UFO/Alien message board part 8
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From: david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 17:15:52 GMT
References: <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>
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Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Summary: still going...
Expires:
References: <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>
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And then in <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>, dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
% In article <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
% >In article <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>, wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
% >>In article <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
% >>>And then in <15MAR199222515665@vax.cc.williams.edu>, 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
% >>>% In article <92075.161912U37460@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
% >>>% >In article <1992Mar15.075333.9278@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca
% >>>% >(Tom Hamill) says:
% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
% >>>% >>>>>
% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
% >>>% >>>>>
% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
% >>>% >>>>>
% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
% I drove off a west end cliff
I rode to arrest a lift.
:-D
--
David Gundlach david@marie.stat.uga.edu
System Support and Integration david@rolf.stat.uga.edu
UGA Statistics david@castor.cs.uga.edu
University of Georgia david@groucho.dev.uga.edu
404/542-3289 or 404/542-5232 BITNET: statuga@uga
"I think, therefore I am wrong." -- me
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From: wreck@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com (R. Cage)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space
Subject: Re: Mars and Venus (The problems associated with terraforming)
Summary: Moving CO2 from Venus might be a good idea.
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.173750.24169@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 17:37:50 GMT
References: <pgf.700504292@nasa15.usl.edu> <1992Mar16.211230.5352@regina.cs.uregina.ca> <1992Mar17.132153.1@cc.newcastle.edu.au>
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In article <1992Mar17.132153.1@cc.newcastle.edu.au> c8929469@cc.newcastle.edu.au (stu) writes:
>Long and arduous process, it would be more effective to work out some sort of
>common chemical reaction to convert the atmosphere on-site.
The biggest problem I can see with this is that conversion on-site
would leave a large amount of reduced material just waiting to snarf
up whatever oxygen you freed, or lime to re-create carbonates from
freed CO2, or minerals eagerly waiting to re-hydrate. Fresh material
shipped in (esp. free oxygen) will not have so many ready-made
sinks to eat it as creation on-site would.
>> I recently read an article about verious terraforming methods that could
>> be used on Mars, such as generating CFCs to produce a greenhouse effect to
>> raise the temperature, extracting oxygen from the SO2 in the rocks, how
>> much nitrogen would be needed as a buffer to prevent oxygen toxicity...
CFC's are a pretty good idea. They plug different holes in the
greenhouse blanket than CO2 does. Fluorocarbons might be even better,
if they are more stable, and they will allow the formation of an ozone
layer for UV protection.
>That would have to be one tough balloon to withstand the near vaccum of space
>without rupturing, It might be better to use pressurised cylinders (very big
>ones mind you) the siphon Idea sounds like a good one.
If you are shipping CO2 you don't need a balloon at all. It can
be frozen as dry ice and shipped behind a sunshade. The problem
is not shipping, it is the enormous scale of the task.
>Mars however isn't such a problem, its the atmospheric pressure. Due to the
>small size of mars, the atmosphere would have to be more highly concentrated
>per cubic kilometer than earths to achieve a similar air pressure reading to
>that of earth. It would be like a very high altitude earth!
No, you just need to pile about 2.5 times more of it on top to
get the same surface-level pressure. That will help create a
better greenhouse.
It is rather unlikely that we will try terraforming Mars for
anything except fun; by the time we will be able to do it, we
will be able to do so many other things for living space that
we won't bother with making over dead planets for that purpose.
>stu :)
--
Russ Cage wreck@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com russ%rsi@sharkey.cc.umich.edu
* When Ford pays me for my opinions, THEN they can call them theirs. *
_Bad_ cop. No donut.
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From: baker4@husc8.harvard.edu (David Baker)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Message-ID: <BAKER4.92Mar17124406@husc8.harvard.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:44:06 GMT
References: <1992Mar10.004708.1434@tc.fluke.COM>
<29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu><BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu><29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Organization: Non-Sequitur Association of America. Pizza.
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In-reply-to: cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu's message of 16 Mar 92 16:49:27 GMT
In article <29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
In article <BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu> baker4@husc10.harvard.edu (David Baker) writes:
>In article <29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
>
> Your own god loves you; my personal goddess loves
> me. Through this convincing that something out there loves us no matter
> what, hopefully things will improve.
>
>I have a question, admittedly somewhat off the topic: why does "this
>convincing" need to take place in order for anything to happen?
>
>Just asking.
>David
I suppose it's the typical old saw that if you don't love yourself or
think you're worthy of love, then it's hard for you to act in a loving
way toward other people and things. We have to be comvinced as a group
that we are worth the effort it would take to make things better.
Regards and blessings,
Janis C.
P.S.: What the HELL was your .sig?
OK, granted that it is psychologically important to feel loved, why is it
necessary to construct (believe in, whatever) some extra-material being to do
the loving?
David
--
======================================+=======================================+
-+------ -+------ -+------ : baker4@husc.harvard.edu is my name; :
| \ | \ | \ : jumping up and down and counting :
| | | | | | : backwards from 87,000,002 to -3 is :
| | | / | / : my game. :
| | +------ +------ : :
| | | | \ : brought to you by the Non-Sequitur :
| | | | | : Association of America :
| / | | / : -- We may not make sense, -- :
-+------ - -+------ : -- but we like pizza. -- :
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From: abbey1@husc9.harvard.edu (Joshua Abbey)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.132457.9944@husc3.harvard.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:24:55 GMT
References: <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu>
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In article <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>In article <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>, wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>>In article <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>>>And then in <15MAR199222515665@vax.cc.williams.edu>, 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>>>% In article <92075.161912U37460@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>>>% >In article <1992Mar15.075333.9278@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca
>>>% >(Tom Hamill) says:
>>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>>>% >>>>>
>>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>>>% >>>>>
>>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>>>% >>>>>
>>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>>I shot a wet teen babe.
>Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
I saw a rasp tend a skiff!
-Josh
--
==)-------------- abbey1@husc9.harvard.edu (Josh Abbey)
"Ashes and diamonds, foe and friend,
We were all equal in the end." - Pink Floyd
--------------(==
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!netcomsv!mork!sheaffer
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <pa9hy_jsheaffer@netcom.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:54:05 GMT
References: <9203121915.AA11631@echidna.swdc.stratus.com> <!_5hhysheaffer@netcom.com> <1992Mar16.202028.17443@bilver.uucp>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
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In article <1992Mar16.202028.17443@bilver.uucp> dona@bilver.uucp (Don Allen) writes:
>In article <!_5hhysheaffer@netcom.com> sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>>>
>>Eduard "Billy" Meier of Switzerland is the perpetrator of the notorious
>>"UFOs from the Pleiades" hoax.
>
>So tell us oh learned and wise Govt agent Shaeffer..just HOW did Billy "hoax"
>the Pleiadian craft?
>
With his camera, dear Liza, dear Liza, dear Liza, with
his camera dear Liza, dear Liza, dear Liza, with his camera.
By the way, please let my Govt. handlers know what an effective
job I'm doing. I need a raise!
>>
>>
>>
>>"Semjase" is the name of Meier's extraterrestrial girlfriend.
>>
>
>Correction oh wise and learned sage of the would-be NSA boot-licker set..
>
>Semjase=Pleiadian female
>Semjasa=her FATHER
>
I guess I just can't tell my extraterrestrials without a scorecard.
(If Semjase is the father of the white race, which Pleiadean is
the father of the blacks?)
>
>
>> Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
>>
>> Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
>>
>> "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
>> - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
>
>Is this .sig PC? was it approved by your "handlers"?
You do not have clearance to receive that information.
>-* Don Allen *- // Only | Are you ready for SETI?
>Internet: dona@bilver.uucp \X/ Amiga | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
>UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona | The *real* "October Surprise"
>Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
--
Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
"The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
- Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!netcomsv!mork!sheaffer
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <sa9h-mjsheaffer@netcom.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:57:20 GMT
References: <!_5hhysheaffer@netcom.com> <1992Mar16.202028.17443@bilver.uucp> <312@beyonet.UUCP>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
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In article <312@beyonet.UUCP> beyo@beyonet.UUCP (Steve Urich) writes:
>
>?>So tell us oh learned and wise Govt agent Shaeffer..just HOW did Billy "hoax"
>?>the Pleiadian craft?
>
> Thats what I would like to know... All these so called professional
>video technowizards with there whinning about being a hoax. Proof it!
>I know! Billy is really `The Lawnmower Man' and he did it all in Virtual
>Reality. :-))) Really!!! Its all `Virtual Reality' on Film. Mind over matter
>thats why you couldn't see any fishing line :-).
>
Somebody posted this here recently. It may answer your question.
Article 4808 of alt.alien.visitors:
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From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Eduard "billy" Meier - Photo Evidence
Message-ID: <115886.29BA7913@paranet.FIDONET.ORG>
Date: 8 Mar 92 19:00:00 GMT
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* Forwarded from "ParaNet General Echo"
* Originally from Vladimir Godic
* Originally dated 03-07-92 13:40
In 1981, the late Frank Gillespie wrote the following review of "UFO
....Contact from the Pleiades." In light of recent Paranet discussions on this
very outdated subject, I will repeat Frank's article here. Before doing so, I
would like to point out that Frank Gillespie was a scientist with the
Commonwealth Scientific & Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO). Being a
photographic expert, Frank was, for many years, a scientific advisor to
Australian UFO groups.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 1:
"UFO...CONTACT FROM THE PLEIADES Vol.1"
The presentation of this UFO contactee story is quite different from any of its
predecessors. The backbone of the book is a series of twenty two flying saucer
photographs, supported by a rather sketchy and disjointed text; and padded out
by personal photographs, snatches of cosmonaut and other philosophy, and seven
pages invoking tenuous connections with the pyramids, the parthenon, and
verious other ancient structures. There are also some visually impressive
computer generated images, for which the interpretations may or may not have
been quoted correctly. The credit for the preparation and publishing of this
book is shared by a team of nine indivduals and four companies; but all of the
flying saucer photographs are attributed to Eduard "Billy" Meier, a
farmer/caretaker of Inwel, Switzerland.
A connected series of photographs such as this can be likened to a chain, where
the failure of a single link distrupts the entire chain. Rather ironically, the
very first photograph in the book is the one in which evidence of fakery can be
most clearly seen, so that detectable discrepancies in later photographs only
go to confirm that a superimposition technique such as front projection has
undoubtedly been used. The first picture, which is reproduced again precisely
half way through the book, is one of a series supposedly taken just before
sunset on 29th March, 1976. It has the appearance of a scene largely in
shadow, but lit from the right by a reddish sun, which also flashes brightly
off the upper section of the spacecraft. However, this apparent illumination
terminates abruptly along the line of the distant hilltops, along with the
transition from pale blue sky to brownish hills. Close examination reveals
that this appearance of sunshine has been achieved by displacing the magenta
and yellow colour image laterally from the cyan and black, thus generating an
orange flash on one side of the tree limbs. The effect of this technique is
apparent only where the background is lacking in magenta and yellow - in this
case, the sky. The question arises, was this the result of poor printing
technique, or was it deliberately done, either before or after the picture
reached the hands of the printers? Consider the evidence; that the only
pictures in the book which have this defect to any serious extent are the ones
in this particular series, that the extent of the defect is far beyond what any
reputable colour reprodcer would allow, and that the effect of the
misregistration is so pronounced that it could not possibly have been missed.
As to who was responsible for the fakery, the buck appears to stop at the
colour reproducers, because in the second printing of this picture, the colour
displacement has been done in the wrong direction, and the trees appear to be
sunlit from the left. The printers would have used the blocks as received, on
equipment which automatically preserved the registration of the four colours.
It would be tedious to go through all the individual discrepancies in the
various pictures, particularly as the book pages are not numbered for
reference. Suffice to say that the faults to look for come into the following
categories:
1. Lighting direction discrepancies between the background and the spacecraft.
2. Overcast sky and flatly lit ground scene, with a brightly lit craft.
3. Correct exposure for the craft, when the scene is badly underexposed.
4. Craft in better focus than any part of the scene.
5. Lack of ground shadow cast by the craft.
6. Inconsistent lighting between shots supposedly taken at the same time.
7. No signs of life in any of the UFO pictures.
The first five of these faults all indicate that a superimposition technique
has been used, probably involving models for the spacecraft. Confirmatory
evidence comes from the last saucer picture in the book, where the painted on
"portholes" are fairly obvious. The most likely technique used for the
superimposition is front projection, which is widely used in the United States
today. With this technique, you can have your wedding day photographs taken in
front of the Salt Lake Tabernacle, even though the ceremony took place in a
Brooklyn registry office. The technique is virtually undetectable, except when
mistakes are made, such as those listed above.
The text of this book is also not immune to criticism. The claim is made, for
instance, that the focussing of the camera used for all the saucer stills was
jammed just short of infinity. This is just the setting which would be used to
obtain maximum clarity in a landscape photograph, so it becomes a rather hollow
excuse for the poor focussing evident in many of the pictures. The captions of
the two micrograph pictures are nonsensical - all metals have adequate
conductivity for scanning electron microscopy, but the specimen in the picture
exhibits signs of poor conductivity, suggesting an improperly prepared
nonmetallic object; and the machining in the other micrograph is not only very
poor, but it appears to have been done by an unsuitable technique. It is
repeatedly claimed that an abundance of pictures are available for publication,
which makes it hard to understand why five of them have been printed twice, for
no good reason. Looking at the drawings of the various craft, one would expect
from their clarity and detail, that they would be accurate. This appears to be
so for type 5 craft, and for type 2 other than the one in the movie sequence,
but it is definitely not the case for the remaining variations. The claims
made for the movie segment deserve some attention. Ask any film producer, and
he will tell you that these are all standard effects with a tripod mounted
camera, involving only simply stop/start and time-lapse techniques.
Continuing in part 2....
--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
Article 4809 of alt.alien.visitors:
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From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Eduard 'billy' Meier
Message-ID: <115887.29BA7916@paranet.FIDONET.ORG>
Date: 8 Mar 92 19:00:00 GMT
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* Forwarded from "ParaNet General Echo"
* Originally from Vladimir Godic
* Originally dated 03-07-92 14:14
Part 2:
The scientific investigation is one aspect of this book which worries me. Apart
from acknowledging the part played by De Anza Systems Inc., the book does not
name any of the persons involved; but one would expect an honourable scientist
to revoke any abuse of his professional status. I can only conclude,
therefore, that some, at least, of my colleagues, have allowed themselves to be
so blinded by state-of-the-art technology, that they cannot see how easy it is
to cheat such a system. Relying entirely on a computer for UFO photograph
analysis is like staking your reputation on the computer beating all comers at
chess. Anyone knowing or guessing the factors on which the computer
calculations are based, can devise techniques to force incorrect analyses from
the comptuer. For example, distance and size assessment are both based on edge
sharpness data, which can be readily manipulated to give any desired result
during a superimposition. Regarding the metal, biological and mineral
specimens left by the cosmonauts, there is a technique called isotope analysis
now available, which will determine with absolute certainty whether a material
is of extraterrestrial origin. There are many places where it can be carried
out; and some of these must be known to the American scientists allegedly
involved in the investigation. Significantly, no mention is made of this
technique being used.
This scientific aspect is so important, that, at the risk of boring layman
readers, I will deal specifically with some of the misconceptions which appear
in the book. Electron microscopy always sounds impressive, but it would be
hard to conceive of a greater exercise in futility than using it on colour film
images. A scanning microscope would show only the topography of the emulsion
surface, wheras in a transmission microscope, the dye materials of the image
would be indistinguishable from the gelatin medium. Three dimensionality can
be detected with reasonable certainty from an original photograph, taken under
known conditions. However, UFOs have frequently been assessed as three
dimensional from analysis of copied photographs, which are, by definition,
photographs of photographs having only two effective dimensions. Alternatively,
skillful artists routinely transfer attributes of three dimensionality to
canvas, sufficient to fool any computer analysis. In colour film, the image is
composed of three dyes, each of which is visible to the eye. There is no other
material present with which any invisible image could be formed; and to suggest
that some mysterious radiation produced such an image is surely ridiculous.
Similarly, it is foolhardy to suggest that any wire or thread supporting a
model must show up with computer enhancement. A 300mm diameter foam plastic
model, for instance, could easily be supported by a single fibre from a nylon
stocking, which, at 2 metres from the camera, would be well beyond the
resolving power of its optical system. A general characteristic of film grains
is that they overlap - it is only thus that a true black image can be built up.
This is especially true of colour film, where each of the tree emulsions has
to be capable of developing as a solid colour. Another characteristic of film
grains is that once they are developed, there is no way to tell how or when
they were exposed; hence film grain analysis gives no information about the use
of multiple exposures, or of most darkroom techniques. In conclusion computer
techniques have their place, but they cannot substitute entirely for careful
visual examination of any UFO photograph.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The above article which appeared in the `UFO Research Australia Newsletter,"
Vol.2 No.1, Jan-Feb 1981, is one of many written at the time. Other
individuals and organisations wrote expose as well, so the above is not an
isolated critique. I reproduce Frank Gillespie's article here in an attempt to
show those who have only been subjected to pro Billy Meier arguments that
scientific evaluations revealed a very different story.
I think it a shame that time is wasted on cut and dried hoaxes when there is so
much that is presently unexplained and far more deserving of our time and
attention.
