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Article: 5579 of alt.conspiracy

Path: ns-mx!iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!crdgw1!ge-dab!tarpit!bilver!dona

From: dona@bilver.uucp (Don Allen)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,alt.paranormal,misc.headlines,misc.misc

Subject: INFO: GULFBREEZE- Ed Walters response to the Salisberrys

Keywords: Follow-ups to Alt.alien.visitors

Message-ID: <1991May17.042223.18195@bilver.uucp>

Date: 17 May 91 04:22:23 GMT

Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL

Lines: 297

Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:698 alt.conspiracy:5579 alt.paranormal:1562 misc.headlines:16196 misc.misc:4363

The following article appeared on the ParaNet UFO echo recently,

and is Ed Walters response to the Salisberry's claims.

-----Begin Included Text--------------------------------------------

Message #1797 - INFO.PARANET

Date : 07-May-91 15:12

From : Pete Porro

To : All

Subject : WALTER.SAL

Replies : -> #1798

The following represents a statement provided by Mr. Ed

Walters of Gulf Breeze, Florida and received on February

23, 1991. The original document contained various phrases emphasized by

underlining, bold print or

capitalizations. In the reproduction below, all emphasized

wording was CAPITALIZED.

--------------------------------------------------------------

A REVIEW OF STATEMENTS AND CONCLUSIONS PRESENTED

TO THE MEDIA BY REX AND CAROL SALISBERRY

(and recently reprinted on CompuServe)

ABSTRACT:

The nine page media release by Rex and Carol

Salisberry is based on factual omissions and partial quotes.

***********************************************************

1) With a copy of the Dektor Counterintelligence lie detector

test results in hand, THE SALISBERRYS ONLY QUOTED PART OF

THE ANALYSIS. The balance of the lie detector report

concludes:

"Ed's interview as such only shows one area that shows a

reaction which indicates something is wrong with what he

said and that is where he (Ed) took the photographs to the

newspaper and told the person (Mr. Cook) that he (Ed) was

only the errand boy. The rest of the interview, for what

its worth from the stand point of being able to say he (Ed

Walters) is being truthful about what he saw and what he

did, DOES NOT SHOW ANY REACTIONS TO CAUSE THIS

EXAMINER TO DOUBT HIS ANSWERS, ......."

2) On February 10, Charles Flannigan asked Ed Walters to take

a polygraph test. On February 18 Ed was interviewed and

tested. During the interview Ed supplied the names of Charles

Flannigan and Don Ware to the examiner so specific MUFON

questions could be asked. THE EXAMINER CONSULTED DIRECTLY

WITH MUFON. Ed passed the polygraph and one week later

Ed Walters was tested again and once again passed.

The Salisberry's account of the above February 18, 1988

polygraph test by Harvy McLauglin is a distortion. They imply

that MUFON was not involved in the testing and only quote a

piece of the examiners conclusion. The balance of the lie

detector report ignored by Salisberry concludes:

"MR. WALTERS TRULY BELIEVES THAT THE PHOTOGRAPHS

AND PERSONAL SIGHTINGS HE HAS DESCRIBED ARE TRUE

AND FACTUAL TO THE BEST OF HIS ABILITY."

3) On June 19 Ed Walters was Psychological Stress tested

(lie detector) by Ronald Lauland of New Orleans, a leading

expert in the Southeast.

THE SALISBERRYS QUOTED THE FOLLOWING PARTIAL

PHRASE FROM MR. LAULAND'S STATEMENT, "......and the

questions were reworded for clarification....."

BASED ON THAT PARTIAL PHRASE, the Salisberrys

concluded that, "This gave Walters the opportunity to

carefully word the questions so that he could answer truthfully

without providing any meaningful results."

This distortion of the facts by the Salisberrys is easily

checked and confirmed that I did not

word or reword the questions. After a long interview, Mr.

Lauland told me that one test is all that was necessary for

him to determine my truthfulness. Based on the interview,

Mr. Lauland (not Ed) worded the questions to demand clear

cut affirmative answers most suitable to Stress Evaluation.

THE SALISBERRYS DID NOT TALK TO MR. LAULAND AND

AS WITH THE OTHER LIE DETECTOR TEST RESULTS, THEY

CHOSE TO OMIT MR. LAULAND'S CONCLUSION WHICH IS:

BASED ON THE RESULTS OF THE TEST, IT IS MY PROFESSIONAL

OPINION THAT AS A CERTIFIED INSTRUCTOR IN THE FIELD

OF PSYCHOLOGICAL STRESS EVALUATION (VOICE LIE

DETECTION), AS A COURT RECOGNIZED EXPERT IN THIS

FIELD AND AS A LICENSED ANALYST BY THE STATE OF

LOUISIANA, THAT YOU (ED WALTERS) WERE BEING TRUTHFUL

IN ANSWERING ALL OF THE RELATIVE QUESTIONS.

