Agents file from the Screenwriting message board
Subject: Agents (Screenwriting) folder
Author: lots of people
Uploaded By: THopeB
Date: 9/22/1995
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This is an archive file of the Agents file from the Screenwriting message board. Screenwriters (fledgling and otherwise) share their experiences and information on getting an agent. These postings date from 2/7/95 to 9/21/95; enjoy!
8/27/56 12:36:32 PM Opening ÒSystem Log 8/27/56Ó for recording.
Subj: Re: Silverlake Life 95-02-07 15:39:42 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Silverlake is really big city compared to where we live, but with a very long and impressive literary tradition (it's also very beautiful up around the reservoir!)... Anais Nin, Huxley, among others have called it home, and it overlooks the ORIGINAL Hollywood, formerly called Edendale.
Subj: Re:looking for agents 95-02-07 22:04:03 EDT
From: TIGRE13
Posted on: America Online
there's a book called the Agents directory, published by the same dudes who publish the Hollywood Creative Directory. If there's a theatrical bookstore (like Samuel French) near you, it should have it. There's also the Hollywood Blu-book which also lists agencies.
I would suggest targetin smaller, boutique agencies rather than the big guns like William Morris or CAA. They're prestigious but you don't get a lot of hand holding as a young writer. Additionally, the smaller lit agencies take more risks on new talent and might be more willing to read unsolicited stuff. Do your homework!!!!! Agencies have their strenghths. Some focus on TV, some on low budget writers, some on dramatic writers, some on comedy writers....find out who they rep and what their clients have written (if you can, sometimes that can be a pain). Most of all, make contact by phone first....before you send a script submission.
Subj: Re: Success without an agent 95-02-07 22:22:55 EDT
From: TIGRE13
Posted on: America Online
HEY DUDES!!!
Anyone (no make that everyone) who writes is a dreamer. it is also true that everyone needs to have a healthy dose of reality .... especially living in Los Angeles ... the land where no one really is who or what they appear to be. The waiter is an actor, the secretary is a producer, the mailroom clerk is a screenwriter. This city is made of dreams and fantasies.
One rather successful producer told me once after she read a script submitted to her, "This business isn't about making movies, it's about survival." And in many ways she was right. This business is about surviving: rejection after rejection after rejection. But that's where the dreamer comes in. Cracking this town can be the easiest (ask Richard Rodriguez) or the hardest (talk to just about anybody else) thing to do. But in order to crack it, you gotta be savvy to the market and realistic about your 'chances'; but you have to be able to dream, because that's how you keep creating.
DW -- i understand your viewpoint that there's no sense sugarcoating reality here. but the fact is, if you don't have a kernal if cockeyed optimism, you really put yourself into a corner......I'd love to be able to be in a position to NOT HAVE TO LIVE IN LA, by the way. To write and live back in New England -- but here we are, slaving away in Hollywood. (At least I live in a decent neighborhood).
So, be let's be realistic about the business: it's tough, it's competetive, and let's face it, MUCH OF IT ISN'T FAIR...because oftentimes 'promotion' and 'success' isn't based on merit. But dream on we must -- because without a kernal of a dream in our brain, we lose also our imagination.
Best regaahds (as they say in NE), Tig
Subj: Lost in the agency 95-02-07 23:55:50 EDT
From: CASINOBOY
Posted on: America Online
Need advice on how to break from an agent who's done absolutely nothing for me or my work. I'm not in LA or NYC, but stuck in a basement in f**cking St. Louis trying to realize my dream. Not exactly in a spot to negotiate with an agent, so do I hold onto my current or take the risk of not finding one at all? Any advice, e-mail to me, PLEASE!!!!!
Thanks, and for all you H-Wood types, remeber there are people in St. Louis, Davenport, Cheyenne, and all points in between. Don't forget about us! We have GREAT stories to tell!
Subj: Re: Success without an agent 95-02-08 01:10:43 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Mkwordd - Like I said ... sounds like you're livin' large. If I gave all up to chase phantoms in LA, I'd have to live like an itinerant apple-picker and the smell of desperation would ooze from every pore. Not being a young lion any longer, my sheer exuberance just ain't enough to carry me through. This ain't a race. They've been making films for over 100 years and it seems reasonably certain they'll still be reading scripts long after you and I are in the Projection Booth in The Sky.
No one has a stop watch on me. For every idiot like me who fails long distance, there's a hundred failures in your area code.
Me? No interest in EITHER coast. The vertical lifestyle of NY with kitchens the size of a good closet and paper-train cucarachas or the lure of the loons out west just have no appeal. And I'm certain both Coast-types will quickly concur life in the heartland interests them not at all. Sounds like you've carved out yer piece o'the dream and I salute you. I also demure to your hanging in the trenches.
Words know no boundaries, stories recognize no borders. Viva la modem!
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH 95-02-08 01:16:42 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Hey, all I'm saying is that if I "followed my bliss," foregoing all for the Dream, my reality of LA will be much different than yours. If I hit it, no problem - it's party time. If the God of Odds rolls craps - the true
likelihood - well ... it would get pretty ugly to watch ol' DW slip under the Perrier for the third time \../
And not all here is bucolic, tree-lined streets and babbling brooks. During my forays into H'wood, I rubbed Armani-clad cheeks with enough serious dough to annoint me with a permanent inferiority complex.
You ever come here, I'll buy you a Great Lakes Dortmunder (world's best beer - brewed here) and a plate of pierogis.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: Success without an agent 95-02-08 01:21:44 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Like I said, Tigre - if I wasn't a dreamer, I'd be doing a 9-5 and believing Doom Dragons who breathe Obscuring Smoke about my ambitions. I dream, partner. fact is, I think there's a real solid chance this whole life is nothing more than a dream, to put it in understandable terms. But why do a U-turn into an existentialistic cul-de-sac, hmmmm?
You admit wanting to live away from the mother lode. I also remember I can have ANYTHING I want but not EVERYTHING I want. If cracking the barrier with a big buck script ain't in the cards, so be it. I'll still write.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: Success without an agent 95-02-08 07:46:10 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
Looks like old home week here, folks.
Subj: Re: Living in New Englad 95-02-08 13:58:04 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I used to live in New England... even had a Studio job there! But I only blossomed in LA.
Subj: Where You Are 95-02-08 14:48:40 EDT
From: Mkwordd
Posted on: America Online
DW:
Never meant to disparage your lifestyle, decisions or community. Simply wanted to state that there are opportunities for a pleasant, non-wealthy existence here in LA.
Sounds like you have a great home and a wonderful life ... and it's true ... you don't have to be here to sell a script. I know. My first one went while I was living in a studio apt. in Brooklyn. I proved all the people wrong who said it couldn't be done! However, in retrospect, I realize that luck had a lot to do with it. And that I should have moved to LA immediately instead of sticking with NYC for four more years.