In closing, I would like to state that the above ends my participation in the
Billy Meier farce. I will not enter into any further discussions, I value my
time far too much to debate proven hoaxes.
--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
Article 21850 of sci.skeptic:
Path: mork!netcomsv!decwrl!mips!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!linac!att!ucbvax!stratus.swdc.stratus.com!lpb
From: lpb@stratus.swdc.stratus.com (Len Bucuvalas x5363)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <9203121921.AA11699@echidna.swdc.stratus.com>
Date: 12 Mar 92 19:21:58 GMT
Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
Lines: 293
I was sent this by a friend to post. I find it challanging and believeable
in light of how the bible has been edited over the years from the original as
written by the apostles.....you decide...the following is a short excerpt
of selected sections.
Perhaps this should also go to the archeology and anthropology groups???
Len
=========================================================================
The Talmud of Jmmanuel
-------
First translation of the Aramaic script written by Judas Iscariot, the
disciple of Jmmanuel (Jesus), discovered in 1963 in the burial cave of
Jmmanuel.
The Clear Translation in English and German.
Translated into German by Isa Rashid and Eduard Meier, and translated into
English by Julie Ziegler and B. L. Greene.
-------
Dedicated to the man known to many as Jesus, known herein as Jmmanuel,
in the hope that the truths that he shared may be heard clearly today.
-------
Copyright 1992 Wild Flower Press Box 230893 Tigard, OR 97224
800/366-0264.
-------
Selected Portions to Raise Your Consciousness:
-------
6:10 "Be aware also, that through this sacred thing the almighty power of the
spirit always dwells within yourself.
6:11 "Therefore pray as one who knows, and thus pray as follows:
6:12 "'My spirit, you are omnipotent.
6:13 "'Your name be holy.
6:14 "'Let your kingdom incarnate itself in me.
6:15 "'Let your power unfold itself within me, on Earth and in the heavens.
6:16 "'Give me today my daily bread, so that I recognize my guilt and the
truth.
6:17 "'And lead me not into temptation and confusion, but deliver me from
error.
6:18 "'For yours is the kingdom within me and the power and the knowledge
forever. Amen.'
6:19 "When you pray to your spirit, it will give you what you request; trust
with knowledge, and you will receive.
6:20 "However, if you believe in the false teachings that the power and
spirit do not dwell within you, then you will be without knowledge and will
live in spiritual poverty.
6:21 "Though you will also receive now and then what you in your false belief
request from misused sacred things, idols and gods, you will receive only out
of your strong false belief, without knowledge of the real truth.
6:22 "Truly, I say to you: Blessed are only those who serve the actual truth
and knowledge, because only they receive in honesty.
-----
1:1 This is the book and mystery of Jmmanuel, which means "the one with
godly knowledge," who is a son of Joseph, of Jacob, the distant descendant of
David, who was a descendant of Abraham, whose lineage traces back to Adam, the
father of one of Earth's human races, who was begotten by Semjasa, the leader
of the celestial sons who were the guardian angels of god, the great ruler of
the distant travelers.
1:2 Semjasa, the celestial son and guardian angel of god, the great ruler of
the distant travelers who traversed the expanse of the universe, together with
a terrestrial woman, begot Adam, the father of the white human race.
1:3 Adam took for himself an earth wife and begot Seth.
1:4 Seth begot Enos.
1:80 Jacob begot Joseph.
-----
3:26 As John the Baptist thus spoke, behold, Jmmanuel of Galilee then came to
him at the Jordan, to be baptized by him.
3:27 John, however, refused him and spoke, "I certainly need to be baptized
by you, because you possess greater knowledge than I, and you come to me?"
3:28 But Jmmanuel answered him, "Let it happen so now, because it is fitting
for us to fulfill all justice, since we are both sons of the earth."
3:29 So John consented and baptized him.
3:30 When Jmmanuel had been baptized, he soon came out of the water of the
Jordan, and behold, a metallic light dropped from the sky and descended
steeply over the Jordan.
3:31 Consequently they all fell on their faces and pressed them into the sand
while a voice from the metallic light spoke,
3:32 "This is my beloved son with whom I am well pleased. He will be the king
of truth who will lift this human race to knowledge."
3:33 Behold, after these words Jmmanuel entered into the metallic light,
which climbed into the sky, surrounded by fire and smoke, and passed over the
lifeless sea, as the singing of the metallic light soon faded away.
3:34 After that, Jmmanuel was no longer seen for forty days and nights.
-----
4:46 "In the name of god the law was issued to create you so that you may
serve as prophet and pioneer of wisdom for these human races.
4:47 "Fulfill your mission unperturbed in the face of irrationality,
disbelieving people and false teachings of the scribes and Pharisees.
4:48 "Hence, following the fulfillment of your mission, centuries and two
millennia will pass before the truth of your knowledge brought among the
people will be recognized and disseminated by some humans.
4:49 "Not until the time of space-traveling machines will the truth break
through and gradually shake the false teaching that you are the son of god or
Creation.
4:50 "However, this will be the time when we celestial sons begin to reveal
ourselves anew to the human races, since they will have become knowing and
with their acquired power threaten the structure of the heavens."
4:51 Thus they spoke, the celestial sons between the North and the West,
before they took Jmmanuel in the metallic light back to Israel, to the land of
Galilee.
-----
12:19 "Truly, truly, I say to you: These laws of order were given by nature
and should be followed, or human beings will bring death to themselves and to
the masses.
12:20 "This earth can nourish and support five hundred million people of all
the human races. But if these laws are not followed, in two thousand years ten
times five hundred million people will exist, and the earth will not be able
to support them any more.
12:21 "Famines, catastrophes, world wars and epidemics will control the earth,
and the human races will commit suicide, with only a few surviving.
12:22 "Truly, I say to you: There will be wailing and chattering of teeth when
so much human blood is shed upon the sands of the earth that new life forms
will arise from it, which will bring the final horror to mankind.
12:23 "But on this day you have been allowed to receive all good things, and
the laws have been given to you by which you should live.
12:24 "And you should adhere to additional laws, so that you will have
prosperity on earth and peace in your families.
12:25 "Do away with the enforcement of the old law that woman should be
subject to man, since she is a person like a man, with equal rights and
obligations.
-----
25:36 "When at that point someone will say to the people, 'Behold, here is
Jmmanuel, who is the sign of the time,' they should not accept it to be true.
25:37 "Because many a false Jmmanuel and many impostors and false prophets
will rise and do great signs, it becomes possible to lead astray not only
those who seek, believe and err, but also the scholars and intelligent people.
25:38 "Behold, I told you so before, and so it will fulfill itself.
25:39 "Therefore, when impostors and those led astray will say, 'He is in the
desert,' people shall not go there, and when they say, 'Truly, he is in a
chamber,' they shall not accept it as the truth.
25:40 "Since I will certainly return at that time, I will let them recognize
me.
25:41 "This is how the law and destiny want it, and that's the way it will be.
25:42 "Just as lightning starts from its rise and radiates until its setting,
so will be my coming in the future, when I bring the teaching anew and
announce the legions of the celestial sons, when I will have a renewed life
and will again be accused of deception and blasphemy over the breadth of the
world, until the teaching of truth will bring about insight and change in
people.
25:43 "People of all times, beware: where the carcass is, there the vultures
will gather, so watch out.
25:44 "Soon after the grief of that time, sun and moon will lose their luster,
comets will fall from the sky and the powers of the heavens will start to
sway.
25:45 "The structure of the heavens and of the air will be disturbed, and the
land will burn because of the black oil of the earth, ignited by the greed of
the people, and the sky will be dark because of smoke and fire, and so the
weather will break down, and severe cold and many deaths among people, plants
and animals all over the earth will result from people's power senselessly
developed, and people will live with their greed for power and mania and vice.
25:46 "Then there will appear signs in the sky, and all races on earth will
cry and come to see the signs in the clouds of the sky that witness of great
power and strict judgments against irrationality.
25:47 "Since god is the ruler over three human races, the laws and
commandments of Creation will be valid in all eternity through which, as
representation of Creation and human irrationality, people will judge
themselves with anger.
25:48 "People owe their existence to god, who is the ruler over them, so that
they have to follow his commandments and respect him as the greatest king of
wisdom.
25:49 "He will send his guardian angels with loud trumpets that will gather
his followers from all directions, from one end of the earth to the other.
25:50 "Do learn a parable from the fig tree; when its branch puts forth
leaves, you know that summer is near.
25:51 "So it will also be at that time when the people see all of this, they
will know that the end is close at hand.
25:52 "Truly, truly, I say to you: This is how it will be.
25:53 "This human race will not perish until all of this has come about.
25:54 "The heavens and the earth will pass, and so will the universe; but my
words will not pass, because they are words of truth within the laws of
Creation.
25:55 "No one knows the day or hour when all this will happen, neither the
guardian angels, nor god himself, nor I, Jmmanuel, but only providence and
destiny through the laws and commandments of Creation, which possesses the
greatest wisdom.
25:56 "Creation alone rises far above all human races, and it alone deserves
honor and praise, just as it renders honor and praise to the absolute power
above it.
25:57 "If people revere and honor god and recognize only Creation as the
supreme power, they act according to the truth."
-----
27:27 "While we are here together, Juda Ihariot, the son of the Pharisee in
Jerusalem, is hatching a plot against me as to how he can betray me to the
chief priests.
27:28 "While we are gathered here, he is asking the chief priests for the
blood money that they offer for my capture.
27:29 "Thirty pieces of silver are offered to him if they catch me through his
help.
27:30 "While they are forging this plan, they are also hatching the plot
against one among you, since they want to present a culprit to the people.
27:31 "Thus Juda Ihariot, the son of the Pharisee, will turn me over to the
soldiers, and my disciple, Judas Iscariot, is supposed to be considered the
traitor,
27:32 "so that the people will say, 'Behold, these confused people are divided
among themselves and therefore one betrays the other. So, how can the teaching
of Jmmanuel be the truth?'
27:33 "But since Juda Ihariot, the son of the Pharisee, and my disciple, Judas
Iscariot, have almost identical names, the lie of the chief priests will be
accepted from the beginning."
-----
36:29 "Truly, I say to you: Those who understand the truth of this speech and
attain understanding in wisdom are obliged to align their lives with their
destiny of eternal change towards Creation.
36:30 "When people are honest and search, they will not know any preconceived
opinion or prejudice.
36:31 "But the wise know and are aware of the law of the everlasting river of
eternal change; therefore they endeavor to adjust to the great course of
happenings, because they recognize the laws of Creation, that the cycles of
life have to be closed through the determinations of the laws.
36:32 "Wherever life reveals itself, it is based upon the law of the invisible
secret that brings about the eternal change.
36:33 "Whoever disregards and fails to recognize timeless and imperishable
laws and truths will have to suffer evil consequences.
36:34 "Lies and hatred will blind such a person and even entire peoples, and
they will rush into the abyss of their own destruction.
36:35 "A blind, destructive mania will come over them, and the heroes among
them will be the greatest destroyers.
36:36 "Discord will permeate people's entire lives, and there is no longer a
unity or perfection when there is a split.
36:37 "As long as there is imperfection in life, people will have to bear
these consequences: sickness, misery, injustice, need, fighting, strife,
slavery, false sects and exploitation leading to bloodshed and death.
36:38 "So let the human beware and wake up, because the laws of Creation say
that only that which is timeless and everlasting is of permanence, truth and
wisdom, and so it is."
-----
Copyright 1992 Wild Flower Press Box 230893 Tigard, OR 97224
800/366-0264.
-----
These are only a few selections from:
THE TALMUD OF JMMANUEL
First translation of the Aramaic script written by Judas Iscariot, the
disciple of Jmmanuel (Jesus), discovered in 1963 in the burial cave of
Jmmanuel.
The Clear Translation in English and German.
Translated into German by Isa Rashid and Eduard Meier, and translated into
English by Julie Ziegler and B. L. Greene.
ISBN 0-926524-12-7.
Library of Congress Catalog Cd. No. 90-34240, First Edition: 1992.
-------
Available from the publisher:
Wild Flower Press
P.O. Box 230893
Tigard, OR 97224
(800) 366-0264
$15.95 + $2.50 S/H = $18.45.
*******
----- End Included Message -----
----- End Included Message -----
Article 21857 of sci.skeptic:
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Path: mork!sheaffer
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Subject: Re: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <zj4hl0nsheaffer@netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 92 23:09:03 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
References: <9203121921.AA11699@echidna.swdc.stratus.com>
In article <9203121921.AA11699@echidna.swdc.stratus.com> lpb@stratus.swdc.stratus.com (Len Bucuvalas x5363) writes:
>I was sent this by a friend to post. I find it challanging and believeable
>
>=========================================================================
>
>
>The Talmud of Jmmanuel
>
>-------
>
>First translation of the Aramaic script written by Judas Iscariot, the
>disciple of Jmmanuel (Jesus), discovered in 1963 in the burial cave of
>Jmmanuel.
>
>The Clear Translation in English and German.
>
>Translated into German by Isa Rashid and Eduard Meier, and translated into
^^^^^^^^^^^^
>English by Julie Ziegler and B. L. Greene.
>
I am wondering if this is the same Eduard "Billy" Meier of Switzerland
who has given us the hokey UFO photos that have come to be known as
the "UFO Contact from the Pleiades"??
--
Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
"The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
- Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
--
Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
"The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
- Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!cunews!wcstom
From: wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>
Date: 17 Mar 92 19:46:14 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Sender: tom hamill
Followup-To: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada
Lines: 42
Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2351 alt.religion.kibology:1208 alt.sex:58949 alt.alien.visitors:4928
In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
>% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
>% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
>% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
>% I drove off a west end cliff
>I rode to arrest a lift.
Electrodes tie my wrists.
---tom
l~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~l
l CRUSH---CompassionRespectUnderstandingSelfHonesty---CRUSH l
l How could you have ever lived your life without it? l
l Join Now, Apply Within. Spread the word. l
l_________________________ ---me, trying to save the world, l
l wcstom@ccs.carleton.ca l from itself. l
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!network.ucsd.edu!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!cc.usu.edu!sl7sg
From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space
Subject: Re: Mars needs oxygen, Venus has too much.
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.131249.53768@cc.usu.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 19:12:49 GMT
References: <xr6fbmh1@cck.coventry.ac.uk> <203309@unix.cis.pitt.edu> <1992Mar13.120732.23793@tcom.stc.co.uk> <pgf.700504292@nasa15.usl.edu> <1992Mar16.211230.5352@regina.cs.uregina.ca>
Organization: Utah State University
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4929 sci.space:27997
In article <1992Mar16.211230.5352@regina.cs.uregina.ca>, bayko@hercules.cs.uregina.ca (john bayko) writes:
> In orbit around Venus, a
> hose with an atmospheric scoop on the end could pump atmosphere into the
> balloon, until the balloon were pressurised enough.
MEGAMAID !!! (Space Balls)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!warwick!mrccrc!icdoc!sot-ecs!co90
From: co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: UFOs
Message-ID: <11136@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Mar 92 16:23:03 GMT
References: <ccm9gB1w164w@qed.cts.com>
Sender: news@ecs.soton.ac.uk
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Nntp-Posting-Host: carew
In <ccm9gB1w164w@qed.cts.com> analogki@qed.cts.com (Jeff Robertson) writes:
>
>Now, I know the Bible mentions only Earth as being blessed with life, but it
>never once EXCLUDED the existance of life elsewhere...so, I'm not too quick
>to discount anyone's UFO experience based on this.
Well, just as a matter of interest, there are 4 words in the Bible relating to extra-terrestrial life or lack of
and these 4 words (pretty difficult to find 4 words in something that has over 65,000) are.....
God of many worlds
Hope that this refutes what the guy says and anyway, I don't recall that the bible says that we are the only
planet blessed with life either. If it does then I apologise for my ignorance.
Cads ----------------> If they aren't out there then who's watching us, huh?
co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!warwick!mrccrc!icdoc!sot-ecs!co90
From: co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Q&A on Extraterrestrial Abductions and Visitations
Keywords: Crap
Message-ID: <11137@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Mar 92 16:33:07 GMT
References: <1992Mar9.122451.10847@beaver.cs.washington.edu> <1992Mar16.162723.26408@pellns.alleg.edu>
Sender: news@ecs.soton.ac.uk
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Nntp-Posting-Host: carew
In <1992Mar16.162723.26408@pellns.alleg.edu> boltj@reis53.alleg.edu (Jennifer Bolt) writes:
>Wake up, The universe is to big, and the distances to great for aliens to
>travel back and forth, that is from the Earth back to where ever. So no
>aliens have probably come to Earth, although it is almost definite that
>life must exist elsewhere. And as for channeling, lets not drag mystical
>make believe into the endeavors of science. Maybe some aliens have come
>here, but why or how we may never know, but do you really expect people to
>believe some mystical entity is communicating with you ? Who are you
>Buckaroo Bonzi
Firstly if as we suspect from various reliable sources (try anyone who works at Hangar 18 and site S-4 in Nevada
and anyone who is in department DI55 in England) that aliens are using advanced technology then the distances
aren't too big.
Secondly I think that you mean Buckaroo Banzai (not Bonzi)
Cads (co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk) ---------------> If they aren't out there then who keeps spilling the cat's milk ??