4) The Salisberrys have concluded that the reflection in

(the road shot) photograph #19 is "impossible". They

present as evidence a "simple demonstration" with a circle

of white paper 7 inches in diameter placed 185 inches away

on a flat table. They then conclude that the 7 inch circle

viewed from 5 inches altitude represents the shape

of the reflection that should be seen in Ed's photo #19 if the

photo is valid.

A. The Salisberrys ignored the pentagon shape that is

clearly seen in the bottom of the UFO in photo #11 and the

fact that light passing through a pentagon can make an angular reflection.

B. The Salisberrys "7 inch circle of paper" experiment

does not re-create the conditions at the road site (slope of

the road, etc.) and therefore proves nothing.

C. Whereas, on Oct. 30, 1990, eight test photos were taken

on Soundside Drive at the exact location of photo #19. At the

same time of day and with the same camera this re-enactment

was made using a 100,000 candle power light shining on

the road 185 feet down the road from the camera. THE TEST

PHOTOS SHOW DISTINCT ANGULAR REFLECTIONS ON THE

GRAY/WHITE GRAVEL ROAD SURFACE VERY MUCH LIKE THE

REFLECTION IN PHOTOGRAPH 19.

5) The Salisberrys describe how several UNNAMED PHYSICISTS

have validated their conclusion about the reflection being

impossible.

We discovered the identity of one of the unnamed physcists

and learned that he was told to "ASSUME ONLY CYLINDRICAL

SYMMETRY OF LIGHT EMISSIONS WITH RESPECT TO THE

OBJECT AXES OF SYMMETRY." THIS MEANS THAT HE WAS

TOLD BY SALISBERRY TO ONLY CONSIDER THAT THE LIGHT

SOURCE WAS A CIRCLE. The physicist was given no

information about the pentagon shape structure within the

bottom of the UFO, no information about the irregular road

top with it's gray/white rock surface embedded in the

asphalt and no information that the UFO may have been

farther down the road. (Salisberrys say that the road is

"black top" with no mention of it's gray/white surface.)

This unnamed physicist said that he has now talked to

Dr. Maccabee and agrees that there are many other considerations

that could cause such a reflection. Plus he said that he was

very upset at the release of his preliminary work to the

media. "This is not science, and I want nothing to do with

it," he said.

6) The Salisberrys boldly use Dr. Robert Nathan's name as

if he agrees with them. But when Dr. Maccabee consulted

with Dr. Nathan, he (Dr. Nathan) denied having endorsed

the simplistic "7 inch paper circle on a flat table" theory

and flatly stated that he had cautioned Salisberry to

remember that light can do strange things.

7) The Salisberrys said, "Arguments may be advanced that

a non uniform illumination might be able to produce the

reflections as shown in photo 19. The experienced analysts,

mentioned before, (I assume this to be one of the unnamed

people and not Dr. Nathan) assure us that such non uniform

illumination should still produce an elliptical pattern for

the reflection."

WHAT SALISBERRY IS SAYING HERE IS THAT IF A LIGHT

SHINES THROUGH AN ANGULAR SHAPE THEN THE REFLECTION

WILL BE ELLIPTICAL. A very bold statement but very wrong!

I tested the statement and when I shined a flashlight through

a star shaped hole cut into a piece of cardboard, I got a

star shape reflection and NOT an elliptical shape.

8) The Salisberrys say that on March 17, (Photo 36 L & R), that

"Frances did not emerge from the bushes at the same time

as Mr. Walters and hence had ample time to have hidden

away the model and other paraphernalia involved." THIS IS A

FALSE STATEMENT. THE WITNESSES CONFIRM UNANIMOUSLY

THAT FRANCES WAS BEHIND ED WITHIN SECONDS (five or ten

seconds at the most). Eight people, including Frances, stood

in front of Ed's truck headlights to watch the film develop.

9) The Salisberrys say (in ref. to March 17, photos 36 L & R),

that "None of the witnesses recorded the numbers!" The

Salisberrys attribute this statement to Charles Flannigan. It

is a reference to the numbers on the back of the film. CHARLES

FLANNIGAN SAID "IT IS A COMPLETELY FALSE AND MISLEADING

STATEMENT."