You've got a lot more going on in your life, DW, than just chasing after the play or pay deal. No reason to give any of that up for a spin at the roulette wheel. I'd only want to say to the others who have made it their sole ambition to become a screenwriter ... at some point you'll want to jump in and completely immerse yourself in the industry.
BTW, DW .... you make LA and NYC sound so dreadful!
I have have experienced both cities ... both the good and bad. I just think it blinds us to the amazing experiences one can find if we allow ourselves to be constricted by narrow perspectives and stereotypes. I have always been been amazed how often my preconceptions of people and places are blown away by the reality and how there is fascination to be found at every turn in the road.
And by the way ... the *best* beer is brewed in Portland, ME. Geery's Pale Ale. } : )
Let's make a toast ... to regional loyalty!
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-08 14:54:25 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I have lived in NYC... in Boston... and in LA. The weather is better here, and there are more potential customers, and they are in a tighter area. Does this make a difference? YES! Would I sacrifice lifestyle for these elements -- who knows, I like the style here (no snow shoveling!). But, all of us on AOL are also braking some new ground, all on the Net are breaking new ground, all on M-bone, new ground: geography is being less important.
Still, the successful people I know, with their houses in Utah or Colorado or Aspen or the Carribean Islands also keep pieds a terre here in town, because they sell from pitches more than from spec scripts.
PS: 99 44/100 of writers were born in Brooklyn. You could look it up. It has to do with the water.
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-09 00:03:39 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Mkwordd - Sorry, but I think any massive gathering of humanity is something to be avoided. I know. My start in this life, especially early teens to 20's, was less than auspicious. Sleeping in cars. Stealing food. Skirting a session in the graybar hotel. Nothing against LA, NY or any other big cities with initials. But i think the folks that enjoy those areas are ones who are doing well, have a support/financial safety net or are deranged. I fail to see how a working family would enjoy life there on the edge of lower class. In this part of the world, a $100,000 house is pretty nice. LA? A nice garage. NY? Fahgettaboutit.
Perhaps one day you and I will toast our success and follies with cold regional brews and talk about something really important - beer.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-09 00:05:49 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Pottree - No argument. Living in the market is the BEST way to do it. Not the ONLY way, right? If '95 is the year I get a strike, there's no doubt I'll be joining you in that Great Gridlock. I know one way or the other, time must be spent in the City of Angels.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Where to live 95-02-09 03:11:24 EDT
From: SamRussAdm
Posted on: America Online
I've been spending time out here in LA since last October. Actually gotten a lot of writing done, met more screenwriters and generally steeped myself in the culture of entertainment.
New York has a lot going for it, but this town IS the entertainment place. I think if you're lucky enough to be able to afford some time out here, you should do it. Even if you hate it, you'll know what the reflexes of the business are.
And I have lived elsewhere. The sleepy Gulf Coast, to be exact. Makes most of the US look like rush hour on a subway in terms of stress. But hey, a little stress is necessary for some people's survival.
I'll be out here until I sell something. Maybe after, if the sale isn't enough. But I'm here and I think that counts for something. Again, it's a choice and a privilege but if you can do it, I think you should. Or expect to have a longer row to hoe.
Sam
Subj: Re:Doin' Time in LA 95-02-09 20:14:03 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
DW, when you get here, be my guest for espresso, burritos, and sushi.
Subj: Re:Doin' Time in LA 95-02-09 22:33:04 EDT
From: HMENDIVETT
Posted on: America Online
pottree -
I would suggest you take DW in OH to one of our fine Japanese-Italian restaurants! 'Cause if there's one thing going in LA, it's food.
If you like sushi and if you like fresh pasta, head to ZIPANGU in Santa Monica on Broadway and Lincoln.
Subj: Re:Doin' Time in LA 95-02-09 23:22:16 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
I went to one of those Japanese-Italian restaurants during my last LA visit. After I ate, I was still hungry so I asked for more and they stuffed me in the trunk of a car.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Doin' Time in LA 95-02-10 03:06:48 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Excuse me but....
LA is definitely one of the GREATEST places to live. This is in terms
of opportunity, weather , food and lest we forget, FUN!
DW- it sounds great where you live but I believe at some point I would
go into a coma on the hammock. : )
I do not feel overrun by immigrants-Hell it just gives the place a lot more
flavor. My neighborhood is quiet and the people are friendly.( No, I don't
live in BH)
I think the view of LA via the news and media would have you doubtful
of the survival rate but more people keep coming and not just from ole
Mexico.
This isn't to say that I don't like to get out of town on occassion.
Now, about this agent thing........
How many scripts should you have under your belt before you start
testing the waters????????
BTW-- to the people using all caps- Why all the yelling ? : )
Subj: Re: Success without an agent 95-02-10 04:33:15 EDT
From: Edscript
Posted on: America Online
Mkwordd:
Just to acknowledge your note. Don't take my 5% seriously. I just used the number to make a point but have no idea what the true percentage is. I accept the validity of the proposition that if you can get an agent, that's the way to go, but if you live next to Jodie Foster or share a dog walker with her etc., if the chance arises to pitch your story, go ahead and do so. The idea is try anything that "might" work to get your work read.
Let me make another point which DW makes in passing and in a different context. Maybe going for a Jodie Foster is a stretch, but there are many actors who have not appeared in movies for years even though they remain bankable. At times, one should focus on these lesser actors, if you think the script you have written might interest them. Pitch to their agents. You'll never know.
Subj: Re:Lost in the agency 95-02-10 05:23:53 EDT
From: WriteTV
Posted on: America Online
CASINOBOY:
Trust me -- any agent is better than no agent. Mine flaked last fall, either quit or was fired from her agency. Since then hardly anybody will read any of my 7 spec scripts because I don't have produced credits. Of course, I do write television (one-hour specifically) -- things might be different for you feature writers.
WriteTV
Subj: Re:Lost in the agency 95-02-10 13:47:04 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
It is possible to get material around without an agent. There are a lot of "producers" (line producers who want to be creative producers, people with no credits, but good reputations re:material, etc.) who will get material seen.
Or if you pitch material well, producers with on-the-lot deals will take a look. But it's not easy. Nothing's easy. And the question will usually arise "Who's your agent?", and if you don't want to hem and haw, it's good to have SOMEBODY to tell them. And they'll ask you to "have your agent send it". So, find an agent who'll work with you, even if their not hot-shots, and get some labels from them to do your own submissions.
Even if you have an agent, you have to do a lot of the selling yourself. I only had one agent who EVER sold ANYTHING of mine. And most writers complain about their agents when they're not getting rich. But they are relatively necessary, and get you meetings, and occasionally, they might even get something sold.