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!warwick!mrccrc!icdoc!sot-ecs!co90
From: co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: ? Majestic Twelve ?
Message-ID: <11140@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Mar 92 16:50:16 GMT
References: <1992Mar13.043523.18992@spdcc.com> <92073.121819GHADSAL@auvm.american.edu> <1992Mar14.043415.16579@cbnewsd.att.com> <1992Mar16.001111.942@cabot.balltown.cma.COM>
Sender: news@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Lines: 9
Nntp-Posting-Host: carew
In <1992Mar16.001111.942@cabot.balltown.cma.COM> connolly@cabot.balltown.cma.COM (C. Ian Connolly) writes:
>In article <1992Mar14.043415.16579@cbnewsd.att.com> press2@cbnewsd.att.com (barry.o.olson) writes:
>>You must mean the MJ twelve. these guys are actual descendants of the
>>star people from the planet Marij-juana from the horsehead galaxy.
>No, no - you're thinking of the "Hosehead Nebula"
No. I think you mean HORSEhead (unless the Hosehead Nebula looks like some gardening implement)_
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!orion.oac.uci.edu!hepxvt.ps.uci.edu!cortese
From: cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Keywords: Peace Clock
Message-ID: <29C66295.13101@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:20:21 GMT
References: <1992Mar10.004708.1434@tc.fluke.COM> <29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu> <1992Mar16.224926.5133@tc.fluke.COM>
Organization: University of California, Irvine
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Nntp-Posting-Host: hepxvt.ps.uci.edu
In article <1992Mar16.224926.5133@tc.fluke.COM> emery@tc.fluke.COM (John Emery) writes:
>I wrote:
>
>>>Before world peace is even possible, should not the issue of lack of
>>>peace in the individual be addressed? Lack of peace stems in the
>>>heart of individuals and manifests to those around. The introspective
>>>question I see at hand is for the individual: how do I find peace?
>
>Janis Cortese writes:
>
>>You find peace whatever way that works best for you. I may find peace
>>through a different means.
>
>It has been the only way I have found peace. I would say, Janis, not that
>I choose this way because it worked best. Rather, Jesus reached out to
>me drew me to Himself. Even though I resisted, He gently reminded me that
>He loved me and had all I needed. When I finally surrendered to Him, His
>peace simply followed.
>
>>>Amongst the waring that goes on in my soul, I have found where my source
>>>of peace comes from. I would invite one to investigate Romans 5:1 and
>>>Ephesians 2:14 in the Holy Bible.
>>
>>I won't get into this. All I *will* say is that the Bible also says
>>that I am in subjugation to men. How can I find peace in a book that
>>says such things about me?
>
>Please share what you are referring to, Janis.
Oh, how about "In pain shall you bring forth children. You shall remain
in subjugation to your husband all your life, but your wishes shall be
for him."
How about when Lot sent his two virgin daughters out into a ravening mob
of men so they would stop beating down his door?
How about "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live?"
How about "And the men of the city shall stone her with stones?"
If you can't come up with examples of blatant misogyny on your own
from the Bible, I can only conclude that you never read it.
>
>
>>There certainly is. Your own god loves you; my personal goddess loves
>>me. Through this convincing that something out there loves us no matter
>>what, hopefully things will improve.
>>
>>We will, however, have to make our own peace. There is no book or deity
>>out there that will make things all better with a wave of a magic wand.
>>WE have to do it -- all of it. So let's roll up our sleeves and get to
>>work, people.
>
>Janis, if your personal goddess loves you, why doesn't this goddess give
>you peace? And how do you serve this goddess to show your love?
Because peace comes from inside. There isn't some deity out there like
a security blanket who can make everything all better. It's my
responsibility to find my peace; my goddess only shows me the way. She
won't do the work for me. She's not a tranquilizer, or a little fairy
tale that says, " . . . and they lived happily ever after." She only
points the direction out; *I* must walk the road. She knows full well
that doing all the work is not healthy for me. Like any mother, she
knows that a child will mature only through making its own mistakes.
She refuses to coddle.
I serve this goddess by being the best person I can be, and being as
understanding as I can, and not hating or being mean. I serve by
creating as many beautiful things as I can -- music, art, hardcrafts --
to improve this world and make it more enriching for others. However,
she doesn't require that I make myself a doormat. My goddess doesn't
want those who love her to be doormats, or surrender to ANYTHING.
>
>Jesus promises to roll up His sleeves and work in our life. That's what
>He's all about. I look back over my life and have found without Him I
>have had a pretty bad track record of bringing myself peace.
>
>>Regards and blessings,
>>Janis C.
>
>Take care,
>
>John
>emery@tc.fluke.COM
I'm sorry you were unable to bring peace to yourself, John. It's a pity
that you had to go outside yourself. If you had had more faith in what
you were capable of, you might have been suprised at what you could
accomplish.
Blessings,
Janis
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!mcs.kent.edu!Condor.mcs.kent.edu!adray
From: adray@Condor.mcs.kent.edu (Adam Dray)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:05:26 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>
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In article <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
|> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
|> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
|> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
|> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
|> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
|> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
|> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
|> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
|> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>>
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
|> >% >>>% >>>>>
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
|> >% >>>% >>>>>
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
|> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
|> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
|> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
|> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
|> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
|> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
|> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
|> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
|> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
|> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
|> >% I drove off a west end cliff
|> >I rode to arrest a lift.
|> Electrodes tie my wrists.
Elephants dive off rats.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!yale.edu!cs.yale.edu!cs.yale.edu!judge-jesse
From: judge-jesse@cs.yale.edu (Jesse Wayne Judge)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.220300.9084@cs.yale.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 22:03:00 GMT
References: <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca> <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>
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Nntp-Posting-Host: minerva.cis.yale.edu
In article <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu> adray@Condor.mcs.kent.edu (Adam Dray) writes:
>In article <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
>|> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>|> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
>|> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>|> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>|> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>|> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>|> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>|> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
>|> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>|> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>|> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>|> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>|> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>|> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>|> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>|> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
>|> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
>|> >% I drove off a west end cliff
>|> >I rode to arrest a lift.
>|> Electrodes tie my wrists.
>Elephants dive off rats.
--
### the Waste Machine ###
### judjesw@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu ###
### judge@minerva.cis.yale.edu ###
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From: pdj7631@zeus.tamu.edu (JONES, PAUL DAVID)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <17MAR199216174758@zeus.tamu.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:17:00 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>
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News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41
`In article <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>, adray@Condor.mcs.kent.edu (Adam Dray) writes...
`>In article <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
`>|> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
`>|> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
`>|> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
`>|> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
`>|> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
`>|> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
`>|> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
`>|> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
`>|> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
`>|> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
`>|> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
`>|> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
`>|> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
`>|> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
`>|> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
`>|> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
`>|> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
`>|> >% I drove off a west end cliff
`>|> >I rode to arrest a lift.
`>|> Electrodes tie my wrists.
`>Elephants dive off rats.
I lift knife, off frats.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!orion.oac.uci.edu!hepxvt.ps.uci.edu!cortese
From: cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Message-ID: <29C67711.20382@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 22:47:46 GMT
References: <BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu> <29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu> <BAKER4.92Mar17124406@husc8.harvard.edu>
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In article <BAKER4.92Mar17124406@husc8.harvard.edu> baker4@husc8.harvard.edu (David Baker) writes:
>In article <29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
>
> In article <BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu> baker4@husc10.harvard.edu (David Baker) writes:
> >In article <29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
> >
> > Your own god loves you; my personal goddess loves
> > me. Through this convincing that something out there loves us no matter
> > what, hopefully things will improve.
> >
> >I have a question, admittedly somewhat off the topic: why does "this
> >convincing" need to take place in order for anything to happen?
> >
> >Just asking.
> >David
>
> I suppose it's the typical old saw that if you don't love yourself or
> think you're worthy of love, then it's hard for you to act in a loving
> way toward other people and things. We have to be comvinced as a group
> that we are worth the effort it would take to make things better.
>
> Regards and blessings,
> Janis C.
>
> P.S.: What the HELL was your .sig?
>
>OK, granted that it is psychologically important to feel loved, why is it
>necessary to construct (believe in, whatever) some extra-material being to do
>the loving?
>
>David
It shouldn't be, and the fact that it IS necessary for a lot of people
bugs me, too. I should have explained my view of what my goddess is.
There does exist a "time line" of sorts in which I will do the best
thing for a particular situation (I understand that this is a vague way
to put it, but lest ye accuse me of not being scieitific, I have a BS in
physics from Penn State, another BS in astronomy fromthe same place, and
a MS in physics from UCI, so I'm aware that I'm not using these terms
strictly). I like the feeling that there exists a way for every
situation to be best resolved, and I find comfort in the fact that I can
do it. My goddess is no extra-material being; I "believe" in and
worship NO ONE.
Many people, however, DO find it important to have some being somewhere
"love" them.
Blessings,
Janis C.
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From: pullen@cs.washington.edu (Walter D. Pullen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal
Subject: XBITMAP: 7 Crop Circle Patterns (128x128)
Summary: Bitmap of modern crop circles and descriptions/interpretations
Keywords: Circles in the fields
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.234903.26833@beaver.cs.washington.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 23:49:03 GMT
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Here's a bitmap of seven various crop circle patterns that have
appeared recently, at least within the last year or so, in various
places. I made this yesterday (while Mercury was going retrograde)
using the Unix bitmap(1) program. If you have X windows, for a cool
looking mystical, meditative root background, extract the text between
the cut-here's and save it to "cropcirc.xbm" or whatever name you
like, and then xsetroot -bitmap on the file.
The four patterns on the left half of the bitmap I got from diagrams
in the 11:11 pamphlet that was going around late last year, the
contents of which have been posted to net a couple of times (including
once by myself :). The 11:11, as many know, was the opening of the
"dimensional" Gateway on 1-11-1992, connecting Earth to the higher
octaves, and the four patterns on the left symbolically depict this,
showing two circles, one normal, and the other highlighted in some way
(larger, with a ring, etc), connected by a pathway. Three of the four
patterns actually have 11's on either side of the line, making an
11:11. The two circles represent Earth and the higher octave,
connected by the 11:11 Doorway.
The three more complex patterns on the right, I got from pictures in
an advertisement for a couple of videotapes on the crop circle
phenomena. I would have to say that the upper two of these three also
represent the 11:11 Activation, but in a higher sense, in that they
are similar to the first four patterns but with an additional circle,
the additional circle probably depicting the Greater Central Sun found
in the higher octaves (since one pattern has the end circle with sun
like lines coming from it, while the other is hollow.) Again, both
pattern have 11's in them - one with 11's on either side of the line,
and the other with just one 11 but with a ring around it. The final
patten in the lower right is the largest and most complex, being in
the shape of connected circles arranged triangularly. No definite
clues to what this one represents, except for perhaps certain trinity
forms in general; considering that this is a crop circle and the
different patterns in each corner, it could be showing the trinity of
planets existing between Earth, a planet called Essassani in Orion,
and a planet near Sirius (See the Bashar material for more on this)
but of course this is mostly speculative. Anyway, enjoy the bitmap!
----BEGIN INCLUDED BITMAP CUT HERE----
#define cropcirc_width 128
#define cropcirc_height 128
static short cropcirc_bits[] = {
0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,
0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xe001,0x0000,
0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xe001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,
0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xf001,0x001f,
0xe001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0xf801,0x003f,0xf001,0x0001,0x0001,
0x0000,0xe001,0x000f,0xfc01,0x007f,0xf801,0x0003,0x8001,0x000f,0xf001,0x001f,
0xfc01,0x007f,0xfc01,0x0007,0xe001,0x003f,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfc01,
0x0007,0xf001,0x007f,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xff81,0x003f,0xf001,0x007f,
0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfc01,0x0007,0xf801,0x00ff,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,
0x00ff,0xfc01,0x0007,0xf801,0x00ff,0xe001,0x000f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xf801,0x0003,
0xf801,0x00ff,0xc001,0x0007,0xfc01,0x007f,0xf001,0x0001,0xf801,0x00ff,0x0001,
0x0000,0xfc01,0x007f,0xe001,0x0000,0xf801,0x00ff,0x0001,0x0001,0xf801,0x003f,
0xe001,0x0000,0xf001,0x007f,0x0001,0x0001,0xf001,0x001f,0xe001,0x0000,0xf001,
0x007f,0x0001,0x0001,0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x0000,0xe001,0x003f,0x0001,0x0001,
0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x0000,0x8001,0x000f,0x0001,0x0001,0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,
0x0000,0x0001,0x0007,0x0001,0x0001,0xcd81,0x0367,0xb801,0x0003,0x0001,0x0007,
0x0001,0x0001,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa601,0x000c,0x0001,0x0007,0x0001,0x0001,0xcd81,
0x0367,0xa181,0x0030,0x0001,0x0007,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xf841,0x0043,
0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa601,0x000c,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,
0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa101,0x0010,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,
0xa001,0x0000,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa001,0x0000,0x5001,
0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xf001,0x0001,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,
0xc001,0x0007,0xf801,0x0003,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xc001,0x0007,0xfc01,
0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xfc01,0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,
0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x000f,0xfc01,0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xf801,
0x003f,0xfc01,0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xde01,0x00f7,0xfc01,0x0007,
0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xc701,0x01c7,0xf801,0x0003,0xc001,0x001f,0xc001,
0x0007,0xc381,0x0387,0xf001,0x0001,0x3001,0x0067,0xc001,0x0007,0xf181,0x031f,
0xa001,0x0000,0x8801,0x008f,0xc001,0x0007,0xf8c1,0x063f,0xf001,0x0001,0xe401,
0x013f,0xe001,0x000f,0xfcc1,0x067f,0xfc01,0x0007,0xf201,0x027f,0xf801,0x003f,
0xfc61,0x0c7f,0xef01,0x001e,0xfa01,0x02ff,0xfc01,0x007f,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe301,
0x0018,0xf901,0x04ff,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe181,0x0030,0xfd01,0x05ff,
0xff01,0x01ff,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe181,0x0030,0xfd01,0x05ff,0xff01,0x01ff,0xfe61,
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0xfd01,0x05ff,0xff81,0x03ff,0xfc61,0x0c7f,0xe4c1,0x0064,0xfd01,0x05ff,0xff81,
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0x0003,0x0401,0x8000,0x0003,0x0040,0xf801,0x003f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0201,0x8000,
0x0003,0x0080,0xf801,0x003f,0x8c61,0x0c63,0x0101,0x4000,0x0005,0x0100,0xf001,
0x001f,0x8c61,0x0c63,0x0081,0x4000,0x0005,0x0200,0xc001,0x0007,0x8c61,0x0c63,
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0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0x3240,0x0499,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,
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0x0941,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xc320,0x0987,0x0000,0x8001,
0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xe290,0x128f,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,
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0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xf130,0x191f,0x0000,0xf801,0x003f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,
0xf110,0x111f,0x0000,0xfc01,0x007f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xee10,0x10ef,0x0000,
0xfc01,0x007f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xc228,0x2887,0x0000,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xc001,
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0x4c60,0x00e0,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xf801,0x003f,0x3061,0x305a,0xb418,0x0398,0xfe01,
0x00ff,0xfc01,0x007f,0x4011,0xc086,0xc207,0x0c04,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfc01,0x007f,
0x8009,0xffff,0xffff,0x1003,0xfc01,0x007f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xc009,0x0600,0x00c0,
0x10c2,0xfc01,0x007f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0x3005,0x1801,0x0030,0x21a0,0xf801,0x003f,
0xfe01,0x00ff,0x0c05,0xe001,0x000f,0x2210,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0x0205,
0x0001,0x0000,0x3398,0xc001,0x0007,0xfe01,0x00ff,0x0005,0x0001,0x0000,0x1008,
0x0001,0x0000,0xfc01,0x007f,0x0005,0x0001,0x0000,0x1008,0x0001,0x0000,0xfc01,
0x007f,0x8009,0x0000,0x0000,0x0810,0x0001,0x0000,0xf801,0x003f,0x8009,0x0000,
0x0000,0x04e0,0x0001,0x0000,0xf001,0x001f,0x4011,0x0000,0x0000,0x0380,0x0001,
0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0x3061,0x0000,0x0000,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,
0x0f81,0x0000,0x0000,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0000,
0x0000};
----END INCLUDED BITMAP CUT HERE----
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
| Walter D. "Cruiser1" Pullen | pullen@lynx.cs.washington.edu |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
| "Who am I, What am I? As I am, I am not. But as we are, I AM. And to |
- you my creation, My Perfect Love is your Perfect Freedom. And I will be -
| with you forever and ever, until the End, and then forever more." - GOD |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!convex!mips.mitek.com!apple!netcomsv!mork!noring
From: noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Subject: Re: Q&A on Extraterrestrial Abductions and Visitations
Message-ID: <=h9hjhjnoring@netcom.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 22:29:54 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 45
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4939 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1183
In boltj@reis53.alleg.edu (Jennifer Bolt) writes:
>Wake up, The universe is too big, and the distances too great for aliens to
>travel back and forth, that is from the Earth back to where ever. So no
>aliens have probably come to Earth, although it is almost definite that
>life must exist elsewhere...