As re-affirmed by the witnesses, the film packs were

opened by others and the boxes were saved. Each box has

a serial number. The serial number on the back of the film

matches the serial number on its box. The test photos taken

before the UFO sighting have the same serial numbers as the

UFO photos and the test photos taken after the UFO sighting

have the same serial numbers as the UFO photos and all of

the above have the same serial numbers as the box they came

from.

10) The Salisberrys have repeated a deception first distributed

by P. Klass in his effort to prove that the Thomas house plan

design is not the plan that is seen in the UFO model. The

living area and the slab area is clearly noted in the Model to

be 1740 and 2393. Great efforts were made by local officials

to find a house plan to match this square footage. THE ONLY

PLAN WITH THE SAME EXACT AREAS IS THE THOMAS PLAN

WHICH WAS DESIGNED ON SEPT. 6, 1989, ALMOST TWO

YEARS AFTER I TOOK THE UFO PHOTOGRAPHS IN 1987.

P. Klass selectively photocopied a tiny piece of the Thomas

plan that said "sinergy" and left out the many other design

and planning notes that show up on the plan. Sinergy was

was an option that the Thomases were considering, as were

the many other items so noted on the Thomas plan. My base

(standard) plan is always for a brick house with options being

added as required by the buyer.

The Salisberrys are also promoting another P. Klass deception

that portrays bits and pieces of numbers to be street address

numbers rather than the more obvious dimensional descriptions

on the plan. Also, the Thomas plan faced Shoreline Drive and

would have had a Shoreline Drive address.

11) The Salisberrys say that "photos 12 and 14 bear a marked

resemblance to the model found in the Menzer's attic."

THE ABOVE SALISBERRY STATEMENT IS FALSE. Of all the

photos, the UFO in photo 12 has a unique double bottom

image and clearly has a second, lower, level of "portholes."

Also photo 14 captures this second, lower, level of "portholes."

The model has more "portholes" than any of the Walters'

photos and it has no lower level of "portholes."

12) Ed Walters is on record describing the "horizontal"

lines during an interview in December 1988. He said,

"There were two lines running around the main body. One

line was above the "portholes" and one below the

"portholes." The portholes seemed to slide on the

horizontal lines as if they were headers and sills."

13) THE SALISBERRYS FALSELY SAY THAT IN FEBRUARY 1988

ED AND FRANCES WERE ACTIVELY SEEKING PUBLICATION OF A

BOOK.

The details of how and when Ed and Frances agreed to write

the book THE GULF BREEZE SIGHTINGS is very clear. As the

news about the UFO sightings began to spread, many editors,

writers, and publishers began to pursue the rights to the

UFO photos. MUFON investigators talked with one New York

editor who flew to Gulf Breeze and made Frances and me

an offer. we refused all offers from these writers, editors

and publishers. Only after a year and a half of the continued

twisting of the facts by a few critics did we agree to go

public and tell our personal story.

A personal comment:

I normally do not take the time to read "reports" written

by critics because I find it astounding how they continue

to try to cover-up and distort the details of the local UFO

sightings. The above examples of partial quotes and

made-up "facts" are normal procedure in their efforts

to "muddy the water" for those unfamiliar with the

on-going local UFO sightings.

The Gulf Breeze sightings continue as scores of witnesses

gather to photograph and video tape the UFOs that frequent

the skys over Gulf Breeze. From a distance, people can

read the motivated "reports" from critics and believe

what they want, but here in Gulf Breeze seeing is believing.

Isn't it curious how hard the critics try to convince others

that what I saw and photographed was a hoax while

ignoring the hundreds of other witnesses who report seeing

the UFO? May God bless and guide us all (even the UFO

critics).

(signature)

Ed Walters

--- TBBS v2.1/NM

* Origin: ParaNet XI-Alpha=- Radio Free Milw 4143526176HST (1:154/414)

EOF

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

-* Don Allen *- InterNet: dona@bilver.UUCP // Amiga..for the rest of us.

USnail: 1818G Landing Dr, Sanford Fl 32771 \X/ Why use anything else? :^)

UUCP: ..uunet!tarpit!bilver!vicstoy!dona 0110 0110 0110 Just say NO!

Illuminati < MJ-12|Grudge|TLC|CFR|FED|EEC|Bush > WAR = "New World Order"

Article: 5580 of alt.conspiracy

Path: ns-mx!iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!crdgw1!ge-dab!tarpit!bilver!dona

From: dona@bilver.uucp (Don Allen)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,alt.paranormal,misc.headlines,misc.misc

Subject: INFO: CUFORN UFO organization info

Keywords: Follow-ups to Alt.alien.visitors

Message-ID: <1991May17.042717.18283@bilver.uucp>

Date: 17 May 91 04:27:17 GMT

Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL

Lines: 115

Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:699 alt.conspiracy:5580 alt.paranormal:1563 misc.headlines:16197 misc.misc:4364

The following article is some info on the Canadian UFO organization

called CUFORN.