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-10 14:34:27 EDT
From: Dspr
Posted on: America Online
Hi all. I am new to AOL and actually on a work account so no EMAIL please... Here's the question- I live in San Francisco and love this town. I love the people and the cafes and the public transportation. I hate the weather tho...
Anyway- I am thinking- Los Angeles is the center of the entertainment world and I want to be a screenwriter (I am new to that, too...) and I would love to have access to people and jobs and whatever else the industry has to offer. I want to know other screenwriters- how do you live while you write- what was plot point one in that film anyway? Please read this script and tell me what you think... I know no one interested in writing!
So what do you think? Should i just pack up and go? Where can I live safely and cheaply? Are those mutually exclusive considerations? I am 28 and have a pretty decent resume and University background- should i chuck that in favor of a waitressing job which will give me time to be involved in industry? Am I grossly niave?
Opinions will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
MHinSF
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-10 15:14:11 EDT
From: Mkwordd
Posted on: America Online
MH:
In my very personal and very humble opinion, I beg to differ with Kitty's statement that >>LA is definitely one of the GREATEST places to live<<.
LA is as fine a place as anyone could want to be ... and it is the center of the entertainment industry, particularly the film biz. So, yeah, you should seriously think about moving here.
Places To Live:
LA is cheaper than San Francisco. You can find nice, affordable places to live in Los Feliz, Studio City, West Hollywood, North Hollywood and other nearby valley locations.
In chosing a place to live there are a few things to keep in mind. 1. Certainly affordability is key. 2. Location. You can find really cheap places to live here, but you'll probably want to avoid 30-40 minute drive times to get where you wanna go. And it helps not to put yourself somewhere where you'll feel isolated ... like Woodland Hills or Industry City or anywhere in Orange County. You're young and you want to hang with people in the industry. That means you should try to live just south or just north or just east of the Hollywood Hills. (Just west is Beverly Hills, Bel Air and Brentwood!) This will also keep you fairly close to most of the major studios and prod co offices. A lot of people like to live in Santa Monica because the air is a little cleaner and it is defintely much cooler there in the summer! However, it is more expensive and the traffic can be a hassle.
Jobs: Making the ends meet in LA can be tough. Basically there are two theories about this for a struggling screenwriter. 1. get a no-brainer so you can pay bills and still have the time and energy to write. 2. Get a job with a production company or studio (like as assistant or development person or reader) so that you can start to make contacts and get to know the ins and outs of the biz. However, you often end up working harder at these types of jobs than others and your writing time can be diminished.
Back to KittyLynn:
I respect your opion about LA. I certainly defend against those you trash it. It has a lot to offer. A lot more than what most people give it credit for.
But "greatest" place to live? Well, if the most important hting in your life is a lot of sun .... : )
Thinking of greatest places to live, I seem to come up with a different list:
San Francisco (I like cloudy, foggy weather)
Cape Cod (Hey, I grew up there)
London (Hey, it's London!)
New York (It *is* the greatest city on the planet!)
Subj: Re:Lost in the agency 95-02-10 20:48:56 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Here is a thought (and this comes from one who really believes that if you have a decent agent, you're better off):
If you now have no produced screen credits, what good was the flake-o agent you had? So, maybe, she got your stuff read, but nobody bought. You now have the same actual result... but you can take some more aggressive action yourself. Probably flake-o didn't do much, especially if she was canned! Anyhow, why doesn't the agency assign you a new agent. Don't they get their claws into your TV bucks?
Subj: Re:Lost in the agency 95-02-10 20:50:56 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Here's another thought re: "who's your agent" comeback...
Lots of very successful above the liners do NOT use an agent these days: they use an entertainment attorney. So, the comeback is something like, "I don't believe in agents, just contact my attorney" and give the right Century City address.
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-10 20:52:09 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Grossly naive.
So, go for it while you are still young enough not to realize you have no chance, and maybe something will happen.
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-10 20:54:04 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Mk: you have good taste in real estate.
Are you a Republican?
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-11 00:35:37 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Dear MHinSF,
I think you would feel better shooting for your dreams but that doesn't
mean it cannot be well thought out.
Get to know somebody who REALLY is familiar with LA - we have
great coffehouses, weather , etc. but there are definitely some areas
that are better NOT to live in . It all depends on what kind of neighbor-
hood you're looking for to set your address.
Best o' Luck
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-11 01:00:47 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Mkwordd-
My rebuttal sir............
1. Hey, I'm a Native ( 2nd generation )
2. The medical care is great ! ( just had a kidney transplant at UCLA )
3. The mountains. ( I live at the foothills in Altadena )
4. Real Mexican food
The list could definitely surpass Sir Letterman's, but I'll stop at this point.
And I am about the least tanned person you will find....I'm not blonde
either. ; )
About your list.........
SF - beautiful , expensive and my husband works there but won't
entertain the thought of moving there for a year or two. sigh.
Cape Cod - Don't know how it is but IT'S ON THE EAST COAST. gasp
horror
London - Would love to try it...... Willyou buy my ticket? : )
New York - Been there. Done that................ I will give you that the pizza
is better.
BKitty
Subj: Re:Where You Are 95-02-11 01:40:44 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
MH - Yours is a wonderfully novel idea!!! A 20-something, inexperienced writer who moves to LA, working as a waitress and tryingto get into the business!! Gee, now that you've posted it, I'm betting a few more people will start considering it!
Sorry about the sarcasm, but really - think long and hard, ok? In the end, only YOU can make that decision. I've been there and done that, have a few years on you and decided AWAY is the route for me. That could change. But no one on this board can give you solid advice because we're alling coming from different backgrounds with different goals.
YOU gotta answer this one.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Lucas FIlms adress 95-02-12 16:46:50 EDT
From: NFalstein
Posted on: America Online
Just to verify, I used to work for Lucasfilm and we were all under standing orders to return anything that even looked like it might contain a script, unopened. George has been sued many times by people who sent him screenplays that had furry humanoid creatures in them, or space ships, etc., and he is adamant about not accepting outside submissions.
Subj: Re:Transplant 95-02-13 15:36:03 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
B: Hope you are OK after the kidney transplant.
I am a transplant myself: from NYC and from New England. It is better here, all things considered. If you only consider a few things, it is better anywhere else!
Subj: Re:Transplant 95-02-13 19:19:18 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Pottree -
Thanks for asking- I am living a new life !! I waited just over 2 years for
my "gift" and I haven't stopped smiling since.
As for your type of transplantation, you have a mighty refreshin' attitude.
Can't tell you how tired I am of hearing ECers complain about California.
I'll be the first to tell you ( okay, maybe the second ) there are some major
probs here, but be real , which place doesn't?