If the only way to travel from one point in the universe to another point
is to move through the space between the points, then Jennifer is correct
because, according to Relativity (either SR or GR), and backed up with
much experimental evidence, no object of mass can travel through space greater
than (or even equal to, in reality) the speed of light in a vacuum.
However, has it ever occured to you that it may be possible to alter space
itself and reduce or even eliminate the space between any two points in space?
Of course, this may prove impossible, but our understanding of physics
is still sparse and incomplete (with my apologies to those physicists
listening in), so it is being a little to dogmatic to arbitrarily use
that argument to prove the impossibility of alien species visiting us.
Before the Wright brothers came along, many top scientists categorically
denied the possibility that man could produce a practical heavier-than-air
machine; and of course, we know what happened after the Wright brothers
proved them wrong.
For progress to happen, we need dreamers who will swim against the tide of
negative opinion from so-called "experts" and go out and do the "impossible."
My Ph.D. advisor, a brilliant thermodynamicist and a big thinker, once told
me that "one can think of a hundred reasons why something won't work. All
you have to do is find one way to make it work."
I now climb down from my soapbox.
Jon Noring
--
=============================================================================
| Jon Noring | noring@netcom.netcom.com | "The dogs bark, but the |
| JKN International | IP : 192.100.81.100 | caravan moves on." |
| 1312 Carlton Place | Phone : (510) 294-8153 | "Pack your lunch, sit in |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: (510) 862-1101 | the bushes, and watch." |
=============================================================================
"If you make $50,000 today, you have the same buying power as the average
coal miner did in 1949, adjusted for taxes and inflation," John Sestina,
nationally recognized Certified Financial Planner; quoted in 1987.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!pacbell.com!decwrl!netcomsv!ctedge!djk
From: djk@Nitro.CtEdge.COM
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <kL8THB1w164w@Nitro.CtEdge.COM>
Date: 17 Mar 92 23:01:43 GMT
References: <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>
Organization: NMS&Systems Engineering
Lines: 50
Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2358 alt.religion.kibology:1214 alt.sex:58989 alt.alien.visitors:4940
wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) write
> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>>>
> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
> >% >>>% >>>>>
> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
> >% >>>% >>>>>
> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
> >% I drove off a west end cliff
> >I rode to arrest a lift.
> Electrodes tie my wrists.
>
> ---tom
>
> l~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~l
> l CRUSH---CompassionRespectUnderstandingSelfHonesty---CRUSH l
> l How could you have ever lived your life without it? l
> l Join Now, Apply Within. Spread the word. l
> l_________________________ ---me, trying to save the world, l
> l wcstom@ccs.carleton.ca l from itself. l
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--- Daniel J. Karnes / WA6NDT --------------------------------------
--- NMS&Systems Engineering ----------------------------------------
--- Djk@Nitro.CtEdge.COM / ..CtEdge!Nitro!Djk ----------------------
-- 'innovative solutions for modern problems' ----------------------
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!bruce!trlluna!titan!hal!jbm
From: jbm@hal.trl.OZ.AU (Jacques Guy)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.003252.26859@trl.oz.au>
Date: 18 Mar 92 00:32:52 GMT
References: <schumach.698706566@convex.convex.com> <1992Feb29.235824.9719@microsoft.com> <3100@inca.comlab.ox.ac.uk> <1992Mar13.025609.18907@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU> <1992Mar13.221052.25623@disk.uucp>
Sender: news@trl.oz.au (USENET News System)
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne, Australia
Lines: 7
Xref: ns-mx alt.paranormal:4653 alt.alien.visitors:4941 sci.skeptic:21940
>dabbott@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU (Derek Abbott) writes:
>>Wasn't it Thomas Alva Edison who said "Genius is 99% perspiration and
>>1% inspiration." ???
"Invention", not "Genius".
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!psuvax1!uxa.ecn.bgu.edu!news.ils.nwu.edu!casbah.acns.nwu.edu!wasylik
From: wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.210645.12963@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:06:45 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois
Lines: 52
Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2360 alt.religion.kibology:1217 alt.sex:58997 alt.alien.visitors:4942
In article <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
>Subject: Re: La, la, la...
>Summary: still going...
>Expires:
>References: <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>
>Sender:
>Followup-To:
>Distribution: world
>Organization: University of Georgia Statistics Department
>Keywords:
>
>And then in <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>, dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
>% In article <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>% >In article <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>, wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>% >>In article <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>% >>>And then in <15MAR199222515665@vax.cc.williams.edu>, 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>% >>>% In article <92075.161912U37460@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>% >>>% >In article <1992Mar15.075333.9278@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca
>% >>>% >(Tom Hamill) says:
>% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
>% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
>% I drove off a west end cliff
>I rode to arrest a lift.
A diode's zest went "Pfffft!"
Mw
--
+-------------------------------------------------------------+
: Mike Wasylik wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu :
: I'm too sexy for my .sig :
+-------------------------------------------------------------+
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!bruce!goanna!minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au!s914370
From: s914370@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (David Morrison)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Circles in the fields
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.000805.27870@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au>
Date: 18 Mar 92 00:08:05 GMT
References: <UdhvjHO00aw9E3ilM1@andrew.cmu.edu> <1992Mar9.134904.1444@crc.ac.uk> <3NRK+L=@irie.ais.org> <1992Mar13.184601.946@sbcs.sunysb.edu> <1992Mar16.161805.7933@ccu.umanitoba.ca>
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre, Melbourne Australia.
Lines: 19
I'm not arguing either way in regards to the 'Crop Circle' debate. But I
saw an Australian show last night (Beyond 2000) which had a story on the Circles
in England. They weren't able to draw much of a conclusion except that more
study on a broader scale needs to occur.
But one thing that WAS brought up which I haven't mentioned was that some
scientists had been analysing the crystaline structure of the crop found in
the circle. (They said its a method which can show what could be considered the
life energy - but thats not important). The important thing is, there WAS a
different crystaline structure to those crop found in the circles. So what does
this mean? You can't try and reporduce an 'original' with a plank of wood and
some string etc. Cos thats NOT going to change the crstaline structure of that
crop.
My rough interpretation says : There is some form of energy involved in the
production of real crop circles. Whether this is natural or artificially
induced is another question.
David
Path: ns-mx!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!news.cs.indiana.edu!umn.edu!lynx!nmsu.edu!charon!sdoe
From: sdoe@nmsu.edu (Stephen Doe)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic,sci.space
Subject: Re: Mars Face / General Info.
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.011602.8622@nmsu.edu>
Date: 18 Mar 92 01:16:02 GMT
References: <1992Mar13.120732.23793@tcom.stc.co.uk> <1992Mar13.183952.8490@ssd.kodak.com> <1992Mar17.081420.13353@tcom.stc.co.uk>
Sender: usenet@nmsu.edu
Organization: New Mexico State University
Lines: 8
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4944 alt.paranormal:4655 sci.skeptic:21943 sci.space:28014
In article <1992Mar17.081420.13353@tcom.stc.co.uk> fsb@tcom.stc.co.uk (Frank Stuart Brown) writes:
>
>Thanks for all the mail. I should have said billions, and yes I know
>the sun will become a red giant and swallow up the inner planets, but
>isn't it going to shrink before it expands?
No, the sun will expand before it shrinks. It will end its life as a
white dwarf.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uwm.edu!linac!tellab5!jcj
From: jcj@tellabs.com (jcj)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re^2: ? Majestic Twelve ?
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.012150.10765@tellab5.tellabs.com>
Date: 18 Mar 92 01:21:50 GMT
References: <1992Mar14.043415.16579@cbnewsd.att.com> <1992Mar16.001111.942@cabot.balltown.cma.COM> <11140@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Sender: news@tellab5.tellabs.com (News)
Organization: Wazmodyne Industries
Lines: 9
Nntp-Posting-Host: sungb
In article <11140@ecs.soton.ac.uk> co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C) writes:
>
>>No, no - you're thinking of the "Hosehead Nebula"
>
>No. I think you mean HORSEhead (unless the Hosehead Nebula looks like some gardening implement)_
Take off, eh! He means "Hosehead", Hosehead. Beauty.
--
jcj@tellabs.com
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!n8emr!bluemoon!bmb
From: bmb@bluemoon.rn.com (Bryan Bankhead)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: terraforming
Message-ID: <PX1sHB1w164w@bluemoon.rn.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 23:40:12 GMT
Sender: bbs@bluemoon.rn.com (BBS Login)
Organization: Blue Moon BBS ((614) 868-998[024])
Lines: 11
I have, for some time, thought that terraforming was a waste of time and
energy. the energy requirments just for a conversion of mars' atmosphere
are in the neiborhood of 10^23 calories. for that energy ;you could build
enough O'niel type space colonies to have many times mar's availabe
surface area. I fail to understand this fascination with living on
planets. Why climb bacck down into a gravity well after spending so much
ingenuity getting out?
This is from
bmb@bluemoon.rn.com
who doesn't have their own obnoxious signature yet
Path: ns-mx!uunet!Cadence.COM!jdm
From: jdm@Cadence.COM (Joe Mastroianni)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Circles in the fields
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.014148.29324@Cadence.COM>
Date: 18 Mar 92 01:41:48 GMT
References: <1992Mar9.134904.1444@crc.ac.uk> <3NRK+L=@irie.ais.org> <1992Mar13.184601.946@sbcs.sunysb.edu>
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
Lines: 59
In article <1992Mar13.184601.946@sbcs.sunysb.edu> dtiberio@engws2.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio) writes:
>In article <3NRK+L=@irie.ais.org> dc@ais.org (David Daniels) writes:
>>
>>
>
> 1) The soil becomes dehydrated, obviously from a large amount
> of heat used in creating the crop circle. The soil seems to lose
> it's ability to absorb water...when placed in water it does not
Crop circles are stupid.
When I was a kid, I made my own crop circles. I did it like this. Me and
a bunch of friends went into a corn field and pushed over a bunch of
corn. Corn is grown in rows. The spacing between corn plants is regular.
By counting rows and numbers of plants you push aside, you can make
all kinds of shapes. It dosent talke very long and you dont have to kill
any corn. Corn bends very easy and it stays that way.
We made all kinds of shapes in the corn fields around my house in the
Chicago suburbs in the early '70s. If anybody knows about any newspaper
articles about mysterious shapes in Illinois corn fields in the '70s,
I confess. We made triangles, circles, and rectangles. We made three
circles that formed a snowman.
The farmer never found us out.
Crop circles are not a way to communicate with humans.
Putting a big circle on the Golden Gate Bridge during rush hour would
be a better form of communication. Making a pot hole the size of an
18 wheel freight truck in the BQE at 7:00 would be a fine way to
communicate.
I cant afford the mental bandwidth it would take to force myself to
believe that crop circles are not made by farmers looking to make a
profit on tourism.
When you drive through the American heartland toward many of our nations
fine national parks you will see many signs. "See the worlds biggest
ball of twine." "See the Ruby Falls". "See living Dinosaurs." "See
Bigfoot's Wonder Sneakers."
Dosen't anyone see the signs in the UK that say, "See the great mystery
crop circles?" Whats the big deal here?
Joe
--
Joe Mastroianni AKA: AA6YD AA6YD @ N6LDL.#NOCAL.CA.USA.NA
Cadence Design Systems
Santa Clara Ca. "Up the airy mountain;down the rushy glen; we
jdm@cadence.com daren't go a hunting; for fear of little men "
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!samsung!nighthawk.clearpoint.com!transfer!sw.stratus.com!tarl
From: tarl@sw.stratus.com (Tarl Neustaedter)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Subject: Re: Q&A on Extraterrestrial Abductions and Visitations
Message-ID: <1359@transfer.stratus.com>
Date: 18 Mar 92 07:18:35 GMT
References: <=h9hjhjnoring@netcom.com>
Sender: usenet@transfer.stratus.com
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.
Lines: 33
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4948 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1185
In article <=h9hjhjnoring@netcom.com>, noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring) writes:
> However, has it ever occured to you that it may be possible to alter space
> itself and reduce or even eliminate the space between any two points in space?
Yeah, but wishful thinking doesn't make it so.
> Before the Wright brothers came along, many top scientists categorically
> denied the possibility that man could produce a practical heavier-than-air
> machine; and of course, we know what happened after the Wright brothers
> proved them wrong.
I keep hearing this canard as a justification that we can't possibly know
anything, so we must assume everything is possible. There may have been
people associated with sciences who were stupid enough to say something like
that, but it was *NOT* presumed that a heavier-than-air machine could not fly.
Among other things, they knew very well that the avian population is heavier
than air, and they also had un-powered mechanical gliders by then.
Again, you may have found someone stupid enough to say that it was impossible
(I have seen the quotes for rockets not working outside the atmosphere and
trains losing all their air if they went too fast), but don't let a few
stupid quotes lead you to believe that heavier than air flight was dismissed
as impossible. It was dismissed as *impractical* at the time - it took
advances in propulsion and materials to make it possible, plus someone
brave enough to actually pilot it the first time.
> I now climb down from my soapbox.
Don't hurt yourself. It's a long way down.
--
Tarl Neustaedter tarl@sw.stratus.com
Marlboro, Mass. Stratus Computer
Disclaimer: My employer is not responsible for my opinions.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!yale.edu!jvnc.net!darwin.sura.net!ukma!psuvax1!uxa.ecn.bgu.edu!news.ils.nwu.edu!casbah.acns.nwu.edu!jnewton
From: jnewton@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Justin Newton)
From: david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 17:15:52 GMT
References: <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>
Sender: news@athena.cs.uga.edu
Organization: University of Georgia Statistics Department
Lines: 52
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Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Summary: still going...
Expires:
References: <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>
Sender:
Followup-To:
Distribution: world
Organization: University of Georgia Statistics Department
Keywords:
And then in <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>, dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
% In article <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
% >In article <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>, wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
% >>In article <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
% >>>And then in <15MAR199222515665@vax.cc.williams.edu>, 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
% >>>% In article <92075.161912U37460@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
% >>>% >In article <1992Mar15.075333.9278@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca
% >>>% >(Tom Hamill) says:
% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
% >>>% >>>>>
% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
% >>>% >>>>>
% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
% >>>% >>>>>
% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
% I drove off a west end cliff
I rode to arrest a lift.
:-D
--
David Gundlach david@marie.stat.uga.edu
System Support and Integration david@rolf.stat.uga.edu
UGA Statistics david@castor.cs.uga.edu
University of Georgia david@groucho.dev.uga.edu
404/542-3289 or 404/542-5232 BITNET: statuga@uga
"I think, therefore I am wrong." -- me
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!wupost!gumby!destroyer!fmsrl7!wreck
From: wreck@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com (R. Cage)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space
Subject: Re: Mars and Venus (The problems associated with terraforming)
Summary: Moving CO2 from Venus might be a good idea.
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.173750.24169@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 17:37:50 GMT
References: <pgf.700504292@nasa15.usl.edu> <1992Mar16.211230.5352@regina.cs.uregina.ca> <1992Mar17.132153.1@cc.newcastle.edu.au>
Organization: Ford Motor Company Scientific Research Labs, Dearborn, MI
Lines: 49
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4923 sci.space:27982
In article <1992Mar17.132153.1@cc.newcastle.edu.au> c8929469@cc.newcastle.edu.au (stu) writes:
>Long and arduous process, it would be more effective to work out some sort of
>common chemical reaction to convert the atmosphere on-site.
The biggest problem I can see with this is that conversion on-site
would leave a large amount of reduced material just waiting to snarf
up whatever oxygen you freed, or lime to re-create carbonates from
freed CO2, or minerals eagerly waiting to re-hydrate. Fresh material
shipped in (esp. free oxygen) will not have so many ready-made
sinks to eat it as creation on-site would.
>> I recently read an article about verious terraforming methods that could
>> be used on Mars, such as generating CFCs to produce a greenhouse effect to
>> raise the temperature, extracting oxygen from the SO2 in the rocks, how
>> much nitrogen would be needed as a buffer to prevent oxygen toxicity...
CFC's are a pretty good idea. They plug different holes in the
greenhouse blanket than CO2 does. Fluorocarbons might be even better,
if they are more stable, and they will allow the formation of an ozone
layer for UV protection.
>That would have to be one tough balloon to withstand the near vaccum of space
>without rupturing, It might be better to use pressurised cylinders (very big
>ones mind you) the siphon Idea sounds like a good one.
If you are shipping CO2 you don't need a balloon at all. It can
be frozen as dry ice and shipped behind a sunshade. The problem
is not shipping, it is the enormous scale of the task.
>Mars however isn't such a problem, its the atmospheric pressure. Due to the
>small size of mars, the atmosphere would have to be more highly concentrated
>per cubic kilometer than earths to achieve a similar air pressure reading to
>that of earth. It would be like a very high altitude earth!
No, you just need to pile about 2.5 times more of it on top to
get the same surface-level pressure. That will help create a
better greenhouse.
It is rather unlikely that we will try terraforming Mars for
anything except fun; by the time we will be able to do it, we
will be able to do so many other things for living space that
we won't bother with making over dead planets for that purpose.
>stu :)
--
Russ Cage wreck@fmsrl7.srl.ford.com russ%rsi@sharkey.cc.umich.edu
* When Ford pays me for my opinions, THEN they can call them theirs. *
_Bad_ cop. No donut.