-----Begin Included Text--------------------------------------------

============================CUFORN.TXT ====================================

C U F O R N

~~~~~~~~~~~

Cresoat scientia vita excolatur

(Where knowledge increases, life is enobled)

Directors:

~~~~~~~~~~ -Joseph Muskat

-Larry Fenwick

-Harry Tokarz

The Canadian UFO Research Network (CUFORN) is a nonprofit ooganization

incorporated in Ontario in December, 1977, with its headquarters in

Willodale, which is part of Toronto. Co-directors Joe Muskat, Larry Fenwick

and Harry Tokarz have amongst them more than 70 years of UFO research.

CUFORN has newspaper clipping service access, photo, magazine and

report files, the use of polygraph and psychological stress evaluation

devices and other equipment for use in its investigations. We try to provide

technical and scientific consultants for every phase of research and

investigation. We have a list of recommended books and magazines available at

a cost of only $1.00 . A one-year membership is yours for only $19.00 (Can.),

and is payable to CUFORN, Inc. by a cheque or money order.

Our Hot-Line telephone number is ** 416-787-1935 **. Calls are taken at

any time except between 11pm and 7am., EST. CUFORN's mailing address is

listed below.

We train and appoint field investigators, and have available a series

of comphrehensive Sighting Report Forms for use by our members. Meetings are

held only when something of major significance is reported. We have

affiliations with other groups in Canada and around the world.

CUFORN's aims are: to receive reports, check to see if any mundane

causes explain the reported sighting; send out field investigators on close

encounter, landing and abduction reports; have soil and plant analysis done;

interview observers; draw conclusions, if possible, in final reports on

cases; send these to other UFO groups; and adhere to our code of ethics,

while maintaining a healthy skepticism and adherence to the scientific method.

All reputable UFO groups and independent researchers are invited to join

CUFORN or arrange affiliation. Members get the latest news on investigations

and other news in the form of the CUFORN Bulletin every two months.

Write or phone us to get a membership form. When we approve your

application and receive your membership fee, we will send you a membership

card and put you on the Bulletin mailing list. Sighting report forms will be

sent to those who ask for them. All completed forms must be sent to CUFORN

headquarters immediately after completion of an investigation.

Membership qualifications are as follows: A minimum of five years of

intensive UFO research including the reading of at least five books on the

subject, OR ONE of the following: A university or college degree; experience

or training in any one of these: insurance investigator, media reporter,

astronomy, aeronautics, computer technology, electronics, photography, art,

law enforcement, or public relations.

U.S. and foreign membership fee is $21.00 per year in Canadian funds.

Canadian U.F.O. Research Network

P.O. Box 15, Station "A"

Willodale, Ontario, Canada

M2N 5S7

Ph.# 416-787-1935

CUFORN Staff:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

President: Joseph Muskat

Corresponding Secretary: Lawrence J. Fenwick, B.A. (Journalism)

Treasurer: Harry Tokarz

Consultants:

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Physics: David Harrison, Ph.D.

GeorgeoHathaway, Ph.D., P. Eng.

Eric R. Smith, B.Sc.

Stanton T. Friedman, B.Sc. M.Sc.

Astronomy: Rick Ivonoff

Terrence Dickinson, B.Sc. M.Sc.

Bruce D. Powell

Aeronautics: Bruce D. Powell

Claude Freeman

Eric R. Smith, B.Sc.

Linguistics: P.M.H. Maximilian Edwards, Ph.D.

Computer Techoology: Victor Lourenco

Willy Smith, B.Sc.

Regressive Hypnosis: David Gotlib, M.D.

=============================End of File==================================

-* Don Allen *- InterNet: dona@bilver.UUCP // Amiga..for the rest of us.

USnail: 1818G Landing Dr, Sanford Fl 32771 \X/ Why use anything else? :^)

UUCP: ..uunet!tarpit!bilver!vicstoy!dona 0110 0110 0110 Just say NO!

Illuminati < MJ-12|Grudge|TLC|CFR|FED|EEC|Bush > WAR = "New World Order"

Article: 704 of alt.alien.visitors

Path: ns-mx!uunet!mcsun!hp4nl!dutrun2!galaxy!gerben

From: gerben@duttnph.tudelft.nl (Gerben Scherpenzeel)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors

Subject: Crop circles: the simple truth

Summary: a possible explanation for the origin of crop circles.