Besides, ya gotta love a place that is aka "lala land". : )
Subj: DW Fan Club 95-02-14 01:57:43 EDT
From: Cmdr Marc
Posted on: America Online
DW
It's been a few weeks since I was last on-line. Of all the wonderful folks in cyberland, I missed you. Keep telling it like it is. Hollywood is a business, not Fantasyland.
Marc Freedman
Subj: Re:DW Fan Club 95-02-14 03:26:17 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Ah, but dream a little dream for me. Okay, DW??????
A Fan Too
BKitty
Subj: Re:LA or Bust 95-02-14 13:44:10 EDT
From: Dspr
Posted on: America Online
Thanks all, for your responses- sarcastic and otherwise- I know I am niave but hey, you only live once....
Am greatly enjoying your posts, even learning something. As for greatest city to live in, Rome works if you never need anything from a government agency...
Arriving in LA in September- expect to see my name nowhere soon...
MHinSF
What is average rent for a one bedroom in West Hollywood?
Subj: Re:DW Fan Club 95-02-14 15:46:46 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Marc, you are missing the whole point of Hollywood!
Take two acid tabs and call me in the morning.
Subj: Filmmaker 95-02-14 15:58:07 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Anybody here know anything about a poster known as Filmmaker, aka Charles Catayo, claiming to be an agent setting up shop in Florida?
Subj: Re:DW Fan Club 95-02-14 18:27:18 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Cmdr - Welcome back. AOL is a business as well and that bill tends to get high with all this chip-talk. One good thing - as we flagellate novitiates
(issat a word?) it only reinstills the truth in myself. And this one above all others, uttered as a commencement speech by the honourable Winston Churchill -
"Never, never, never, never, never, never, never give up."
Amen.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:DW Fan Club 95-02-14 18:28:52 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
BKitty - How could ANYONE not honor a request from one with an ID such as the one you've chosen? With that handle, you just GOTTA be az good person. And I got enough dreams for the both of us, schweetheart.
(debits to Bogey.)
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:DW Fan Club 95-02-14 20:04:14 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Ah Shucks DW,
But Thanks for the grin ya put on my face.
Hope you and yours have a great Valentines Day----- My Sweetie is out
of town . : ( He is the one who gave me my nickname. You might not
think me such a good person ( though I am ) if ya knew what the B stood
for in my name. ; )
Subj: AGAPE 95-02-18 00:17:28 EDT
From: SawyersDad
Posted on: America Online
Anyone ever heard or worked with AGAPE PRODUCTIONS in Flat Rock, Indiana?
Subj: Getting an agent. 95-02-19 20:41:19 EDT
From: Atomhead
Posted on: America Online
I'm on my third draft. Time to secure an agent. What's the feeling on the smaller agencies in areas outside of L.A. such as in Portland or Phoenix or Seattle? I sent out query letters to a dozen agents and only had 2 responces, they were promising but is there a better way of getting my screenplay read?
Subj: Re:Getting an agent. 95-02-21 04:46:51 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
Someone just sold a script for $300,000 against $600,000 being represented by an agent in Denver, I think, who worked with one of the agencies here. Out of towners may have less access, but if their connections are good and the material is right...
Subj: Outside L.A. Agents. 95-02-23 14:53:58 EDT
From: Atomhead
Posted on: America Online
Is it worth obtaining an agent outside of L.A.? Has anyone reached any success this way? The WGA has many agents listed, but its been hard to get a responce from those in L.A. I've had many agents wanting me to send them my screenplay, but they work in Portland, Seattle, Phoenix ect.
Subj: Re:Outside L.A. Agents. 95-02-23 16:40:37 EDT
From: FJFK
Posted on: America Online
I know someone who has had terrific success with a NYC-based agent. Industry-wise, that's not too far from LA. Beyond there, it might be risky but probably can't hurt to try.
Subj: Re:Outside L.A. Agents. 95-02-23 17:50:40 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
There are agents here in LA not on the WGA list, too. BEing on the list means they are kosher agents and work with signatories. I don't think the geography means that much -- you could find unwholesome people anywhere, but the real McCoy agents are mostly around where the deals happen: midtown Manhattan and Beverly Hills being the epicenters.
Subj: Re:Outside L.A. Agents. 95-02-24 01:47:52 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
Agents in LA/NY probably have a little more schmooze access than regional agents, and some, more weight. But a GOOD agent is a good agent. Do they believe in your work? Do they have taste? Do they have contacts? Will they get it "seen"?
What really matters is the material, and that's up to you.
Subj: 8x10 Publicity Photos 95-03-03 09:27:02 EDT
From: MikesterC
Posted on: America Online
Hi! If your looking for great quality, low price and quick turnaround for your 8x10's, Precision Photos is the place to go! Just e-mail me and I'll get a price list out you pronto!
MikesterC
Subj: RE: Agents 95-03-04 13:15:09 EDT
From: KevWilliam
Posted on: America Online
Agents are absolutely a good idea. The trick is finding a good one. After I completed my very first screenplay ever--I went looking for an agent. I went through friends of friends of friends...a lady I met while walking my dog had a brother who was a literary agent who she claimed was wonderful. I sent him my script. He called me two days later wanting to meet with me. He also asked that I bring six copies of the script. (That should have tipped me off but I was green.) Upon the first five minutes, he was talking strategy and had his assistant bring in contracts for me to sign. I told him that he was the first agent to read my script and I wasn't prepared to make such a quick decision. He threw me out of his office--literally.
I was very discouraged but also delighted that he was so hot for the script. That meant maybe someone else would be too. My best friend called in a favor of an agent (a big one) and asked him to read my script. A week later he wanted to sign me. I met with him--he was great. Said all the right things. Night and day from the other one. He let me take my time to decide. Incouraged me to meet with other agents. He knew what he was doing. A very smart guy.
Two weeks later, I signed with his agency. He asked me who I would like to direct my movie. I told him a certain big name director I thought was perfect. One week later, that director was attached to my script. The next week is was the subject of a bidding war. I just completed rewrites and am busy writing my second spec.
I know this is highly unusual and I'm very fortunate to have sold my first writing ever--but it can be done. And an agent is crucial. But to get a good one--you must first have a good script. My script wasn't some brilliant piece of writing. In fact, it was very raw. (I read it now and cringe.) But it took a familiar story and set of ideas and manipulated them into something that seemed original at the time. I knew in order to put myself on the map, I had to have a gimmick. My first script was all about attracting attention to myself as a writer. A very calculated business move.
Good luck finding that great agent.
Kev
Subj: Re: Kev's Agent 95-03-04 16:07:35 EDT
From: SamRussAdm
Posted on: America Online
Key
Great post. It's nice to hear someone tell how they got an agent, admit their luck but acknowledge the planning and work that went into it. You mention all the elements of success -- skill, perseverance and luck -- in one blessedly short post.