Path: ns-mx!uunet!think.com!spdcc!das-news.harvard.edu!husc-news.harvard.edu!husc-news!baker4
From: baker4@husc8.harvard.edu (David Baker)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Message-ID: <BAKER4.92Mar17124406@husc8.harvard.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:44:06 GMT
References: <1992Mar10.004708.1434@tc.fluke.COM>
<29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu><BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu><29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Organization: Non-Sequitur Association of America. Pizza.
Lines: 42
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4924 alt.pagan:13549 alt.paranormal:4648 talk.religion.newage:9800
Nntp-Posting-Host: husc8.harvard.edu
In-reply-to: cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu's message of 16 Mar 92 16:49:27 GMT
In article <29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
In article <BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu> baker4@husc10.harvard.edu (David Baker) writes:
>In article <29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
>
> Your own god loves you; my personal goddess loves
> me. Through this convincing that something out there loves us no matter
> what, hopefully things will improve.
>
>I have a question, admittedly somewhat off the topic: why does "this
>convincing" need to take place in order for anything to happen?
>
>Just asking.
>David
I suppose it's the typical old saw that if you don't love yourself or
think you're worthy of love, then it's hard for you to act in a loving
way toward other people and things. We have to be comvinced as a group
that we are worth the effort it would take to make things better.
Regards and blessings,
Janis C.
P.S.: What the HELL was your .sig?
OK, granted that it is psychologically important to feel loved, why is it
necessary to construct (believe in, whatever) some extra-material being to do
the loving?
David
--
======================================+=======================================+
-+------ -+------ -+------ : baker4@husc.harvard.edu is my name; :
| \ | \ | \ : jumping up and down and counting :
| | | | | | : backwards from 87,000,002 to -3 is :
| | | / | / : my game. :
| | +------ +------ : :
| | | | \ : brought to you by the Non-Sequitur :
| | | | | : Association of America :
| / | | / : -- We may not make sense, -- :
-+------ - -+------ : -- but we like pizza. -- :
======================================+=======================================+
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!think.com!spdcc!das-news.harvard.edu!husc-news.harvard.edu!husc9.harvard.edu!abbey1
From: abbey1@husc9.harvard.edu (Joshua Abbey)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.132457.9944@husc3.harvard.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:24:55 GMT
References: <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu>
Organization: Harvard University Science Center
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Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2349 alt.religion.kibology:1205 alt.sex:58944 alt.alien.visitors:4925
Nntp-Posting-Host: husc9.harvard.edu
In article <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>In article <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>, wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>>In article <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>>>And then in <15MAR199222515665@vax.cc.williams.edu>, 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>>>% In article <92075.161912U37460@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>>>% >In article <1992Mar15.075333.9278@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca
>>>% >(Tom Hamill) says:
>>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>>>% >>>>>
>>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>>>% >>>>>
>>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>>>% >>>>>
>>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>>I shot a wet teen babe.
>Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
I saw a rasp tend a skiff!
-Josh
--
==)-------------- abbey1@husc9.harvard.edu (Josh Abbey)
"Ashes and diamonds, foe and friend,
We were all equal in the end." - Pink Floyd
--------------(==
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!netcomsv!mork!sheaffer
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <pa9hy_jsheaffer@netcom.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:54:05 GMT
References: <9203121915.AA11631@echidna.swdc.stratus.com> <!_5hhysheaffer@netcom.com> <1992Mar16.202028.17443@bilver.uucp>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 58
In article <1992Mar16.202028.17443@bilver.uucp> dona@bilver.uucp (Don Allen) writes:
>In article <!_5hhysheaffer@netcom.com> sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer) writes:
>>>
>>Eduard "Billy" Meier of Switzerland is the perpetrator of the notorious
>>"UFOs from the Pleiades" hoax.
>
>So tell us oh learned and wise Govt agent Shaeffer..just HOW did Billy "hoax"
>the Pleiadian craft?
>
With his camera, dear Liza, dear Liza, dear Liza, with
his camera dear Liza, dear Liza, dear Liza, with his camera.
By the way, please let my Govt. handlers know what an effective
job I'm doing. I need a raise!
>>
>>
>>
>>"Semjase" is the name of Meier's extraterrestrial girlfriend.
>>
>
>Correction oh wise and learned sage of the would-be NSA boot-licker set..
>
>Semjase=Pleiadian female
>Semjasa=her FATHER
>
I guess I just can't tell my extraterrestrials without a scorecard.
(If Semjase is the father of the white race, which Pleiadean is
the father of the blacks?)
>
>
>> Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
>>
>> Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
>>
>> "The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
>> - Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
>
>Is this .sig PC? was it approved by your "handlers"?
You do not have clearance to receive that information.
>-* Don Allen *- // Only | Are you ready for SETI?
>Internet: dona@bilver.uucp \X/ Amiga | Oct 12,1992 - ET comes to NM
>UUCP: .........uunet!peora!bilver!dona | The *real* "October Surprise"
>Psi-Tech and alien brain-wave research -- Whats going on at Los Alamos?
--
Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
"The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
- Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!netcomsv!mork!sheaffer
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <sa9h-mjsheaffer@netcom.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 18:57:20 GMT
References: <!_5hhysheaffer@netcom.com> <1992Mar16.202028.17443@bilver.uucp> <312@beyonet.UUCP>
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 586
In article <312@beyonet.UUCP> beyo@beyonet.UUCP (Steve Urich) writes:
>
>?>So tell us oh learned and wise Govt agent Shaeffer..just HOW did Billy "hoax"
>?>the Pleiadian craft?
>
> Thats what I would like to know... All these so called professional
>video technowizards with there whinning about being a hoax. Proof it!
>I know! Billy is really `The Lawnmower Man' and he did it all in Virtual
>Reality. :-))) Really!!! Its all `Virtual Reality' on Film. Mind over matter
>thats why you couldn't see any fishing line :-).
>
Somebody posted this here recently. It may answer your question.
Article 4808 of alt.alien.visitors:
Path: mork!netcomsv!decwrl!mips!spool.mu.edu!agate!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!csn!scicom!paranet!p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Michael.Corbin
From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Eduard "billy" Meier - Photo Evidence
Message-ID: <115886.29BA7913@paranet.FIDONET.ORG>
Date: 8 Mar 92 19:00:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: paranet.115886.29BA7913
Sender: ufgate@paranet.FIDONET.ORG (newsout1.26)
Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/428.0 - <ParaNet(sm) , Arvada CO
Lines: 108
* Forwarded from "ParaNet General Echo"
* Originally from Vladimir Godic
* Originally dated 03-07-92 13:40
In 1981, the late Frank Gillespie wrote the following review of "UFO
....Contact from the Pleiades." In light of recent Paranet discussions on this
very outdated subject, I will repeat Frank's article here. Before doing so, I
would like to point out that Frank Gillespie was a scientist with the
Commonwealth Scientific & Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO). Being a
photographic expert, Frank was, for many years, a scientific advisor to
Australian UFO groups.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 1:
"UFO...CONTACT FROM THE PLEIADES Vol.1"
The presentation of this UFO contactee story is quite different from any of its
predecessors. The backbone of the book is a series of twenty two flying saucer
photographs, supported by a rather sketchy and disjointed text; and padded out
by personal photographs, snatches of cosmonaut and other philosophy, and seven
pages invoking tenuous connections with the pyramids, the parthenon, and
verious other ancient structures. There are also some visually impressive
computer generated images, for which the interpretations may or may not have
been quoted correctly. The credit for the preparation and publishing of this
book is shared by a team of nine indivduals and four companies; but all of the
flying saucer photographs are attributed to Eduard "Billy" Meier, a
farmer/caretaker of Inwel, Switzerland.
A connected series of photographs such as this can be likened to a chain, where
the failure of a single link distrupts the entire chain. Rather ironically, the
very first photograph in the book is the one in which evidence of fakery can be
most clearly seen, so that detectable discrepancies in later photographs only
go to confirm that a superimposition technique such as front projection has
undoubtedly been used. The first picture, which is reproduced again precisely
half way through the book, is one of a series supposedly taken just before
sunset on 29th March, 1976. It has the appearance of a scene largely in
shadow, but lit from the right by a reddish sun, which also flashes brightly
off the upper section of the spacecraft. However, this apparent illumination
terminates abruptly along the line of the distant hilltops, along with the
transition from pale blue sky to brownish hills. Close examination reveals
that this appearance of sunshine has been achieved by displacing the magenta
and yellow colour image laterally from the cyan and black, thus generating an
orange flash on one side of the tree limbs. The effect of this technique is
apparent only where the background is lacking in magenta and yellow - in this
case, the sky. The question arises, was this the result of poor printing
technique, or was it deliberately done, either before or after the picture
reached the hands of the printers? Consider the evidence; that the only
pictures in the book which have this defect to any serious extent are the ones
in this particular series, that the extent of the defect is far beyond what any
reputable colour reprodcer would allow, and that the effect of the
misregistration is so pronounced that it could not possibly have been missed.
As to who was responsible for the fakery, the buck appears to stop at the
colour reproducers, because in the second printing of this picture, the colour
displacement has been done in the wrong direction, and the trees appear to be
sunlit from the left. The printers would have used the blocks as received, on
equipment which automatically preserved the registration of the four colours.
It would be tedious to go through all the individual discrepancies in the
various pictures, particularly as the book pages are not numbered for
reference. Suffice to say that the faults to look for come into the following
categories:
1. Lighting direction discrepancies between the background and the spacecraft.
2. Overcast sky and flatly lit ground scene, with a brightly lit craft.
3. Correct exposure for the craft, when the scene is badly underexposed.
4. Craft in better focus than any part of the scene.
5. Lack of ground shadow cast by the craft.
6. Inconsistent lighting between shots supposedly taken at the same time.
7. No signs of life in any of the UFO pictures.
The first five of these faults all indicate that a superimposition technique
has been used, probably involving models for the spacecraft. Confirmatory
evidence comes from the last saucer picture in the book, where the painted on
"portholes" are fairly obvious. The most likely technique used for the
superimposition is front projection, which is widely used in the United States
today. With this technique, you can have your wedding day photographs taken in
front of the Salt Lake Tabernacle, even though the ceremony took place in a
Brooklyn registry office. The technique is virtually undetectable, except when
mistakes are made, such as those listed above.
The text of this book is also not immune to criticism. The claim is made, for
instance, that the focussing of the camera used for all the saucer stills was
jammed just short of infinity. This is just the setting which would be used to
obtain maximum clarity in a landscape photograph, so it becomes a rather hollow
excuse for the poor focussing evident in many of the pictures. The captions of
the two micrograph pictures are nonsensical - all metals have adequate
conductivity for scanning electron microscopy, but the specimen in the picture
exhibits signs of poor conductivity, suggesting an improperly prepared
nonmetallic object; and the machining in the other micrograph is not only very
poor, but it appears to have been done by an unsuitable technique. It is
repeatedly claimed that an abundance of pictures are available for publication,
which makes it hard to understand why five of them have been printed twice, for
no good reason. Looking at the drawings of the various craft, one would expect
from their clarity and detail, that they would be accurate. This appears to be
so for type 5 craft, and for type 2 other than the one in the movie sequence,
but it is definitely not the case for the remaining variations. The claims
made for the movie segment deserve some attention. Ask any film producer, and
he will tell you that these are all standard effects with a tripod mounted
camera, involving only simply stop/start and time-lapse techniques.
Continuing in part 2....
--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
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Article 4809 of alt.alien.visitors:
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From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Eduard 'billy' Meier
Message-ID: <115887.29BA7916@paranet.FIDONET.ORG>
Date: 8 Mar 92 19:00:00 GMT
Article-I.D.: paranet.115887.29BA7916
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* Forwarded from "ParaNet General Echo"
* Originally from Vladimir Godic
* Originally dated 03-07-92 14:14
Part 2:
The scientific investigation is one aspect of this book which worries me. Apart
from acknowledging the part played by De Anza Systems Inc., the book does not
name any of the persons involved; but one would expect an honourable scientist
to revoke any abuse of his professional status. I can only conclude,
therefore, that some, at least, of my colleagues, have allowed themselves to be
so blinded by state-of-the-art technology, that they cannot see how easy it is
to cheat such a system. Relying entirely on a computer for UFO photograph
analysis is like staking your reputation on the computer beating all comers at
chess. Anyone knowing or guessing the factors on which the computer
calculations are based, can devise techniques to force incorrect analyses from
the comptuer. For example, distance and size assessment are both based on edge
sharpness data, which can be readily manipulated to give any desired result
during a superimposition. Regarding the metal, biological and mineral
specimens left by the cosmonauts, there is a technique called isotope analysis
now available, which will determine with absolute certainty whether a material
is of extraterrestrial origin. There are many places where it can be carried
out; and some of these must be known to the American scientists allegedly
involved in the investigation. Significantly, no mention is made of this
technique being used.
This scientific aspect is so important, that, at the risk of boring layman
readers, I will deal specifically with some of the misconceptions which appear
in the book. Electron microscopy always sounds impressive, but it would be
hard to conceive of a greater exercise in futility than using it on colour film
images. A scanning microscope would show only the topography of the emulsion
surface, wheras in a transmission microscope, the dye materials of the image
would be indistinguishable from the gelatin medium. Three dimensionality can
be detected with reasonable certainty from an original photograph, taken under
known conditions. However, UFOs have frequently been assessed as three
dimensional from analysis of copied photographs, which are, by definition,
photographs of photographs having only two effective dimensions. Alternatively,
skillful artists routinely transfer attributes of three dimensionality to
canvas, sufficient to fool any computer analysis. In colour film, the image is
composed of three dyes, each of which is visible to the eye. There is no other
material present with which any invisible image could be formed; and to suggest
that some mysterious radiation produced such an image is surely ridiculous.
Similarly, it is foolhardy to suggest that any wire or thread supporting a
model must show up with computer enhancement. A 300mm diameter foam plastic
model, for instance, could easily be supported by a single fibre from a nylon
stocking, which, at 2 metres from the camera, would be well beyond the
resolving power of its optical system. A general characteristic of film grains
is that they overlap - it is only thus that a true black image can be built up.
This is especially true of colour film, where each of the tree emulsions has
to be capable of developing as a solid colour. Another characteristic of film
grains is that once they are developed, there is no way to tell how or when
they were exposed; hence film grain analysis gives no information about the use
of multiple exposures, or of most darkroom techniques. In conclusion computer
techniques have their place, but they cannot substitute entirely for careful
visual examination of any UFO photograph.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
The above article which appeared in the `UFO Research Australia Newsletter,"
Vol.2 No.1, Jan-Feb 1981, is one of many written at the time. Other
individuals and organisations wrote expose as well, so the above is not an
isolated critique. I reproduce Frank Gillespie's article here in an attempt to
show those who have only been subjected to pro Billy Meier arguments that
scientific evaluations revealed a very different story.
I think it a shame that time is wasted on cut and dried hoaxes when there is so
much that is presently unexplained and far more deserving of our time and
attention.
In closing, I would like to state that the above ends my participation in the
Billy Meier farce. I will not enter into any further discussions, I value my
time far too much to debate proven hoaxes.
--
Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422
UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name
INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG
Article 21850 of sci.skeptic:
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From: lpb@stratus.swdc.stratus.com (Len Bucuvalas x5363)
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Subject: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <9203121921.AA11699@echidna.swdc.stratus.com>
Date: 12 Mar 92 19:21:58 GMT
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I was sent this by a friend to post. I find it challanging and believeable
in light of how the bible has been edited over the years from the original as
written by the apostles.....you decide...the following is a short excerpt
of selected sections.
Perhaps this should also go to the archeology and anthropology groups???
Len
=========================================================================
The Talmud of Jmmanuel
-------
First translation of the Aramaic script written by Judas Iscariot, the
disciple of Jmmanuel (Jesus), discovered in 1963 in the burial cave of
Jmmanuel.
The Clear Translation in English and German.
Translated into German by Isa Rashid and Eduard Meier, and translated into
English by Julie Ziegler and B. L. Greene.
-------
Dedicated to the man known to many as Jesus, known herein as Jmmanuel,
in the hope that the truths that he shared may be heard clearly today.
-------
Copyright 1992 Wild Flower Press Box 230893 Tigard, OR 97224
800/366-0264.
-------
Selected Portions to Raise Your Consciousness:
-------
6:10 "Be aware also, that through this sacred thing the almighty power of the
spirit always dwells within yourself.
6:11 "Therefore pray as one who knows, and thus pray as follows:
6:12 "'My spirit, you are omnipotent.
6:13 "'Your name be holy.
6:14 "'Let your kingdom incarnate itself in me.
6:15 "'Let your power unfold itself within me, on Earth and in the heavens.
6:16 "'Give me today my daily bread, so that I recognize my guilt and the
truth.
6:17 "'And lead me not into temptation and confusion, but deliver me from
error.
6:18 "'For yours is the kingdom within me and the power and the knowledge
forever. Amen.'
6:19 "When you pray to your spirit, it will give you what you request; trust
with knowledge, and you will receive.
6:20 "However, if you believe in the false teachings that the power and
spirit do not dwell within you, then you will be without knowledge and will
live in spiritual poverty.