Keywords: crop circles

Message-ID: <gerben.674733809@galaxy>

Date: 20 May 91 10:03:29 GMT

Sender: news@dutrun2.tudelft.nl

Lines: 120

The last few days, some messages have been posted about the mystery of the

circles in crop, grain or wheat fields. These were always explained by

landing spacecrafts. I remembered an article in the newspaper last year,

dealing with this very subject, and giving a normal explanation (normal

meaning with use of physics and everyday phenomenons). I also remembered

saving that article, so I looked it up.

And here it is. Me being a Dutchman, it's an article out of a Dutch newspaper.

I translated it very quickly, and therefore very badly. You can flame me for

that, but I won't care. The content of the article is of interest here, and

nothing else.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Middle-Ages: the farmer was known to be avaricious, not willing to hire a

reaper for the normal wages. "For the price you're asking, the devil himself

wil be pleased to reap", grumbled the farmer. The same night, satan came and

shaved, so it seamed, in the middle of the field a perfect circle of grain.

The middle of this century: stupified, the farmer is looking at the flattened

circle in the filed. With four smaller circles around it the hole formed the

five of a dice. Look at the transition with the standing grain, he tought,

my barber can not manage that, not even with a pair of clippers. Nasty joke

of the neighbour? But there is no trail leading to it, and since when does

my neighbour know how to fly? Flying! That's the solution, the farmer thought.

A big spacecraft with four round legs had landed vertically on his wheat and

had blown the 'five' in his field. Hadn't he heard a buzzing noise and seen

a orange ball of fire that night? But no-one would believe that galactic

visitors would choose his field to land.

August 1980: Terence Meaden, professor of physics, is squatting on his knees

in the field. The 'circles from the sky' have become science. UFO's, satan,

illegal circles of witches, wierd artists en the angry neighbour have had

their day.

Satan can't be such a skilful barber, Meaden is realizing; the pattern of the

flattend grain is too clever. Twirled, spiral and sometimes intertwined layers

of grain; partly clockwise, partly counter-clockwise. All in one night.

Ten years later, Meaden has investigated a few hunderd circles and some very

strange configurations up to the ear of the corn. Thus lost mankind another

mystery. The solution has to do with a remarkable interaction between the

atmosphere and the sloping landscape. That's the reason why in England they

believe stronger in ghosts then anywhere else. Meaden (founder of the

organisation for 'Tornado- and Stormresearch') is revealing the solution

in The New Scientist (June 23th 1990).

The higher in the air we go, the colder it becomes, about one degree (Celsius)

per 100 meter. Warm air is rising, ends up in colder layers of air, rises

further, cools down and stays there. Thus will arise a permanent exchange of

airparticles and a column of air with a gradual build-up of temperature.

But sometimes *inversion* will happen; for instance, out of sea a cool breeze

is rising, which shoves under the warm air just above the ground. The cold

gust cannot rise, is stuck between a warm layer and the ground.

Then such a cold stream of air will collide with a hill in the sloping South

of England, preferably a bump that's not rising above the cold layer. Some-

times, the result will still be seen in the field at six kilometres of the

collision. The air will get a swish and starts to turn around a vertical axis

like a vortex.

In a normally build-up column of air, the vortex will be very unstable and

will burst asunder quickly, but in the isolated cold layer, the pirouette can

last longer. This will give the stable vortex the opportunity to reach to the

ground, where the air takes the grain with it in it's spiral movement and the

vortex will spread further across the grain.

Than, suddenly, flash and silence. All that's left behind is a circle, drawn

with a pair of compasses. At the border, the grain is standing like the hair

on a bebophead. Especially the sharp edge is a mystery; why isn't the spreading

vortex of air pressing down the grain in the neighbourhood also?

In the livingroom, one can observe aerodynamics; daddy's smoking a cigar and is

blowing the smoke with circles around. Where the revolving circles meet the

wall, a reversed rotation is arising. This is the case in the field of grain

too: when for instance the vortex is clockwise, at the edge of the vortex a

counter-clockwise vortex will arise. With a abrupt 'flop' the vortex will

disappear. In the centre the grain will lay down, but only spiral clockwise.

At the border, one ear will face about right, the other left.

By the way, we're talking about little vortexes and big ones: the circles in

the grain vary from 30 centimetres up to sometimes 60 metres. To be honest,

this scenario doesn't sound satisfying, and the touch-down of a spacecraft

with four legs is at least equally logical. Because what's the reason for

the 'five of the dice', or the (incidental) pyramid of grain in the middle

of the circle? Sometimes smaller tracks are drawn around a big circle in the

centre. On top of this, it seems as if every year some new variations are born.