Subj: Re:RE: Agents 95-03-04 23:08:16 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Kev - "Very fortunate" to sell your first writing ever? Next time you're at a 7-11, will you pick up a handful of lottery tickets for me? Wow - what a story. Congratulations and gooxd luck. And, as your story shows, there's much more involved than the ability to write a good script. You must persevere and a healthy dose of luck helps.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:RE: Agents 95-03-05 17:33:31 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Kev -- you obviously have very good business sense as well as a flair for screenwriting. Which is more important in the clutch?
Subj: Re:RE: Agents 95-03-05 18:58:34 EDT
From: KevWilliam
Posted on: America Online
Which is more important in the clutch? The ability to write or a good business sense?
Equal parts of both and a large, wooden stirring spoon.
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-07 15:57:00 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
Kev,
Great news! I signed with the first agent who'd have me and was tied up for two years. This time I got smart and found the agent I REALLY wanted, then let her know how much I specifically wanted HER. I signed last week.
It can be done.
-- Tracie
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-07 19:33:50 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
Tracie,
Condragulations...now about that script...:)
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-07 20:24:32 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Maybe we should get all the paperwork together to classify this as a
MIRACLE!!!!!
Are there any former Catholics who could help determine the validitity
of this ? <VBG>
Subj: Re:FINDING SCRIPTS 95-03-08 00:35:13 EDT
From: LGrillo
Posted on: America Online
Being a producer, it's very hard to find great scripts. Great scripts -- different, oozing with raw talent -- are hard to come by. That's why Hollywood pays so much for them before they butcher them due to production and budget limitations.
Talent bubbles to the surface, if you're truly talented. Most scripts are derivative however.
If there is truly a great script -- low-medium budget -- I'd love to hear a synopsis of the story. PLease Email me and I'll send you a fax number for the synopsis --
this is not a treatment -- just a synopsis first.
I have been looking for bullet proof scripts for years. Would love to find one worthy of shopping around out here! Bottom line: I will put the deal together or finance it privately -- but I need the next "Pulp Fiction"!!
Leo Grillo
Subj: Berzon 95-03-08 12:52:41 EDT
From: SDG1212
Posted on: America Online
Anyone have any experience with Berzon Agency? Claim to be WGA signatories, but I don't find them listed on my most recent WGA list. Say they don't charge reading fees, but want scripts sent to their freelance readers FedEx morning delivery, plus $35 so that readers can FedEx scripts back to agency. They do offer "free" critique and say the postage is deducted from any commissions they receive.
Thanks
SDG1212
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-08 13:20:42 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
There's a Marion Berzon Agency in Costa Mesa listed in the Hollywood directory. Are they of whom you speak? If so, they may be legit, just far away from the action. It sounds like it could get pretty expensive if you don't sell something. And $35 for Fed Ex sounds like some extra "handling charges" included.
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-08 17:21:43 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
I have a friend signed at Berzon. His agent doesn't return his calls. While it's better than nothing, his opinion is...just barely.
BTW, Berzon also has one of the highest client to agent ratios I know of; this probably explains why his agent doesn't get back to him -- he probably doesn't have the time.
-- Tracie
Subj: re:berzon 95-03-08 17:39:57 EDT
From: LLander
Posted on: America Online
Someone at Berzon requested one of my scripts, but they wanted a release and a photo first, then they said they'd tell me where to send the script to a reader. I sent the release and the photo, but they never got back to me. Same thing happened to a friend.
JoeRioux.
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-08 20:10:02 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Tracie -- if it's as you describe, then how is is even barely better than no agent at all -- doesn't return calls, far from the action, ladling office charges on clients. This does not sound right to me! For what reason would they be in Costa Mesa instead of on the West Side? The rent? The Spring-fresh air? Sounds scammy!
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-08 21:29:29 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
Pottree,
>Tracie -- if it's as you describe, then how is is even barely better than no agent at all?
Well, having a WGA agent means you can query production companies that don't accept unagented submissions. I once had an agent who DID return my calls, though he was not so great on actually querying or selling my work. Still, I sent out queries myself, and when people would call for the script I could just say "I'll have my agent send it."
Still, Berzon would be pretty far down my list of possibilities, just judging by what I've heard from their clients. They charge reading fees and handling fees and godknowswhat other fees, which doesn't jibe with what WGA signatory agents are supposed to do.
-- Tracie
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-09 02:12:37 EDT
From: Eliottt
Posted on: America Online
A couple of things. KevW's experience has NOTHING AT ALL to do with luck. Two agents wanted to sign him (her?) because the right words were on the page. As ugly and trying and dishonest as this business can be, the ultimate goal of any agent or producer is to find someone who can write, with a script that can be produced.
One more small opint -- you can't REALLY be locked into an agent/agency for two years. The standard agent-writer contract stiplates that they have to find you a job within 90 days or the contract's dissolved (at least that's how it was when I signed my first one 10 years ago).
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-09 02:45:01 EDT
From: SDG1212
Posted on: America Online
Mosqx: The Berzon Agency is the same as the Marion Berzon Agency w/offices in Costa Mesa and Glendale.
Llander: I also had to send photo and form. But instruction sheet says you have to call to get reader's name. That's when you get hit for the $35 in postage.
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-09 07:09:46 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
As an uneducated guess it sounds like this place is the place to avoid.
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-09 15:09:09 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
Eliott,
>The standard agent-writer contract stiplates that >they have to find you a job within 90 days or the >contract's dissolved (at least that's how it was >when I signed my first one 10 years ago).
You have to give them notice (I think in writing) and then the contract is dissoved 90 days thereafter, according to the last WGA rider I looked at.
-- Tracie
Subj: Looking... 95-03-09 17:58:23 EDT
From: RhondaCK
Posted on: America Online
I am organizing an online mystery writing conference to take place over several days on AOL around Halloween. Several published writers and other professionals have agreed to participate in online chats or panels. I'm looking for more writers, as well as agents, editors, publishers, and law enforcement and forensic professionals. Some conference activities take place already -- chats and critiques -- but an actual conference may be a first. Please e-mail me if you are interested in participating or helping out by monitoring and logging chats.
Rhonda Keith
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-09 21:45:21 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Again, woith the fees, the location, et al, the whole thing sounds fishy to me. Anyone ask the WGA why this outfit is on their list?
Subj: Re:Agents 95-03-09 21:46:59 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
A standard contract isn't what the fly-by-nights are having people sign. I had a recent offer from someone who wanted to tie me up for 14 months or something; these weird deals just ain't kosher and I think you are better off without an agent that with a leech.
Subj: Re:Berzon 95-03-10 18:00:56 EDT
From: BKittyLynn
Posted on: America Online
Doesn't sound like an uneducated guess to me.
There is enough info about them on this board to make quite
an educated guess.