6:21 "Though you will also receive now and then what you in your false belief
request from misused sacred things, idols and gods, you will receive only out
of your strong false belief, without knowledge of the real truth.
6:22 "Truly, I say to you: Blessed are only those who serve the actual truth
and knowledge, because only they receive in honesty.
-----
1:1 This is the book and mystery of Jmmanuel, which means "the one with
godly knowledge," who is a son of Joseph, of Jacob, the distant descendant of
David, who was a descendant of Abraham, whose lineage traces back to Adam, the
father of one of Earth's human races, who was begotten by Semjasa, the leader
of the celestial sons who were the guardian angels of god, the great ruler of
the distant travelers.
1:2 Semjasa, the celestial son and guardian angel of god, the great ruler of
the distant travelers who traversed the expanse of the universe, together with
a terrestrial woman, begot Adam, the father of the white human race.
1:3 Adam took for himself an earth wife and begot Seth.
1:4 Seth begot Enos.
1:80 Jacob begot Joseph.
-----
3:26 As John the Baptist thus spoke, behold, Jmmanuel of Galilee then came to
him at the Jordan, to be baptized by him.
3:27 John, however, refused him and spoke, "I certainly need to be baptized
by you, because you possess greater knowledge than I, and you come to me?"
3:28 But Jmmanuel answered him, "Let it happen so now, because it is fitting
for us to fulfill all justice, since we are both sons of the earth."
3:29 So John consented and baptized him.
3:30 When Jmmanuel had been baptized, he soon came out of the water of the
Jordan, and behold, a metallic light dropped from the sky and descended
steeply over the Jordan.
3:31 Consequently they all fell on their faces and pressed them into the sand
while a voice from the metallic light spoke,
3:32 "This is my beloved son with whom I am well pleased. He will be the king
of truth who will lift this human race to knowledge."
3:33 Behold, after these words Jmmanuel entered into the metallic light,
which climbed into the sky, surrounded by fire and smoke, and passed over the
lifeless sea, as the singing of the metallic light soon faded away.
3:34 After that, Jmmanuel was no longer seen for forty days and nights.
-----
4:46 "In the name of god the law was issued to create you so that you may
serve as prophet and pioneer of wisdom for these human races.
4:47 "Fulfill your mission unperturbed in the face of irrationality,
disbelieving people and false teachings of the scribes and Pharisees.
4:48 "Hence, following the fulfillment of your mission, centuries and two
millennia will pass before the truth of your knowledge brought among the
people will be recognized and disseminated by some humans.
4:49 "Not until the time of space-traveling machines will the truth break
through and gradually shake the false teaching that you are the son of god or
Creation.
4:50 "However, this will be the time when we celestial sons begin to reveal
ourselves anew to the human races, since they will have become knowing and
with their acquired power threaten the structure of the heavens."
4:51 Thus they spoke, the celestial sons between the North and the West,
before they took Jmmanuel in the metallic light back to Israel, to the land of
Galilee.
-----
12:19 "Truly, truly, I say to you: These laws of order were given by nature
and should be followed, or human beings will bring death to themselves and to
the masses.
12:20 "This earth can nourish and support five hundred million people of all
the human races. But if these laws are not followed, in two thousand years ten
times five hundred million people will exist, and the earth will not be able
to support them any more.
12:21 "Famines, catastrophes, world wars and epidemics will control the earth,
and the human races will commit suicide, with only a few surviving.
12:22 "Truly, I say to you: There will be wailing and chattering of teeth when
so much human blood is shed upon the sands of the earth that new life forms
will arise from it, which will bring the final horror to mankind.
12:23 "But on this day you have been allowed to receive all good things, and
the laws have been given to you by which you should live.
12:24 "And you should adhere to additional laws, so that you will have
prosperity on earth and peace in your families.
12:25 "Do away with the enforcement of the old law that woman should be
subject to man, since she is a person like a man, with equal rights and
obligations.
-----
25:36 "When at that point someone will say to the people, 'Behold, here is
Jmmanuel, who is the sign of the time,' they should not accept it to be true.
25:37 "Because many a false Jmmanuel and many impostors and false prophets
will rise and do great signs, it becomes possible to lead astray not only
those who seek, believe and err, but also the scholars and intelligent people.
25:38 "Behold, I told you so before, and so it will fulfill itself.
25:39 "Therefore, when impostors and those led astray will say, 'He is in the
desert,' people shall not go there, and when they say, 'Truly, he is in a
chamber,' they shall not accept it as the truth.
25:40 "Since I will certainly return at that time, I will let them recognize
me.
25:41 "This is how the law and destiny want it, and that's the way it will be.
25:42 "Just as lightning starts from its rise and radiates until its setting,
so will be my coming in the future, when I bring the teaching anew and
announce the legions of the celestial sons, when I will have a renewed life
and will again be accused of deception and blasphemy over the breadth of the
world, until the teaching of truth will bring about insight and change in
people.
25:43 "People of all times, beware: where the carcass is, there the vultures
will gather, so watch out.
25:44 "Soon after the grief of that time, sun and moon will lose their luster,
comets will fall from the sky and the powers of the heavens will start to
sway.
25:45 "The structure of the heavens and of the air will be disturbed, and the
land will burn because of the black oil of the earth, ignited by the greed of
the people, and the sky will be dark because of smoke and fire, and so the
weather will break down, and severe cold and many deaths among people, plants
and animals all over the earth will result from people's power senselessly
developed, and people will live with their greed for power and mania and vice.
25:46 "Then there will appear signs in the sky, and all races on earth will
cry and come to see the signs in the clouds of the sky that witness of great
power and strict judgments against irrationality.
25:47 "Since god is the ruler over three human races, the laws and
commandments of Creation will be valid in all eternity through which, as
representation of Creation and human irrationality, people will judge
themselves with anger.
25:48 "People owe their existence to god, who is the ruler over them, so that
they have to follow his commandments and respect him as the greatest king of
wisdom.
25:49 "He will send his guardian angels with loud trumpets that will gather
his followers from all directions, from one end of the earth to the other.
25:50 "Do learn a parable from the fig tree; when its branch puts forth
leaves, you know that summer is near.
25:51 "So it will also be at that time when the people see all of this, they
will know that the end is close at hand.
25:52 "Truly, truly, I say to you: This is how it will be.
25:53 "This human race will not perish until all of this has come about.
25:54 "The heavens and the earth will pass, and so will the universe; but my
words will not pass, because they are words of truth within the laws of
Creation.
25:55 "No one knows the day or hour when all this will happen, neither the
guardian angels, nor god himself, nor I, Jmmanuel, but only providence and
destiny through the laws and commandments of Creation, which possesses the
greatest wisdom.
25:56 "Creation alone rises far above all human races, and it alone deserves
honor and praise, just as it renders honor and praise to the absolute power
above it.
25:57 "If people revere and honor god and recognize only Creation as the
supreme power, they act according to the truth."
-----
27:27 "While we are here together, Juda Ihariot, the son of the Pharisee in
Jerusalem, is hatching a plot against me as to how he can betray me to the
chief priests.
27:28 "While we are gathered here, he is asking the chief priests for the
blood money that they offer for my capture.
27:29 "Thirty pieces of silver are offered to him if they catch me through his
help.
27:30 "While they are forging this plan, they are also hatching the plot
against one among you, since they want to present a culprit to the people.
27:31 "Thus Juda Ihariot, the son of the Pharisee, will turn me over to the
soldiers, and my disciple, Judas Iscariot, is supposed to be considered the
traitor,
27:32 "so that the people will say, 'Behold, these confused people are divided
among themselves and therefore one betrays the other. So, how can the teaching
of Jmmanuel be the truth?'
27:33 "But since Juda Ihariot, the son of the Pharisee, and my disciple, Judas
Iscariot, have almost identical names, the lie of the chief priests will be
accepted from the beginning."
-----
36:29 "Truly, I say to you: Those who understand the truth of this speech and
attain understanding in wisdom are obliged to align their lives with their
destiny of eternal change towards Creation.
36:30 "When people are honest and search, they will not know any preconceived
opinion or prejudice.
36:31 "But the wise know and are aware of the law of the everlasting river of
eternal change; therefore they endeavor to adjust to the great course of
happenings, because they recognize the laws of Creation, that the cycles of
life have to be closed through the determinations of the laws.
36:32 "Wherever life reveals itself, it is based upon the law of the invisible
secret that brings about the eternal change.
36:33 "Whoever disregards and fails to recognize timeless and imperishable
laws and truths will have to suffer evil consequences.
36:34 "Lies and hatred will blind such a person and even entire peoples, and
they will rush into the abyss of their own destruction.
36:35 "A blind, destructive mania will come over them, and the heroes among
them will be the greatest destroyers.
36:36 "Discord will permeate people's entire lives, and there is no longer a
unity or perfection when there is a split.
36:37 "As long as there is imperfection in life, people will have to bear
these consequences: sickness, misery, injustice, need, fighting, strife,
slavery, false sects and exploitation leading to bloodshed and death.
36:38 "So let the human beware and wake up, because the laws of Creation say
that only that which is timeless and everlasting is of permanence, truth and
wisdom, and so it is."
-----
Copyright 1992 Wild Flower Press Box 230893 Tigard, OR 97224
800/366-0264.
-----
These are only a few selections from:
THE TALMUD OF JMMANUEL
First translation of the Aramaic script written by Judas Iscariot, the
disciple of Jmmanuel (Jesus), discovered in 1963 in the burial cave of
Jmmanuel.
The Clear Translation in English and German.
Translated into German by Isa Rashid and Eduard Meier, and translated into
English by Julie Ziegler and B. L. Greene.
ISBN 0-926524-12-7.
Library of Congress Catalog Cd. No. 90-34240, First Edition: 1992.
-------
Available from the publisher:
Wild Flower Press
P.O. Box 230893
Tigard, OR 97224
(800) 366-0264
$15.95 + $2.50 S/H = $18.45.
*******
----- End Included Message -----
----- End Included Message -----
Article 21857 of sci.skeptic:
Newsgroups: sci.skeptic
Path: mork!sheaffer
From: sheaffer@netcom.com (Robert Sheaffer)
Subject: Re: The Talmud as Given by Judas Iscariot
Message-ID: <zj4hl0nsheaffer@netcom.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 92 23:09:03 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
References: <9203121921.AA11699@echidna.swdc.stratus.com>
In article <9203121921.AA11699@echidna.swdc.stratus.com> lpb@stratus.swdc.stratus.com (Len Bucuvalas x5363) writes:
>I was sent this by a friend to post. I find it challanging and believeable
>
>=========================================================================
>
>
>The Talmud of Jmmanuel
>
>-------
>
>First translation of the Aramaic script written by Judas Iscariot, the
>disciple of Jmmanuel (Jesus), discovered in 1963 in the burial cave of
>Jmmanuel.
>
>The Clear Translation in English and German.
>
>Translated into German by Isa Rashid and Eduard Meier, and translated into
^^^^^^^^^^^^
>English by Julie Ziegler and B. L. Greene.
>
I am wondering if this is the same Eduard "Billy" Meier of Switzerland
who has given us the hokey UFO photos that have come to be known as
the "UFO Contact from the Pleiades"??
--
Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
"The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
- Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
--
Robert Sheaffer - Scepticus Maximus - sheaffer@netcom.com
Past Chairman, The Bay Area Skeptics - for whom I speak only when authorized!
"The facts can only take you so far in this case.",
- Oliver Stone, discussing "JFK" on CBS-TV's "48 Hours", Feb. 5, 1992
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!utgpu!cunews!wcstom
From: wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>
Date: 17 Mar 92 19:46:14 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Sender: tom hamill
Followup-To: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada
Lines: 42
Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2351 alt.religion.kibology:1208 alt.sex:58949 alt.alien.visitors:4928
In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
>% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
>% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
>% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
>% I drove off a west end cliff
>I rode to arrest a lift.
Electrodes tie my wrists.
---tom
l~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~l
l CRUSH---CompassionRespectUnderstandingSelfHonesty---CRUSH l
l How could you have ever lived your life without it? l
l Join Now, Apply Within. Spread the word. l
l_________________________ ---me, trying to save the world, l
l wcstom@ccs.carleton.ca l from itself. l
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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From: sl7sg@cc.usu.edu
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,sci.space
Subject: Re: Mars needs oxygen, Venus has too much.
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.131249.53768@cc.usu.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 19:12:49 GMT
References: <xr6fbmh1@cck.coventry.ac.uk> <203309@unix.cis.pitt.edu> <1992Mar13.120732.23793@tcom.stc.co.uk> <pgf.700504292@nasa15.usl.edu> <1992Mar16.211230.5352@regina.cs.uregina.ca>
Organization: Utah State University
Lines: 8
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4929 sci.space:27997
In article <1992Mar16.211230.5352@regina.cs.uregina.ca>, bayko@hercules.cs.uregina.ca (john bayko) writes:
> In orbit around Venus, a
> hose with an atmospheric scoop on the end could pump atmosphere into the
> balloon, until the balloon were pressurised enough.
MEGAMAID !!! (Space Balls)
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!warwick!mrccrc!icdoc!sot-ecs!co90
From: co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: UFOs
Message-ID: <11136@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Mar 92 16:23:03 GMT
References: <ccm9gB1w164w@qed.cts.com>
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In <ccm9gB1w164w@qed.cts.com> analogki@qed.cts.com (Jeff Robertson) writes:
>
>Now, I know the Bible mentions only Earth as being blessed with life, but it
>never once EXCLUDED the existance of life elsewhere...so, I'm not too quick
>to discount anyone's UFO experience based on this.
Well, just as a matter of interest, there are 4 words in the Bible relating to extra-terrestrial life or lack of
and these 4 words (pretty difficult to find 4 words in something that has over 65,000) are.....
God of many worlds
Hope that this refutes what the guy says and anyway, I don't recall that the bible says that we are the only
planet blessed with life either. If it does then I apologise for my ignorance.
Cads ----------------> If they aren't out there then who's watching us, huh?
co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk
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From: co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Q&A on Extraterrestrial Abductions and Visitations
Keywords: Crap
Message-ID: <11137@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Mar 92 16:33:07 GMT
References: <1992Mar9.122451.10847@beaver.cs.washington.edu> <1992Mar16.162723.26408@pellns.alleg.edu>
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In <1992Mar16.162723.26408@pellns.alleg.edu> boltj@reis53.alleg.edu (Jennifer Bolt) writes:
>Wake up, The universe is to big, and the distances to great for aliens to
>travel back and forth, that is from the Earth back to where ever. So no
>aliens have probably come to Earth, although it is almost definite that
>life must exist elsewhere. And as for channeling, lets not drag mystical
>make believe into the endeavors of science. Maybe some aliens have come
>here, but why or how we may never know, but do you really expect people to
>believe some mystical entity is communicating with you ? Who are you
>Buckaroo Bonzi
Firstly if as we suspect from various reliable sources (try anyone who works at Hangar 18 and site S-4 in Nevada
and anyone who is in department DI55 in England) that aliens are using advanced technology then the distances
aren't too big.
Secondly I think that you mean Buckaroo Banzai (not Bonzi)
Cads (co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk) ---------------> If they aren't out there then who keeps spilling the cat's milk ??
Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!uknet!warwick!mrccrc!icdoc!sot-ecs!co90
From: co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: ? Majestic Twelve ?
Message-ID: <11140@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Date: 17 Mar 92 16:50:16 GMT
References: <1992Mar13.043523.18992@spdcc.com> <92073.121819GHADSAL@auvm.american.edu> <1992Mar14.043415.16579@cbnewsd.att.com> <1992Mar16.001111.942@cabot.balltown.cma.COM>
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In <1992Mar16.001111.942@cabot.balltown.cma.COM> connolly@cabot.balltown.cma.COM (C. Ian Connolly) writes:
>In article <1992Mar14.043415.16579@cbnewsd.att.com> press2@cbnewsd.att.com (barry.o.olson) writes:
>>You must mean the MJ twelve. these guys are actual descendants of the
>>star people from the planet Marij-juana from the horsehead galaxy.
>No, no - you're thinking of the "Hosehead Nebula"
No. I think you mean HORSEhead (unless the Hosehead Nebula looks like some gardening implement)_
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From: cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Keywords: Peace Clock
Message-ID: <29C66295.13101@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:20:21 GMT
References: <1992Mar10.004708.1434@tc.fluke.COM> <29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu> <1992Mar16.224926.5133@tc.fluke.COM>
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In article <1992Mar16.224926.5133@tc.fluke.COM> emery@tc.fluke.COM (John Emery) writes:
>I wrote:
>
>>>Before world peace is even possible, should not the issue of lack of
>>>peace in the individual be addressed? Lack of peace stems in the
>>>heart of individuals and manifests to those around. The introspective
>>>question I see at hand is for the individual: how do I find peace?
>
>Janis Cortese writes:
>
>>You find peace whatever way that works best for you. I may find peace
>>through a different means.
>
>It has been the only way I have found peace. I would say, Janis, not that
>I choose this way because it worked best. Rather, Jesus reached out to
>me drew me to Himself. Even though I resisted, He gently reminded me that
>He loved me and had all I needed. When I finally surrendered to Him, His
>peace simply followed.
