOST WRTR Linda: That one is a little tricky ESP
HOST WRTR Linda: It is very effective but
ESP Sue Z: Needs a little blending, maybe?
HOST WRTR Linda: you have to handle that "tornado" with care, otherwise
HOST WRTR Linda: hahaha yes, blending.
ESP Sue Z: :)
HOST WRTR Linda: Never let your tactics become transparent
HOST WRTR Linda: they must always seem to flow from the story or the
background.
ESP Sue Z: ? follow up?
HOST WRTR Linda: They should never look forced or written in as a gimick.
HOST WRTR Linda: ga ESP
MaggieOake: ?
ESP Sue Z: If there's been foreshadowing of the bad stuff coming - so it
makes sense to the reader when
ESP Sue Z: it happens? Instead of coming from nowhere?
ESP Sue Z: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: (Maggie, I think ...yup, I missed your ? too. Sorry, your
next)
HOST WRTR Linda: ESP, that helps with the blending you mentioned
MaggieOake: (no problem...I've made the same boo-boo when monitoring)
HOST WRTR Linda: that way your surprise doesn't come out of thin air
Sryope2: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: and if you let the reader anticipate a little (even if they
guess wrong)
HOST WRTR Linda: it's always a plus.
HOST WRTR Linda: Maggie, ga.
MaggieOake: Is it good to have a character so shaken by the big tensions
that a small tension triggers
MaggieOake: a disproportionately emotional reaction - one that, out of
context, might seem a little craz
MaggieOake: crazy?
MaggieOake: ga/
ESP Sue Z: ?
HOST WRTR Linda: Maggie, although I think that happens in real life, in a
story
WORDGUY280: "He was trembling with anticipation as he kissed her ruby-red
lips. They she crossed her
HOST WRTR Linda: the point of all these tensions is to promote your
characters growth by presenting
WORDGUY280: legs and broke his glasses."
HOST WRTR Linda: them with constant challenges.
HOST WRTR Linda: I suspect the answer to your question depends on what the
focus of your
HOST WRTR Linda: story is. Is it about someone insane and what they do
after
HOST WRTR Linda: or is the insane part the finale?
HOST WRTR Linda: Syrope, then ESP
MaggieOake: Someone who's driven nearly insane by a stalker, & then must
fight her way out of it.
MaggieOake: /
Sryope2: Readers hate the machina deus ending, yet, they abound in
literature. When is foreshadowing
Sryope2: essential to the conflict and tension, and when can you just spring
an ending.
Sryope2: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: First let me get back to Maggie. Yup, that stalker story
line is one in
Sryope2: ie must you reveal all or hint at all to the reader?
HOST WRTR Linda: which that would work well.
MaggieOake: thx
HOST WRTR Linda: Ah Sryope
HOST WRTR Linda: if I had the answer to that.....
HOST WRTR Linda: I like to foreshadow
HOST WRTR Linda: I like my readers to become involved.
HOST WRTR Linda: As a reader, I like to feel like I am involved
HOST WRTR Linda: and I feel cheated if that participation isn't there.
HOST WRTR Linda: If the writer assumes I can't figure out the small things
HOST WRTR Linda: and paints too vivied a picture, I don't read that writer
for long.
HOST WRTR Linda: On the other hand, there are a lot of hits out there
HOST WRTR Linda: where the surprise factor is a big plus.
HOST WRTR Linda: so, after all this weasling around
Sryope2: I don't understand small things and vivid a picture -- I mean the
concepts not the words
HOST WRTR Linda: it's a personal choice (but foreshadow the main events.)
Kathi Smith 116: !
HOST WRTR Linda: Hang on a sec, I missed someone else
HOST WRTR Linda: Let me give you an example.
HOST WRTR Linda: I walk into a dining room
HOST WRTR Linda: the room is square, it has blue carpet, there are cream
colored drapes
HOST WRTR Linda: on the round table there is a white tablecloth
HOST WRTR Linda: no dishes
HOST WRTR Linda: four maple wood chairs
HOST WRTR Linda: bare walls
HOST WRTR Linda: and the hostess spills the drinks in my lap on the way to
the table.
HOST WRTR Linda: Too much detail
Berrins: extraneous data
Sryope2: Yes, I see
HOST WRTR Linda: no room to allow the reader to fill in the room furnishings
Sryope2: Unless you're Edgar Allan Poe
HOST WRTR Linda: from their own experience or imagination
HOST WRTR Linda: and the spilled drinks came from nowhere.
Sryope2: rewrite it correctly, Linda
HOST WRTR Linda: Okay, Kathi, then
HOST WRTR Linda: ESP
Kathi Smith 116: Foreshadowing can be very subtle,also. You don't have to
hit the reader with a sledgehammer
Kathi Smith 116: ga
HOST WRTR Linda: Exactly Kathi. Sryope, the scene might go like this
HOST WRTR Linda: It was a warm, cozy dining room. The glow of the four
maple wood chairs was inviting.
Berrins: Foreshadowing, by definition, has to be subtle, else it's not a
shadow
HOST WRTR Linda: I watched Judy try to juggle too many glasses of ice
HOST WRTR Linda: as she filled them with the spiced cider.
HOST WRTR Linda: The sunlight made a rainbow pattern on the drapes
HOST WRTR Linda: when
HOST WRTR Linda: tah dah.
HOST WRTR Linda: okay, ESP
ESP Sue Z: Let me see if I'm beginning to understand this -- we're talking
about tension in the charact
ESP Sue Z: er's life, but
ESP Sue Z: our real goal is to get the reader so emotionally involved that
she actually experiences the
ESP Sue Z: physical signs of tension - faster pulse, tense muscles, indrawn
breath held long... , froze
ESP Sue Z: frozen feel (waiting...for...) Is that it? ga
HOST WRTR Linda: We certainly hope for that level of involvement, ESP. That
is what makes it all worth while
HOST WRTR Linda: One last round of questions or comments. (I ran overtime
again)
Sryope2: Thanks for a great lecture as usual
HOST WRTR Linda: awww, thank you Sryope
HOST WRTR SPKLD1: :::LOGOFF:::
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