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-11 17:52:55 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Four seasons ago I was a "lowly assistant" for a major Agency.
You can dissolve a relationship if you have not found a job in 90 days with an agent. Furthermore, even if someone got you a job and you hate them, you can sign with a different agent and just pay your previous agent 10% for the job he got you.
There is no doubt that any agent is better than none. Get an agent, if you're not happy, shop around but do not fire your first agent until you have a new one.
As for lying. Believe me, lying is not an innovation no one else has thought of. If you don't check out(and they do check) you are disregarded as another scammer and your script is tossed.
As an assistant to an agent most of my reading time was devoted to reading the new material of his more than 40 clients. And I did not have that much reading time. An agency does much more than just discover people. My boss would be in the office before me and would be on the phone almost constantly. I would be logging checks, preparing submissions and keep every clients calendar. Every lunch my boss has and most of his dinner's and breakfasts were spent negotiating. And then he would go home and make more calls.
Remember how busy a good agent is. If you do get on the line with them (or their lowly assistant) keep your call short and to the point. It is definitely appreciated. If someone called too often and bugged me or was ever rude you can be sure that their script went straight to the can. Life is too short and you don't want to take on a client who would be a pest.
I don't mean to sound discouraging. It's just that people seem to think there is a comspiracy to keep new people out. That's not it. It is a business and it takes a lot of time.
What makes it harder for legitimate people who try to break in are all the nuts out there. People who call in saying that "They wrote Beverly Hills Cop and Eddie Murphy stole it from their dreams" (it happened!!) That's why production companies cannot accept unsolicitated material. Too many nuts with lawyers.
As for sending a SASE. Personally, I think that when you send material you should keep the master and expect that it won't ever be returned. Just make sure it is registered with WGA. And there is no telling how long it takes for a script to be read. Sometimes I could go a month without having time to read new submissions. And the readers, who are paid $50-100 a script are usually reading green-lighted scripts for actors or directors. The paid readers are not usually used for reading "submitted for representation" material.
Sub agents and Agents in training often do their own reading and are looking for clients. They are found at big agencies. I think they are your best bet.
Internships and writing plays are another way of landing an agent.
A new unestablished client takes much more work than an established client. And the money is 10 times less. That is why an agent with huge prestigious clients is not likely to take on a newcomer no matter how talented. It wouldn't be fair to his other clients.
Most agents do not really recognise good material. They are plugged into the grapevine and know when someone has a buzz about them and how much they can push for someone. Creative people, people in production recognise good writing and will recommend them to agents. Agents are not, by and large, creative people. A good agent is a shrewd businessman. He is not looking to better the cultural landscape. A lot of them are nice people and care about their clients personally and professionally.
If someone agrees to read your material, be patient. A few short, polite reminder phone calls can be made but don't bug them. As for notes saying they got the script, your dreaming. I would send out a pile of mail
two feet high every day and that was just regarding the clients we represented.
And you should never have to pay a reading fee or for postage. That is illegal.
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-11 18:55:56 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
GT,
Thanks for nice post.:) Now that you're not a lowly assistant what are you doing? :-)
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-11 19:00:02 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
More good stuff, GT.
Subj: Re:New Guy Needs Advice 95-03-11 22:28:47 EDT
From: Eagle nine
Posted on: America Online
Why not get a 1-800 Number? Tha way they don't have an excuse for not calling, even if it's to say "get lost, buddy."
Another way, besides the SASE is to include a short form requesting a "quick reply" asking them to let you know if they received the material.
Once you know they received it, you can wait for a call in your 1-800 number or at least count the weeks so you can give them a call.
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-12 13:49:54 EDT
From: Mkwordd
Posted on: America Online
GThawk:
Thanks for opening a window and letting some fresh air in here! It'll be interesting to see how far precise, accurate information goes in this folder! ; )
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-12 17:39:33 EDT
From: Killlian
Posted on: America Online
Great post! I think any writer who takes his craft seriously could do far worse for himself then print that one out and tape it to his monitor. Ex lowely assistant might suggest that you've graduated to bigger and better things. If writing is one of them.... Good Luck!
Killlian
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-13 03:05:35 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Thanks for the kind words. I did graduate to writing. I've written for four years on three different TV shows.
I posted a note in the TV WRITERS Q&A folder (Agents & Time 3/12/95) Regarding the best time of year to find a TV agent.
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-13 03:15:19 EDT
From: Killlian
Posted on: America Online
Your voice is the most refreshing around. Good Luck again!
Sincerely
Killllian
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-13 15:14:35 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Hooray -- finally someone who agrees, point for point, with the ideas I've been spouting here for a while... and from an inside prespective, too!
So, lowly, whatcha up to now? You know how things work -- how has it helped you turn straw into gold?
Subj: Re:An Ex Lowly Assistant 95-03-13 18:53:42 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
GThawk - Good post. Thanks for sharing. Always nice to have the basics of writer/agent reinforced.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: I NEED A AGENT 95-03-15 15:05:55 EDT
From: RBantum
Posted on: America Online
I am a CPA, Computer programmer, and former U.S. government accountant. Every now and again I like to see a movie that makes you THINK!!! Mainly because the storyline might come true someday. I have drawn upon my actual experiences as the basis for writing this screen play which is similar to a Tom Clancey novel. This sreeen play if produced on a MASSIVE SCALE can have the same impact on the later part of this decade and the year 2000 and beyond as the book and film "1984" had in the 60's and 70's. Here are some of the concepts that are a part of my screenplay.
* A presidential campaign utilizing personal computer multimedia campaigning with assistance from a Bill Gates of Microsoft type character.
* The first Black President of the United States with a female Vice President
* Talk TV's impact on a presidential campaign.
* An ACTUAL solution to the budget deficit, unemployment, and crime problem of the US that may even work if implemented
* An armed conflict between the US and S. Africa with nuclear weapon usage as a outgrowth of problems with whites and the current Mandela government
* A civil war type conflict between black and white U.S. combat troops while deployed to fight the white S. African resistance fighters.
* A rewriting of the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights
* KGB medical experiments which can alter physical and DNA human components.
* Political characters in the mold of Bill Clinton and Ross Perot
All of these concepts and MORE are neatly woven in a techno/political triller that will leave you spellbound. I am looking for a agent, director, producer, or actor that would be interested. This screenplay has national and international implications and would be best suited for a BIG TIME studio with mega stars. PLEASE contact me at my E-Mail address which is RBantum. Or call me at (410)922-3520 or write me at.
Raymond Bantum CPA,CDP,CMC
4110 Balmoral Circle
Baltimore, Md 21208
Subj: Re:I NEED A AGENT 95-03-15 22:23:45 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
To all - Well ... who goes first?