The vortexes (or spacecrafts) sometimes seam to bounces around the field,

because of the smaller circles spread around an area of about 100 metres.

But Terence Meaden will find a way out with help from the newest, still warm

insights in the aerodynamics. Only since two years, we know that stable

vortexes sometimes fall apart into two or three vortexes which are stable

too, and can reach the ground.

Whatever the case may be, the farmer was hearing right 40 years ago. Since

his story, many witnesses have heard a strange humming sound at night, and the

next morning they would discover the circles.

The sound resembles the humming of high tension cables. There's no man from

Mars in the air, but electricity, maybe because of the friction within a

swirling vortex. The more particles of dust in the air, the easier an

electro-static field will be build up. And just above a field of grain

this will be no problem.

Electricity makes us think of light; as far as that goes, the farmer didn't

tell a fable either. Around midnight June 28th 1989, a huge ball of light

appeared above a field of wheat at the foot of a hill in Wiltshire, England.

A witness didn't panic and waited. Just above the ground the ball collapsed

and a few seconds later the light disappeared. He didn't hallucinate,

as was found out the next morning. Fifteen metres of grain were laying

flat.

Six weeks later, two man in Kent had a similar experience. They didn't wait

untill morning, but went into the field at once. The fireball collapsed before

they arrived on a circular hole in the grain with a diametre of 18 metres.

No-one is declared crazy anymore, so everywhere, people see the fireballs,

even in Japan, Australia and the U.S.A. We only have to wait for the first

direct TV-commentary to declare the devil to be made out of air.

Trouw, July 14th 1990.

______________________________________________________________________________

Gerben Scherpenzeel | gerben@ph.tn.tudelft.nl

"I'm having a wonderful time but I'd rather be whistling in the dark"

They Might Be Giants

Article: 707 of alt.alien.visitors

Path: ns-mx!uunet!decwrl!pa.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!engage!verga.enet.dec.com!stanley

From: stanley@verga.enet.dec.com

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors

Subject: Corn Circles

Message-ID: <1991May20.145906.9412@engage.pko.dec.com>

Date: 20 May 91 15:12:18 GMT

Sender: newsdaemon@engage.pko.dec.com (USENET News Daemon)

Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation

Lines: 17

The Dutch article was interesting but it doesn't explain the world wide

phenominon. It doesn't account for crop circles that have turned up

in rice paddies in Japan and in Australia and in the USA. It also

doesn't mention that symbols and words have been carved out, in addition

to the complex geometric shapes.

Thank you for posting the Dutch article but it raises more questions

than it answers.

There is far more to this mystery than can be accounted for by the weather.

---

Mary Stanley

(INTERNET,UUCP) stanley@verga.enet.dec.com

(UUCP) ...!decwrl!verga.enet!stanley

(INTERNET) stanley%verga.enet@decwrl.dec.com

---

Article: 708 of alt.alien.visitors

Path: ns-mx!uunet!infonode!hychejw

From: hychejw@infonode.ingr.com (Jeff W. Hyche)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors

Subject: Re: S.E.T.I. is a joke

Message-ID: <1991May20.165655.10700@infonode.ingr.com>

Date: 20 May 91 16:56:55 GMT

References: <91138.191919DOCTORJ@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>

Organization: Intergraph Corp. Huntsville, AL

Lines: 19

davidj@wrs.com (David Jones) writes:

>Just a word of caution.

>If you are serious about knowing more about

>extraterestrials, SETI is NOT the place to look.

>SETI is a joke. It is part of the U.S. government's

>attempt at spin control (disinformation). As long as

>they keep you looking there, you won't see what is

>REALLY going on.

Your a joke. SETI is an on going search conduced by some of the

best scientist in astronomy. I will put my stock in SETI before I will

UFO reports as a sign of ET.

// Jeff Hyche

There can be only one! \\ // Usenet: hychejw@infonode.ingr.com

\X/ Freenet: ap255@po.CWRU.Edu

Article: 710 of alt.alien.visitors

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From: davidj@wrs.com (David Jones)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors

Subject: Encounters of the 5th kind.

Message-ID: <1449@wrs.wrs.com>

Date: 21 May 91 01:32:00 GMT

References: <KKORHON1.91May13125802@vipunen.hut.fi> <mDHy211w164w@bluemoon.uucp><9105192006.AA28029@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>

Sender: newsmgr@wrs.wrs.com

Organization: WRS, Inc.

Lines: 4

Originator: davidj@erra

Just a note. There is a new category of encounters that serious UFOligists

are beginning to use. A close encounter of the 5th kind is currently

considered "Human Initiated Contact." Where ``Human'' is defined as

"Earth Human".