>
>>>Amongst the waring that goes on in my soul, I have found where my source
>>>of peace comes from. I would invite one to investigate Romans 5:1 and
>>>Ephesians 2:14 in the Holy Bible.
>>
>>I won't get into this. All I *will* say is that the Bible also says
>>that I am in subjugation to men. How can I find peace in a book that
>>says such things about me?
>
>Please share what you are referring to, Janis.
Oh, how about "In pain shall you bring forth children. You shall remain
in subjugation to your husband all your life, but your wishes shall be
for him."
How about when Lot sent his two virgin daughters out into a ravening mob
of men so they would stop beating down his door?
How about "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live?"
How about "And the men of the city shall stone her with stones?"
If you can't come up with examples of blatant misogyny on your own
from the Bible, I can only conclude that you never read it.
>
>
>>There certainly is. Your own god loves you; my personal goddess loves
>>me. Through this convincing that something out there loves us no matter
>>what, hopefully things will improve.
>>
>>We will, however, have to make our own peace. There is no book or deity
>>out there that will make things all better with a wave of a magic wand.
>>WE have to do it -- all of it. So let's roll up our sleeves and get to
>>work, people.
>
>Janis, if your personal goddess loves you, why doesn't this goddess give
>you peace? And how do you serve this goddess to show your love?
Because peace comes from inside. There isn't some deity out there like
a security blanket who can make everything all better. It's my
responsibility to find my peace; my goddess only shows me the way. She
won't do the work for me. She's not a tranquilizer, or a little fairy
tale that says, " . . . and they lived happily ever after." She only
points the direction out; *I* must walk the road. She knows full well
that doing all the work is not healthy for me. Like any mother, she
knows that a child will mature only through making its own mistakes.
She refuses to coddle.
I serve this goddess by being the best person I can be, and being as
understanding as I can, and not hating or being mean. I serve by
creating as many beautiful things as I can -- music, art, hardcrafts --
to improve this world and make it more enriching for others. However,
she doesn't require that I make myself a doormat. My goddess doesn't
want those who love her to be doormats, or surrender to ANYTHING.
>
>Jesus promises to roll up His sleeves and work in our life. That's what
>He's all about. I look back over my life and have found without Him I
>have had a pretty bad track record of bringing myself peace.
>
>>Regards and blessings,
>>Janis C.
>
>Take care,
>
>John
>emery@tc.fluke.COM
I'm sorry you were unable to bring peace to yourself, John. It's a pity
that you had to go outside yourself. If you had had more faith in what
you were capable of, you might have been suprised at what you could
accomplish.
Blessings,
Janis
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From: adray@Condor.mcs.kent.edu (Adam Dray)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:05:26 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>
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In article <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
|> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
|> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
|> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
|> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
|> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
|> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
|> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
|> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
|> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
|> >% >>>% >>>>>
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
|> >% >>>% >>>>>
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
|> >% >>>% >>>>>
|> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
|> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
|> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
|> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
|> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
|> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
|> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
|> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
|> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
|> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
|> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
|> >% I drove off a west end cliff
|> >I rode to arrest a lift.
|> Electrodes tie my wrists.
Elephants dive off rats.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!yale.edu!cs.yale.edu!cs.yale.edu!judge-jesse
From: judge-jesse@cs.yale.edu (Jesse Wayne Judge)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.220300.9084@cs.yale.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 22:03:00 GMT
References: <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca> <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>
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In article <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu> adray@Condor.mcs.kent.edu (Adam Dray) writes:
>In article <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
>|> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>|> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
>|> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>|> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>|> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>|> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>|> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>|> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
>|> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>|> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>|> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>|> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>|> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>|> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>|> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>|> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>|> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>|> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
>|> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
>|> >% I drove off a west end cliff
>|> >I rode to arrest a lift.
>|> Electrodes tie my wrists.
>Elephants dive off rats.
--
### the Waste Machine ###
### judjesw@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu ###
### judge@minerva.cis.yale.edu ###
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From: pdj7631@zeus.tamu.edu (JONES, PAUL DAVID)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <17MAR199216174758@zeus.tamu.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:17:00 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>
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News-Software: VAX/VMS VNEWS 1.41
`In article <1992Mar17.210526.2745@mcs.kent.edu>, adray@Condor.mcs.kent.edu (Adam Dray) writes...
`>In article <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
`>|> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
`>|> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
`>|> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
`>|> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
`>|> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
`>|> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
`>|> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
`>|> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
`>|> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>>
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
`>|> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
`>|> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
`>|> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
`>|> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
`>|> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
`>|> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
`>|> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
`>|> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
`>|> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
`>|> >% I drove off a west end cliff
`>|> >I rode to arrest a lift.
`>|> Electrodes tie my wrists.
`>Elephants dive off rats.
I lift knife, off frats.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!orion.oac.uci.edu!hepxvt.ps.uci.edu!cortese
From: cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.pagan,alt.paranormal,talk.religion.newage
Subject: Re: Creating Peace On Earth by 2000 !
Message-ID: <29C67711.20382@orion.oac.uci.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 22:47:46 GMT
References: <BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu> <29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu> <BAKER4.92Mar17124406@husc8.harvard.edu>
Organization: University of California, Irvine
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In article <BAKER4.92Mar17124406@husc8.harvard.edu> baker4@husc8.harvard.edu (David Baker) writes:
>In article <29C4D197.17728@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
>
> In article <BAKER4.92Mar15062357@husc10.harvard.edu> baker4@husc10.harvard.edu (David Baker) writes:
> >In article <29BC10C7.6804@orion.oac.uci.edu> cortese@hepxvt.ps.uci.edu (Janis Maria Cortese) writes:
> >
> > Your own god loves you; my personal goddess loves
> > me. Through this convincing that something out there loves us no matter
> > what, hopefully things will improve.
> >
> >I have a question, admittedly somewhat off the topic: why does "this
> >convincing" need to take place in order for anything to happen?
> >
> >Just asking.
> >David
>
> I suppose it's the typical old saw that if you don't love yourself or
> think you're worthy of love, then it's hard for you to act in a loving
> way toward other people and things. We have to be comvinced as a group
> that we are worth the effort it would take to make things better.
>
> Regards and blessings,
> Janis C.
>
> P.S.: What the HELL was your .sig?
>
>OK, granted that it is psychologically important to feel loved, why is it
>necessary to construct (believe in, whatever) some extra-material being to do
>the loving?
>
>David
It shouldn't be, and the fact that it IS necessary for a lot of people
bugs me, too. I should have explained my view of what my goddess is.
There does exist a "time line" of sorts in which I will do the best
thing for a particular situation (I understand that this is a vague way
to put it, but lest ye accuse me of not being scieitific, I have a BS in
physics from Penn State, another BS in astronomy fromthe same place, and
a MS in physics from UCI, so I'm aware that I'm not using these terms
strictly). I like the feeling that there exists a way for every
situation to be best resolved, and I find comfort in the fact that I can
do it. My goddess is no extra-material being; I "believe" in and
worship NO ONE.
Many people, however, DO find it important to have some being somewhere
"love" them.
Blessings,
Janis C.
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From: pullen@cs.washington.edu (Walter D. Pullen)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal
Subject: XBITMAP: 7 Crop Circle Patterns (128x128)
Summary: Bitmap of modern crop circles and descriptions/interpretations
Keywords: Circles in the fields
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.234903.26833@beaver.cs.washington.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 23:49:03 GMT
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Here's a bitmap of seven various crop circle patterns that have
appeared recently, at least within the last year or so, in various
places. I made this yesterday (while Mercury was going retrograde)
using the Unix bitmap(1) program. If you have X windows, for a cool
looking mystical, meditative root background, extract the text between
the cut-here's and save it to "cropcirc.xbm" or whatever name you
like, and then xsetroot -bitmap on the file.
The four patterns on the left half of the bitmap I got from diagrams
in the 11:11 pamphlet that was going around late last year, the
contents of which have been posted to net a couple of times (including
once by myself :). The 11:11, as many know, was the opening of the
"dimensional" Gateway on 1-11-1992, connecting Earth to the higher
octaves, and the four patterns on the left symbolically depict this,
showing two circles, one normal, and the other highlighted in some way
(larger, with a ring, etc), connected by a pathway. Three of the four
patterns actually have 11's on either side of the line, making an
11:11. The two circles represent Earth and the higher octave,
connected by the 11:11 Doorway.
The three more complex patterns on the right, I got from pictures in
an advertisement for a couple of videotapes on the crop circle
phenomena. I would have to say that the upper two of these three also
represent the 11:11 Activation, but in a higher sense, in that they
are similar to the first four patterns but with an additional circle,
the additional circle probably depicting the Greater Central Sun found
in the higher octaves (since one pattern has the end circle with sun
like lines coming from it, while the other is hollow.) Again, both
pattern have 11's in them - one with 11's on either side of the line,
and the other with just one 11 but with a ring around it. The final
patten in the lower right is the largest and most complex, being in
the shape of connected circles arranged triangularly. No definite
clues to what this one represents, except for perhaps certain trinity
forms in general; considering that this is a crop circle and the
different patterns in each corner, it could be showing the trinity of
planets existing between Earth, a planet called Essassani in Orion,
and a planet near Sirius (See the Bashar material for more on this)
but of course this is mostly speculative. Anyway, enjoy the bitmap!
----BEGIN INCLUDED BITMAP CUT HERE----
#define cropcirc_width 128
#define cropcirc_height 128
static short cropcirc_bits[] = {
0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0xffff,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,
0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xe001,0x0000,
0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xe001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,
0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xf001,0x001f,
0xe001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0xf801,0x003f,0xf001,0x0001,0x0001,
0x0000,0xe001,0x000f,0xfc01,0x007f,0xf801,0x0003,0x8001,0x000f,0xf001,0x001f,
0xfc01,0x007f,0xfc01,0x0007,0xe001,0x003f,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfc01,
0x0007,0xf001,0x007f,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xff81,0x003f,0xf001,0x007f,
0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfc01,0x0007,0xf801,0x00ff,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,
0x00ff,0xfc01,0x0007,0xf801,0x00ff,0xe001,0x000f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xf801,0x0003,
0xf801,0x00ff,0xc001,0x0007,0xfc01,0x007f,0xf001,0x0001,0xf801,0x00ff,0x0001,
0x0000,0xfc01,0x007f,0xe001,0x0000,0xf801,0x00ff,0x0001,0x0001,0xf801,0x003f,
0xe001,0x0000,0xf001,0x007f,0x0001,0x0001,0xf001,0x001f,0xe001,0x0000,0xf001,
0x007f,0x0001,0x0001,0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x0000,0xe001,0x003f,0x0001,0x0001,
0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,0x0000,0x8001,0x000f,0x0001,0x0001,0xc001,0x0007,0xe001,
0x0000,0x0001,0x0007,0x0001,0x0001,0xcd81,0x0367,0xb801,0x0003,0x0001,0x0007,
0x0001,0x0001,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa601,0x000c,0x0001,0x0007,0x0001,0x0001,0xcd81,
0x0367,0xa181,0x0030,0x0001,0x0007,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xf841,0x0043,
0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa601,0x000c,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,
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0xa001,0x0000,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xcd81,0x0367,0xa001,0x0000,0x5001,
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0xc001,0x0007,0xf801,0x0003,0x5001,0x0057,0xc739,0x39c7,0xc001,0x0007,0xfc01,
0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xfc01,0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,
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0x003f,0xfc01,0x0007,0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xde01,0x00f7,0xfc01,0x0007,
0x0001,0x0007,0xc001,0x0007,0xc701,0x01c7,0xf801,0x0003,0xc001,0x001f,0xc001,
0x0007,0xc381,0x0387,0xf001,0x0001,0x3001,0x0067,0xc001,0x0007,0xf181,0x031f,
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0x013f,0xe001,0x000f,0xfcc1,0x067f,0xfc01,0x0007,0xf201,0x027f,0xf801,0x003f,
0xfc61,0x0c7f,0xef01,0x001e,0xfa01,0x02ff,0xfc01,0x007f,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe301,
0x0018,0xf901,0x04ff,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe181,0x0030,0xfd01,0x05ff,
0xff01,0x01ff,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe181,0x0030,0xfd01,0x05ff,0xff01,0x01ff,0xfe61,
0x0cff,0xe4c1,0x0064,0xfd01,0x05ff,0xff81,0x03ff,0xfe61,0x0cff,0xe4c1,0x0064,
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0x03ff,0xfcc1,0x067f,0xe4c1,0x0064,0xf901,0x04ff,0xff81,0x03ff,0xf8c1,0x063f,
0xe4c1,0x0064,0xfa01,0x02ff,0xff81,0x03ff,0xf181,0x031f,0xe181,0x0030,0xf201,
0x027f,0xff81,0x03ff,0xc381,0x0387,0xe181,0x0030,0xe401,0x013f,0xff81,0x03ff,
0x0701,0x01c0,0xe301,0x0018,0x8801,0x008f,0xff01,0x01ff,0x1e01,0x00f0,0xef01,
0x001e,0x3001,0x0067,0xff01,0x01ff,0xf801,0x003f,0xfc01,0x0007,0xc001,0x001f,
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0xfc01,0x0007,0x8001,0x000f,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xfe01,0x000f,0xe001,
0x003f,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0xfe01,0x000f,0xf001,0x007f,0x0001,0x0000,
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0xf802,0x00f8,0x0001,0x0000,0x0301,0x0180,0xa381,0x4038,0xf004,0x007f,0x0001,
0x0000,0x0081,0x0200,0xaf01,0x201e,0xf008,0x007f,0x0001,0x0000,0xe041,0x040f,
0xfe31,0x118f,0xe010,0x003f,0xe001,0x000f,0x1821,0x0830,0xf871,0x09c3,0x8020,
0x000f,0x1c01,0x0070,0x0411,0x1040,0xa1e1,0xc4f0,0x0047,0x0000,0x0301,0x0180,
0x0211,0x1080,0xa781,0x323c,0x0099,0x0000,0xe081,0x020f,0xc109,0x2107,0xff01,
0x091f,0x0121,0x0000,0x1841,0x0430,0xf089,0x221f,0xf801,0x8483,0x0240,0x0000,
0x0621,0x08c0,0xf889,0x223f,0x0001,0x8440,0x0470,0x0000,0xe111,0x110f,0xf845,
0x443f,0x0001,0x0a20,0x0889,0x0000,0x1889,0x2230,0xfc45,0x447f,0x0001,0x7210,
0x1085,0x0000,0x0449,0x2440,0xfc41,0x047f,0x0001,0x8208,0x2083,0x0000,0xc245,
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0x0001,0x2202,0x80a1,0x0000,0xf921,0x093f,0xfc01,0x007f,0x0001,0x1c01,0x0042,
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0xfc01,0x007f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0801,0x0000,0x0001,0x0020,0xfc01,0x007f,0x8001,
0x0003,0x0401,0x8000,0x0003,0x0040,0xf801,0x003f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0201,0x8000,
0x0003,0x0080,0xf801,0x003f,0x8c61,0x0c63,0x0101,0x4000,0x0005,0x0100,0xf001,
0x001f,0x8c61,0x0c63,0x0081,0x4000,0x0005,0x0200,0xc001,0x0007,0x8c61,0x0c63,
0x0041,0x2000,0x0009,0x0400,0x8001,0x0003,0x8c61,0x0c63,0x0021,0xf000,0x001f,
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0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0x3240,0x0499,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,
0x0003,0x0001,0x0e40,0x04e1,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0x0520,
0x0941,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xc320,0x0987,0x0000,0x8001,
0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xe290,0x128f,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,
0x0001,0xf190,0x131f,0x0000,0x8001,0x0003,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xf150,0x151f,
0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xf130,0x191e,0x0000,0xf001,0x001f,
0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xf130,0x191f,0x0000,0xf801,0x003f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,
0xf110,0x111f,0x0000,0xfc01,0x007f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xee10,0x10ef,0x0000,
0xfc01,0x007f,0x8001,0x0003,0x0001,0xc228,0x2887,0x0000,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xc001,
0x0007,0x0001,0x05a4,0x4b40,0x0000,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xf001,0x001f,0x0f81,0x0c64,
0x4c60,0x00e0,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xf801,0x003f,0x3061,0x305a,0xb418,0x0398,0xfe01,
0x00ff,0xfc01,0x007f,0x4011,0xc086,0xc207,0x0c04,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xfc01,0x007f,
0x8009,0xffff,0xffff,0x1003,0xfc01,0x007f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0xc009,0x0600,0x00c0,
0x10c2,0xfc01,0x007f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0x3005,0x1801,0x0030,0x21a0,0xf801,0x003f,
0xfe01,0x00ff,0x0c05,0xe001,0x000f,0x2210,0xf001,0x001f,0xfe01,0x00ff,0x0205,
0x0001,0x0000,0x3398,0xc001,0x0007,0xfe01,0x00ff,0x0005,0x0001,0x0000,0x1008,
0x0001,0x0000,0xfc01,0x007f,0x0005,0x0001,0x0000,0x1008,0x0001,0x0000,0xfc01,
0x007f,0x8009,0x0000,0x0000,0x0810,0x0001,0x0000,0xf801,0x003f,0x8009,0x0000,
0x0000,0x04e0,0x0001,0x0000,0xf001,0x001f,0x4011,0x0000,0x0000,0x0380,0x0001,
0x0000,0xc001,0x0007,0x3061,0x0000,0x0000,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,
0x0f81,0x0000,0x0000,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0001,0x0000,0x0000,
0x0000};
----END INCLUDED BITMAP CUT HERE----
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
| Walter D. "Cruiser1" Pullen | pullen@lynx.cs.washington.edu |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
| "Who am I, What am I? As I am, I am not. But as we are, I AM. And to |
- you my creation, My Perfect Love is your Perfect Freedom. And I will be -
| with you forever and ever, until the End, and then forever more." - GOD |
-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!qt.cs.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!convex!mips.mitek.com!apple!netcomsv!mork!noring
From: noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Subject: Re: Q&A on Extraterrestrial Abductions and Visitations
Message-ID: <=h9hjhjnoring@netcom.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 22:29:54 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
Lines: 45
Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4939 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1183
In boltj@reis53.alleg.edu (Jennifer Bolt) writes:
>Wake up, The universe is too big, and the distances too great for aliens to
>travel back and forth, that is from the Earth back to where ever. So no
>aliens have probably come to Earth, although it is almost definite that
>life must exist elsewhere...