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Buying Short Story Rights 95-03-15 23:07:36 EDT
From: NYRoach
Posted on: America Online
I am trying to option the film rights to a short story, and have most of the pieces in place, except I'd like to narrow down the price range. I'd like to spend $500 for a 1 year option, non-applicable, with a purchase price under $7500-$10,000. Has anyone out there done this? How much did you pay? What were the total legal fees you accrued relative to the option purchase? Did your purchase agreement cover: royalties for the author; tv series and mini-series clauses? Etcetera.
Subj: Re:I NEED A AGENT 95-03-16 10:48:48 EDT
From: Killlian
Posted on: America Online
<<All of these concepts and MORE are neatly woven in a techno/political triller that will leave you spellbound.>>
I have a feeling that this script violates the 120 page rule. Might I recommend a novel?
<< I am looking for a agent, director, producer, or actor that would be interested>>
You might consider starting with Tracie's workshop.
<< This screenplay has national and international implications and would be best suited for a BIG TIME studio with mega stars.>>
Have you discussed this project with Oliver Stone yet? <G> Just kidding of course, but I would recommend remaining faithful to your writing and not worrying about Big Time Studios and Mega Stars.
Just my tid bit.
Killian
Subj: Re:I NEED A AGENT 95-03-16 15:11:23 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I just can't bring myself to begin, unless the CPA knows of some clients who could benefit from a writeoff and could bring some bucks as attachments. But then, Mr. Kelly of TV fame is a lawyer
Subj: Re:RE:Using Agents 95-03-16 21:55:44 EDT
From: FORPETERB
Posted on: America Online
Unless you are published or famous your chances of geting a good agent are almost nil. Any one else is usually out for a fast buck and specialize in preying on authors. On the other hand don,t let that stop you from sticking it in the face of everyone, their brother and the horses they rode in on. Remember the Stallone situation with Rocky, it could happen to you!
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-27 08:41:27 EDT
From: TOMEETOE
Posted on: America Online
A brief story about Berzon:
Last summer, my partner & I wrote a script for a TV sitcom, and a sci-fi movie. Hmm, that was fun, but to get someone to read 'em, more importantly to buy 'em, we need an agent. So, off to the Guide to Literary Agents & Art/Photo Reps, (Holm). We picked out about 8 who accepted new writers. Called them up, and they all pretty much wanted the same thing: cover letter with brief bio, a photo, and a 30-40 word query (pitch) on each screenplay. So off they went. With SASE. Four never came back ( I guess they needed the stamps), three said not interested for various reasons, and Marion Berzon Agency said, hey, send your stuff! Here's who to send it to, include $34.75 for FedEx, copies etc. Well, that seems a little odd, but OK. The two scripts went to two different readers, each specializing in a particular format.
Within 2 weeks we had excellent critiques, with good suggestions and points about the scripts, both character/plot, and technical info (big on absolutely correct format). Both readers recommended that the agent represent us, pending rewrites. So we polished our pencils, and dug in and finished two much better scripts, but had to send them back to the same readers....with another $34.75. Hmmmmm.
OK, so, they both say the scripts are pretty much ready to go. We call up the agency, he says "come on down, we'll sign you up, make us all rich, etc, etc." Oh, and bring 12 copies of each script. He sends a copy of the contract, a bunch of stuff about the agency, articles about script writing. All pretty professional.
Well, OK. So off we flew to California.
He wants us to have photos made, he recommends a photographer (who does a good job--anybody need a publicity photo of us?)
Finally, to the Agent. Friday afternoon, 4pm. The office is in Glendale, near the LA zoo. In we go. It is pretty small, crammed with photos, scripts, video tapes, two assistants. We meet the agent, who certainly talks the part, but doesn't really look it. He does look abit frazzled, but not the Hollywood type at all.
He talks about getting the script out, using a courier service to hand deliver the scripts, making promo pitch tapes ($1,000) and talks off different tangents, and then it's time to go. Oh, how about some money for the courier service?
What can I say? We were so surprised that we forked over a small check.
Another, "hmmmmm."
Back home we go. Eight weeks go by, a call, "send more scripts, more pitch sheets, more $$ for the courier. Got lots of interest in this one, it could be a bidding war!"
Hey, wait a minute. Where did the first $$ go? You promised a detailing of who the scripts were sent to.
"Don't worry, we'll get all that later...." This time a big "Hmmmmm"
Bottom line? Here's what I think. Berzon uses a massive "shotgun" approach to selling screenplays. He accepts most anything that is coherent, in the right format, and even possibly saleable. He probably sends them out to anybody he can. But the important point is that he gets the writers to finance it. They pay for copies, for postage, for anything he can get them to pay for.
Illegal? I don't know. Unethical. That's what they tell me.
What should we do? We don't know. Saying you have representation has opened a couple of doors for us. Is it worth it? You tell me.
Sorry for the long post, but I really wanted everybody to hear this. Thanks.
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-27 13:28:31 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
A very clear picture.
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-27 15:42:38 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
To me, this whole thing sounds like a SCAM! Are these guys kosher by the WGA?
And, I don't think it is really legal to require the photos -- tat could be interpreted as insiting on knowing things like age, race, and gender.
Any legal beagles out there with an opinion?
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-27 17:02:48 EDT
From: JoRioux
Posted on: America Online
Thanks for the story.
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-27 18:13:19 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I worked in a very large agency and I know people in other agencies around town. Never have I heard of any literary agent needing photos. And, having worked for almost four years for a literary agent I can tell you that there is never a need for photos. (Studios do not care what their writers look like.)
Agencies are only allowed to charge a 10% commissions on salaries that they negotiated. (There like program fees and residuals are non-commissionable unless the agent negotiated for a higher residual than what is described in the WGA minimum basic agreement. And then, they can only commission the difference between the amount they negotiated and the minimum. This is rare.)
There should be no other client fees. Period. A lot of unethical talent agencies get by this *law* by requiring, or strongly suggesting that potential clients have their photos done by a photographer they prefer. They receive a kick back from the photographer. This is a scam. I've never heard of a literary agent using this scam mainly because writers don't need photos. But I guess not all writers know this. Your agent doesn't need photos if you are a writer. If you write a movie that is a huge hit and the studio needs a publicity photo, they will provide a photographer and pay for the production of the photos.
Agents should not make you pay for copying or couriers. You should never have to make copies of your script other than a copy you wish to keep for yourself, and in fact, they will often make you a copy for that reason if you request it.
This is illegal. I suspect that they are not franchised by the WGA and if they are they won't be much longer if you report this to the WGA and the Los Angeles Chamber of Commerce.
I personally am revolted by what I've read. And you should be mad as hell.
Subj: Re: Talking to Agents 95-03-27 18:19:08 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I just spoke to my agent and was reminded of another important time consideration if you are looking for representation.