Article: 716 of alt.alien.visitors

Path: ns-mx!uunet!news.uu.net!mcsun!ukc!mrccrc!sgamble

From: sgamble@crc.ac.uk (Steve Gamble x3293)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors

Subject: Re: Crop Circles

Summary: Crop Circles, books etc

Message-ID: <704@carbon.crc.ac.uk>

Date: 20 May 91 10:16:41 GMT

References: <1991May15.140114.29545@engage.pko.dec.com> <1991May16.042555.2970@news.iastate.edu>

Organization: MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre, Harrow, U.K.

Lines: 54

In article <1991May16.042555.2970@news.iastate.edu>, hzl11@isuvax.iastate.edu writes:

> The crop circles that you are wondering about mainly come from

> places in England. But they HAVE been found in all parts of the world.

> I know that there are studies going on in England. They are putting

> video cameras in places where there has been a lot of circles found.

> There was a show on tv one time ( just a few months ago) that

> featured this ( just remembered Unsolved Mysteries....)

> Your local public library should have some more info....

> Matt Wiggins

Last year there were several hundred reports of Circles from England. So

far this year there have been only a couple of reports I have heard of.

One of the leading research groups is TORRO (the Tornado and Storm Research

Organisation, or something similar). This is headed by Terence Meaden who

is the originator of the meterological explanation for circles formation.

Last June TORRO arranged a fairly high powered one day conference on the

subject at the Oxford Polytechnic.

There are at least four magazines devoted to the study of the Circles. The

two I can remember are the Cereologist (published 3 times a year) (can't

remember the address off hand) and The Crop Watcher (published six times

per year)(Address : 3 Selbourne Court, Tavistock Close, Romsey, Hampshire

SO51 7TY, England). The Cereologist tend, I think, to be a bit folklore-ish,

the Crop Watcher is more skeptical and tends on balance to support the

meterological theory.

I know of several books on the subject. These include

Terence Meaden's "The Circles Effect and its Mysteries", published by

Artetech, Frome, England

Paul Fuller and Jenny Randles "Controversy of the Circles", published

by BUFORA, Sussex, England

Paul Fuller and Jenny Randles "Crop Circles - A mystery solved",

published by Robert Hale

In the UK I think these can be obtained from the usual UFO/Paranormal

books sellers such as Spacelink Books or Specialist Knowledge Services,

in the 'States I guess from people like Arcturus Books

Steve.

(Disclaimer: These are not my employer's opinions, they may not even be mine!)

Steve Gamble, Computing Services,

Clinical Research Centre, Watford Road, Harrow, Middlesex, HA1 3UJ, UK.

Phone: 081 869 3293 JANET: s.gamble@uk.ac.crc INTERNET: s.gamble@crc.ac.uk

Article: 717 of alt.alien.visitors

Path: ns-mx!news.uu.net!mcsun!ukc!mrccrc!sgamble

From: sgamble@crc.ac.uk (Steve Gamble x3293)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors

Subject: Re: Encounters of the 5th kind.

Summary: Says who

Message-ID: <712@carbon.crc.ac.uk>

Date: 22 May 91 17:32:55 GMT

References: <KKORHON1.91May13125802@vipunen.hut.fi> <mDHy211w164w@bluemoon.uucp> <1449@wrs.wrs.com>

Organization: MRC Human Genome Mapping Project Resource Centre, Harrow, U.K.

Lines: 20

In article <1449@wrs.wrs.com>, davidj@wrs.com (David Jones) writes:

> Just a note. There is a new category of encounters that serious UFOligists

> are beginning to use. A close encounter of the 5th kind is currently

> considered "Human Initiated Contact." Where ``Human'' is defined as

> "Earth Human".

I thought there was a body called the International Committee for UFO

Research set up by Allen Hynek and representatives from a number of

national UFO organisations (including MUFON, BUFORA, CUFOS) to set

about defining standard terminology. I was not aware they had defined

a new classification.

Steve.

(Disclaimer: These are not my employer's opinions, they may not even be mine!)

Steve Gamble, Computing Services,

Clinical Research Centre, Watford Road, Harrow, Middlesex, HA1 3UJ, UK.