If the only way to travel from one point in the universe to another point
is to move through the space between the points, then Jennifer is correct
because, according to Relativity (either SR or GR), and backed up with
much experimental evidence, no object of mass can travel through space greater
than (or even equal to, in reality) the speed of light in a vacuum.
However, has it ever occured to you that it may be possible to alter space
itself and reduce or even eliminate the space between any two points in space?
Of course, this may prove impossible, but our understanding of physics
is still sparse and incomplete (with my apologies to those physicists
listening in), so it is being a little to dogmatic to arbitrarily use
that argument to prove the impossibility of alien species visiting us.
Before the Wright brothers came along, many top scientists categorically
denied the possibility that man could produce a practical heavier-than-air
machine; and of course, we know what happened after the Wright brothers
proved them wrong.
For progress to happen, we need dreamers who will swim against the tide of
negative opinion from so-called "experts" and go out and do the "impossible."
My Ph.D. advisor, a brilliant thermodynamicist and a big thinker, once told
me that "one can think of a hundred reasons why something won't work. All
you have to do is find one way to make it work."
I now climb down from my soapbox.
Jon Noring
--
=============================================================================
| Jon Noring | noring@netcom.netcom.com | "The dogs bark, but the |
| JKN International | IP : 192.100.81.100 | caravan moves on." |
| 1312 Carlton Place | Phone : (510) 294-8153 | "Pack your lunch, sit in |
| Livermore, CA 94550 | V-Mail: (510) 862-1101 | the bushes, and watch." |
=============================================================================
"If you make $50,000 today, you have the same buying power as the average
coal miner did in 1949, adjusted for taxes and inflation," John Sestina,
nationally recognized Certified Financial Planner; quoted in 1987.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!pacbell.com!decwrl!netcomsv!ctedge!djk
From: djk@Nitro.CtEdge.COM
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <kL8THB1w164w@Nitro.CtEdge.COM>
Date: 17 Mar 92 23:01:43 GMT
References: <1992Mar17.194614.26095@cunews.carleton.ca>
Organization: NMS&Systems Engineering
Lines: 50
Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2358 alt.religion.kibology:1214 alt.sex:58989 alt.alien.visitors:4940
wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) writes:
> In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
> >And then in dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
> >% In article 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
> >% >In article wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
> >% >>In article david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
> >% >>>And then in 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
> >% >>>% In article <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
> >% >>>% >In article wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca (Tom Hamill) says:
> >% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) write
> >% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
> >% >>>% >>>>>
> >% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
> >% >>>% >>>>>
> >% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
> >% >>>% >>>>>
> >% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
> >% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
> >% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
> >% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
> >% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
> >% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
> >% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
> >% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
> >% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
> >% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
> >% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
> >% I drove off a west end cliff
> >I rode to arrest a lift.
> Electrodes tie my wrists.
>
> ---tom
>
> l~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~l
> l CRUSH---CompassionRespectUnderstandingSelfHonesty---CRUSH l
> l How could you have ever lived your life without it? l
> l Join Now, Apply Within. Spread the word. l
> l_________________________ ---me, trying to save the world, l
> l wcstom@ccs.carleton.ca l from itself. l
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--- Daniel J. Karnes / WA6NDT --------------------------------------
--- NMS&Systems Engineering ----------------------------------------
--- Djk@Nitro.CtEdge.COM / ..CtEdge!Nitro!Djk ----------------------
-- 'innovative solutions for modern problems' ----------------------
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!bruce!trlluna!titan!hal!jbm
From: jbm@hal.trl.OZ.AU (Jacques Guy)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.alien.visitors,sci.skeptic
Subject: Re: Dreamland
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.003252.26859@trl.oz.au>
Date: 18 Mar 92 00:32:52 GMT
References: <schumach.698706566@convex.convex.com> <1992Feb29.235824.9719@microsoft.com> <3100@inca.comlab.ox.ac.uk> <1992Mar13.025609.18907@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU> <1992Mar13.221052.25623@disk.uucp>
Sender: news@trl.oz.au (USENET News System)
Organization: Telecom Research Labs, Melbourne, Australia
Lines: 7
Xref: ns-mx alt.paranormal:4653 alt.alien.visitors:4941 sci.skeptic:21940
>dabbott@augean.eleceng.adelaide.edu.AU (Derek Abbott) writes:
>>Wasn't it Thomas Alva Edison who said "Genius is 99% perspiration and
>>1% inspiration." ???
"Invention", not "Genius".
Path: ns-mx!uunet!wupost!psuvax1!uxa.ecn.bgu.edu!news.ils.nwu.edu!casbah.acns.nwu.edu!wasylik
From: wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik)
Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: La, la, la...
Message-ID: <1992Mar17.210645.12963@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>
Date: 17 Mar 92 21:06:45 GMT
References: <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu> <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu>
Organization: Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois
Lines: 52
Xref: ns-mx alt.postmodern:2360 alt.religion.kibology:1217 alt.sex:58997 alt.alien.visitors:4942
In article <1992Mar17.171552.7784@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>Newsgroups: alt.postmodern,alt.religion.kibology,alt.sex,alt.alien.visitors
>Subject: Re: La, la, la...
>Summary: still going...
>Expires:
>References: <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu> <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>
>Sender:
>Followup-To:
>Distribution: world
>Organization: University of Georgia Statistics Department
>Keywords:
>
>And then in <1992Mar17.001338.21368@cs.odu.edu>, dise@nightshade.cs.odu.edu (Daniel Dise) said...
>% In article <16MAR199213451607@vax.cc.williams.edu> 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) writes:
>% >In article <1992Mar16.090405.27432@casbah.acns.nwu.edu>, wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Michael Wasylik) writes...
>% >>In article <1992Mar16.061600.13768@athena.cs.uga.edu> david@rosalyn.stat.uga.edu (David Gundlach) writes:
>% >>>And then in <15MAR199222515665@vax.cc.williams.edu>, 92dms@vax.cc.williams.edu (Bat Rastard) said...
>% >>>% In article <92075.161912U37460@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U37460@uicvm.uic.edu> writes...
>% >>>% >In article <1992Mar15.075333.9278@cunews.carleton.ca>, wcstom@alfred.carleton.ca
>% >>>% >(Tom Hamill) says:
>% >>>% >>In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>In article pdevans@daisy.waterloo.edu (Paul D Evans) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>In article colby@bu-bio.bu.edu (Chris Colby) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> In article entropy@wintermute.WPI.EDU (Lawrence C. Foard) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>> >In article kibo@world.std.com (James 'Kibo' Parry) writes:
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >> GEE, I'M SURE GLAD THAT .SIGNATURE VIRUSES ARE PASSE.
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >They will just mutate to get around it!
>% >>>% >>>>>
>% >>>% >>>>> >Evolution is god!
>% >>>% >>>>> Sanitation is fraud:
>% >>>% >>>>Sandinistas ate Maude.
>% >>>% >>>Santa Claus baits God.
>% >>>% >>>Satan Claws Bates Dog! Film At Eleven!
>% >>>% >>Satin draws mates bod.
>% >>>% >I sat in Ward's tame knob.
>% >>>% I set a weird time bomb.
>% >>>I shed a weird tie, Bob...
>% >>I shot a wet teen babe.
>% >Izod's a wasp trend, Biff.
>% I drove off a west end cliff
>I rode to arrest a lift.
A diode's zest went "Pfffft!"
Mw
--
+-------------------------------------------------------------+
: Mike Wasylik wasylik@casbah.acns.nwu.edu :
: I'm too sexy for my .sig :
+-------------------------------------------------------------+
Path: ns-mx!uunet!munnari.oz.au!bruce!goanna!minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au!s914370
From: s914370@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au (David Morrison)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Circles in the fields
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.000805.27870@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au>
Date: 18 Mar 92 00:08:05 GMT
References: <UdhvjHO00aw9E3ilM1@andrew.cmu.edu> <1992Mar9.134904.1444@crc.ac.uk> <3NRK+L=@irie.ais.org> <1992Mar13.184601.946@sbcs.sunysb.edu> <1992Mar16.161805.7933@ccu.umanitoba.ca>
Organization: RMIT Computer Centre, Melbourne Australia.
Lines: 19
I'm not arguing either way in regards to the 'Crop Circle' debate. But I
saw an Australian show last night (Beyond 2000) which had a story on the Circles
in England. They weren't able to draw much of a conclusion except that more
study on a broader scale needs to occur.
But one thing that WAS brought up which I haven't mentioned was that some
scientists had been analysing the crystaline structure of the crop found in
the circle. (They said its a method which can show what could be considered the
life energy - but thats not important). The important thing is, there WAS a
different crystaline structure to those crop found in the circles. So what does
this mean? You can't try and reporduce an 'original' with a plank of wood and
some string etc. Cos thats NOT going to change the crstaline structure of that
crop.
My rough interpretation says : There is some form of energy involved in the
production of real crop circles. Whether this is natural or artificially
induced is another question.
David
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From: sdoe@nmsu.edu (Stephen Doe)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.paranormal,sci.skeptic,sci.space
Subject: Re: Mars Face / General Info.
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.011602.8622@nmsu.edu>
Date: 18 Mar 92 01:16:02 GMT
References: <1992Mar13.120732.23793@tcom.stc.co.uk> <1992Mar13.183952.8490@ssd.kodak.com> <1992Mar17.081420.13353@tcom.stc.co.uk>
Sender: usenet@nmsu.edu
Organization: New Mexico State University
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4944 alt.paranormal:4655 sci.skeptic:21943 sci.space:28014
In article <1992Mar17.081420.13353@tcom.stc.co.uk> fsb@tcom.stc.co.uk (Frank Stuart Brown) writes:
>
>Thanks for all the mail. I should have said billions, and yes I know
>the sun will become a red giant and swallow up the inner planets, but
>isn't it going to shrink before it expands?
No, the sun will expand before it shrinks. It will end its life as a
white dwarf.
Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!uwm.edu!linac!tellab5!jcj
From: jcj@tellabs.com (jcj)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re^2: ? Majestic Twelve ?
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.012150.10765@tellab5.tellabs.com>
Date: 18 Mar 92 01:21:50 GMT
References: <1992Mar14.043415.16579@cbnewsd.att.com> <1992Mar16.001111.942@cabot.balltown.cma.COM> <11140@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Sender: news@tellab5.tellabs.com (News)
Organization: Wazmodyne Industries
Lines: 9
Nntp-Posting-Host: sungb
In article <11140@ecs.soton.ac.uk> co90@ecs.soton.ac.uk (Oakley C) writes:
>
>>No, no - you're thinking of the "Hosehead Nebula"
>
>No. I think you mean HORSEhead (unless the Hosehead Nebula looks like some gardening implement)_
Take off, eh! He means "Hosehead", Hosehead. Beauty.
--
jcj@tellabs.com
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From: bmb@bluemoon.rn.com (Bryan Bankhead)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: terraforming
Message-ID: <PX1sHB1w164w@bluemoon.rn.com>
Date: 17 Mar 92 23:40:12 GMT
Sender: bbs@bluemoon.rn.com (BBS Login)
Organization: Blue Moon BBS ((614) 868-998[024])
Lines: 11
I have, for some time, thought that terraforming was a waste of time and
energy. the energy requirments just for a conversion of mars' atmosphere
are in the neiborhood of 10^23 calories. for that energy ;you could build
enough O'niel type space colonies to have many times mar's availabe
surface area. I fail to understand this fascination with living on
planets. Why climb bacck down into a gravity well after spending so much
ingenuity getting out?
This is from
bmb@bluemoon.rn.com
who doesn't have their own obnoxious signature yet
Path: ns-mx!uunet!Cadence.COM!jdm
From: jdm@Cadence.COM (Joe Mastroianni)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors
Subject: Re: Circles in the fields
Message-ID: <1992Mar18.014148.29324@Cadence.COM>
Date: 18 Mar 92 01:41:48 GMT
References: <1992Mar9.134904.1444@crc.ac.uk> <3NRK+L=@irie.ais.org> <1992Mar13.184601.946@sbcs.sunysb.edu>
Organization: Cadence Design Systems, Inc.
Lines: 59
In article <1992Mar13.184601.946@sbcs.sunysb.edu> dtiberio@engws2.ic.sunysb.edu (David Tiberio) writes:
>In article <3NRK+L=@irie.ais.org> dc@ais.org (David Daniels) writes:
>>
>>
>
> 1) The soil becomes dehydrated, obviously from a large amount
> of heat used in creating the crop circle. The soil seems to lose
> it's ability to absorb water...when placed in water it does not
Crop circles are stupid.
When I was a kid, I made my own crop circles. I did it like this. Me and
a bunch of friends went into a corn field and pushed over a bunch of
corn. Corn is grown in rows. The spacing between corn plants is regular.
By counting rows and numbers of plants you push aside, you can make
all kinds of shapes. It dosent talke very long and you dont have to kill
any corn. Corn bends very easy and it stays that way.
We made all kinds of shapes in the corn fields around my house in the
Chicago suburbs in the early '70s. If anybody knows about any newspaper
articles about mysterious shapes in Illinois corn fields in the '70s,
I confess. We made triangles, circles, and rectangles. We made three
circles that formed a snowman.
The farmer never found us out.
Crop circles are not a way to communicate with humans.
Putting a big circle on the Golden Gate Bridge during rush hour would
be a better form of communication. Making a pot hole the size of an
18 wheel freight truck in the BQE at 7:00 would be a fine way to
communicate.
I cant afford the mental bandwidth it would take to force myself to
believe that crop circles are not made by farmers looking to make a
profit on tourism.
When you drive through the American heartland toward many of our nations
fine national parks you will see many signs. "See the worlds biggest
ball of twine." "See the Ruby Falls". "See living Dinosaurs." "See
Bigfoot's Wonder Sneakers."
Dosen't anyone see the signs in the UK that say, "See the great mystery
crop circles?" Whats the big deal here?
Joe
--
Joe Mastroianni AKA: AA6YD AA6YD @ N6LDL.#NOCAL.CA.USA.NA
Cadence Design Systems
Santa Clara Ca. "Up the airy mountain;down the rushy glen; we
jdm@cadence.com daren't go a hunting; for fear of little men "
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From: tarl@sw.stratus.com (Tarl Neustaedter)
Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.sci.physics.new-theories
Subject: Re: Q&A on Extraterrestrial Abductions and Visitations
Message-ID: <1359@transfer.stratus.com>
Date: 18 Mar 92 07:18:35 GMT
References: <=h9hjhjnoring@netcom.com>
Sender: usenet@transfer.stratus.com
Followup-To: alt.alien.visitors
Organization: Stratus Computer, Inc.
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Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:4948 alt.sci.physics.new-theories:1185
In article <=h9hjhjnoring@netcom.com>, noring@netcom.com (Jon Noring) writes:
> However, has it ever occured to you that it may be possible to alter space
> itself and reduce or even eliminate the space between any two points in space?
Yeah, but wishful thinking doesn't make it so.
> Before the Wright brothers came along, many top scientists categorically
> denied the possibility that man could produce a practical heavier-than-air
> machine; and of course, we know what happened after the Wright brothers
> proved them wrong.
I keep hearing this canard as a justification that we can't possibly know
anything, so we must assume everything is possible. There may have been
people associated with sciences who were stupid enough to say something like
that, but it was *NOT* presumed that a heavier-than-air machine could not fly.
Among other things, they knew very well that the avian population is heavier
than air, and they also had un-powered mechanical gliders by then.
Again, you may have found someone stupid enough to say that it was impossible
(I have seen the quotes for rockets not working outside the atmosphere and
trains losing all their air if they went too fast), but don't let a few
stupid quotes lead you to believe that heavier than air flight was dismissed
as impossible. It was dismissed as *impractical* at the time - it took
advances in propulsion and materials to make it possible, plus someone
brave enough to actually pilot it the first time.
> I now climb down from my soapbox.
Don't hurt yourself. It's a long way down.
--
Tarl Neustaedter tarl@sw.stratus.com
Marlboro, Mass. Stratus Computer
Disclaimer: My employer is not responsible for my opinions.
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From: jnewton@casbah.acns.nwu.edu (Justin Newton)
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