Phone: 081 869 3293 JANET: s.gamble@uk.ac.crc INTERNET: s.gamble@crc.ac.uk

Article: 718 of alt.alien.visitors

Path: ns-mx!hobbes.physics.uiowa.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!mips!pacbell.com!att!att!fang!tarpit!bilver!dona

From: dona@bilver.uucp (Don Allen)

Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors,alt.conspiracy,alt.paranormal,misc.headlines,misc.misc

Subject: INFO:FOIA files on UFO's Part 1

Keywords: Follow-ups to alt.alien.visitors

Message-ID: <1991May22.015853.13500@bilver.uucp>

Date: 22 May 91 01:58:53 GMT

Organization: W. J. Vermillion - Winter Park, FL

Lines: 536

Xref: ns-mx alt.alien.visitors:718 alt.conspiracy:5635 alt.paranormal:1611 misc.headlines:16293 misc.misc:4404

Hi Folks :-)

The following are 50 FOIA (Freedom of Information Act) files on UFO's

for your perusal. Since this is a large collection, it will be split

into 5 parts. The info presented here represents only a *fraction*

of available FOIA files that have been released to the public domain

within the last few years on the UFO phenomena.

Each part is around 20K (or so) and would make a good digest if you

were to cat them all together.

I've left them intact, *typos* and all.

-----Begin Included Text----------------------------------------------

Part 1:

*******

FOIA # 1

Document #: 1

Date Sent: 06-09-1986

Subject: 1947 J. EDGAR HOOVER FBI

CUFON - UFO INFORMATION SERVICE SEATTLE, WA

FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT DOCUMENT FILES

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Memorandum for Mr. Ladd

Mr. ________ also discussed this matter with Colonel L. H. Forney of

MID. Colonel Forney indicated that it was his attitude that inasmuch as

it has been established that the flying disks are not the result of any

Army or Navy experiments, the matter is of interest to the FBI. He

stated that he was of the opinion that the Bureau, if at all possible,

should accede to General Schulgen's request.

SWR:AJB

ADDENDUM

I would recommend that we advise the Army that the Bureau does not believe

it should go into these investigations, it being noted that a great bulk

of those alleged discs reported found have been pranks. It is not

believed that the Bureau would accomplish anything by going into these

investigations.

DML

(Clyde Tolson) - I think we should do this. (Dated 7/15)

(J. Edgar Hoover) - I would do it but before agreeing to it we must insist

upon full access to discs recovered. For instance in the SW case the Army

grabbed it and would not let us have it for cursory examination.

FOIA # 2

Document #: 2

Date Sent: 06-09-1986

Subject: 1947 AAF W/FBI UFO INVES.

CUFON - UFO INFORMATION SERVICE SEATTLE, WA

FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT DOCUMENT FILES

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

DATE OF DOCUMENT 7/30/1947

(B) FLYING DISCS -- The Bureau, at the request of the Army Air Force

intelligence, has agreed to cooperate in the investigation of flying

discs. The Air Forces have confidentially advised that it is possible to

release three or more discs in odd numbers, attached together by a wire,

from an airplane in high altitudes and that these discs would obtain

tremendous speed in their descent and would descend to the earth in an

arc. The Army Air Forces Intelligence has also indicated some concern

that the reported sightings might have been made by subversive

individuals for the purpose of creating a mass hysteria.

(AUTHORIZATION TO INVESTIGATE)

7-30-47

BUREAU BULLETIN NO. 42 -2-

Series 1947

You should investigate each instance which is brought to your

attention of a sighting of a flying disc in order to ascertain whether or

not it is a bonifide sighting, an imaginary one or a prank. You should

also bear in mind that individuals might report seeing flying discs for

various reasons. It is conceivable that an individual might be desirous

of seeking personal publicity, causing hysteria, or playing a prank.

The Bureau should be notified immediately by teletype of all reported

sightings and the results of your inquiries. In instances where the

report appears to have merit, the teletype should be followed by a letter

to the Bureau containing in detail the results of your inquiries. The

Army Air Forces have asured the Bureau complete cooperating in these

matters and in any instances where they fail to make information

available to you or make the recovered discs available for your

examination, it should promptly be brought to the attention of the

Bureau.

Any information you develop in connection with these discs should be

promptly brought to the attention of the Army through your usual liason

channels.

FOIA # 3

Date Sent: 06-09-1986

Subject: 1966 J.E.HOOVER RESPONSE

CUFON - UFO INFORMATION SERVICE SEATTLE, WA

FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT DOCUMENT FILES

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

ST-101 July 2l, 1966

___________________

Cleburne, Texas 76031

Dear Mr. ____________

Your letter of July 16th has been received.

For your information, the investigation of Unidentified Flying

Objects is not and never has been a matter that is within the

investigative jurisdiction of the FBI. I can assure you the photograph

you mentioned does not represent employees of this Bureau and the FBI

has never had custody of an occupant from a foreign planet.

Enclosed are some booklets pertaining to our activities which I hope

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