Every agency in L.A. uses a messenger services which makes a run to all the studios. If you messenger something through "the run", packages costs about 50 cents each to deliver. So assistants try to use the run as much as possible. The pick up time varies for each agency but it is right around lunch time. Therefore, every morning is spent getting things ready before the messenger comes. It's not a good idea to call before 2:00 in the afternoon because chances are you will get a harried assistant who is much too busy to talk about representation at that time.
Just a little tip.
Subj: Re: Talking to Agents 95-03-27 20:19:51 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
GT,
Thank you for the words of wisdom.
E
Subj: Re: Berzon Reprise 95-03-27 22:32:58 EDT
From: Stryklone
Posted on: America Online
Hey, that's my story, and verbatim, too, except the price quoted me on the "audio demo" was $2000 (I turned it down 6 months ago. Maybe that's why you were quoted only $1000). My 6-month contractual limit before backing out expires at midnight TONIGHT, so now I can start the agent shuffle all over again. Whoopee.
Yes, I'm pissed. It was a nice visit with some of my old acting buddies and that's the only good thing that came from it. Well, not the first time a writer has been wronged in Tinseltown and not the last, either.
Subj: Re:RE:Using Agents 95-03-28 01:48:08 EDT
From: AMV Esq
Posted on: America Online
Excuse my intrusion but not all artist reps., agents, etc. are out to make a fast buck or take advantage of the unsuspecting writer. I work with several promising writers and other artists. I devote a great deal of time and effort to ensure their projects are properly presented. I donot make outrageous promises; I promise only that their project will be handled in a professional manner with personal attention from me. I am sorry that some of you have had less than stellar experinces with agents, etc. Like every profession there are the good and the bad: agents, writers... it makes no difference. Be cautious - but donot condem the lot because of a few dishonorable members. I wish you all much success with your careers .
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-28 02:47:16 EDT
From: SDG1212
Posted on: America Online
Thanks, Tomeetoe
I think I just figured out how to save my next $34.75.
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-28 02:49:25 EDT
From: SDG1212
Posted on: America Online
One of the things that made me suspicious was that their letterhead has WGA and SGA, etc. written all over it. But they don't appear on my most recent list of agents from the WGA.
Subj: Re: Note to TOMEETOE 95-03-28 04:05:39 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
You mentioned that you found the critique from the Berzon Agency helpful, and there's no doubt that it's good to get a professional opinion from someone who is not worried about hurting your feelings. If you'd like to have other work critiqued without having to deal with shady characters like the agency you described you might want to try looking at the catalogs of film schools.
U.C.L.A. extension and, I believe AFI offer critiques of work for just about the same money you paid Berzon (about $30.00). I know people who found this very beneficial. And, if you don't live in L.A. you can submit a script for critique through the mail.
You can call and ask for a course catalog from either school and it will list the people doing the critiques.
Subj: Re:RE:Using Agents 95-03-28 04:17:31 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I agree with AMV Esq. that there are a lot of good agents and managers out there. Heck, I have friends whose agent picks them up from the airport!!
But L.A. is the city of dreamers and it seems like every messenger is a rock and roll star and every waiter has an 8x 10 glossy . And everyone is working on a screenplay.
And there are definately people here waiting to prey on all the unsuspecting dreamers. But if you know how things work, you won't be taken.
Most successful artists owe a lot of what they've achieved to their agents and the people who represent them. I owe my agent my entire career.
Subj: agents 95-03-28 09:15:58 EDT
From: TOMEETOE
Posted on: America Online
Well, it's good to know we weren't the only ones to get caught with an open check book. So it's back to the Great Agent Hunt for us--AMV Esq, are you looking for some new talent. See ya at the Awards show next year.....
Subj: Re:RE:Using Agents 95-03-28 09:30:10 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
AMV,
I think they were only speaking of one agency and not the whole lot. By the way, welcome to the lion's den.:)
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-28 18:55:48 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Thanks on 2 counts:
For confirming my opinion that this type of behavior is a scam designed to take the rubes, and that bona fides never charge clients for things like photocopies (I mean, come ON! They have all those goodlooking Gen Xers in the bowels of the building churning them out day and night!)...
And, for saying that when I don't get an assignment, it is not because of my looks.
One less thing to worry about!
Subj: Re: A Berzon Story 95-03-28 18:58:43 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
If Berzon is claiming to be kosher by the WGA but is NOT, I strongly suggest those who feel wronged rat 'em to the WGA legal department -- pronto!
Subj: Re:RE:Using Agents 95-03-28 19:00:22 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
You owe your agent your career?
Pray your agent doesn't try to collect!
Remember, you're paying for the boat slip!
Subj: Re:Hi Pottree 95-03-28 19:13:14 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
The boat slip?!
Subj: Re:agents 95-03-28 22:54:28 EDT
From: Stryklone
Posted on: America Online
No, I'm not irritated at all agents or even at the process, only at those who give a good industry a bad name.
Subj: Re: agents2 95-03-28 23:32:45 EDT
From: Stryklone
Posted on: America Online
... and I'm too old for naivete, it's just that my life is less stressful if I think the best of a person until they prove otherwise.
Subj: Re: agents2 95-03-31 00:17:15 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
I guess I'm lucky. My first agent didn't actually SELL anything, but he never charged me postage, phone expenses, or anything else. Neither does my current agent.
Anyone who believes in you enough to take you on should believe in you enough to foot things like phone bills and postage. If they're not confident of their ability to sell your work and therefore recoup their investment a thousandfold-plus, they're not real agents, imo.
-- Tracie
Subj: Re:Hi Pottree - boat slip 95-03-31 15:07:07 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
The boat slip is a term that means money you pay to someone, usually that you can ill-afford, and that they use for something that you can't afford yourself. When you lay a mechanic $675 to do some car repair that you might have done yourself for $15, he's raking it in on you and his range of suckers and using the money for high living. You might also say the payment on the Rolls or the daily lunches at the Four Seasons.
Subj: Re: agents2 > stress 95-03-31 15:08:39 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
You may be less stressed in the short term by thinking the best of people (a trait I admire but am not good at sharing) but you could be doubly stressed out later when someone turns out to be oneof the no-goodniks.
What are your odds?
Subj: d.h. Talent Agency 95-03-31 19:20:19 EDT
From: JeffBJames
Posted on: America Online
If anyone out there knows either good or bad things about a talent agency called d.h.Talent Agency in Los Angeles, please let me know.
You can e-mail me at JeffBJames.
Anything that anyone knows about this agency would be very helpful.
Thanks.
Subj: Re:Hi Pottree - boat slip 95-04-01 01:42:39 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I guess I just had a hard time imagining my agent on a boat, he's not exactly the outdoorsy type.
But, I still believe I owe my career to my agent. I was an actress and performed with a sketch comedy troop, so I had to write my own material. I usually got good reviews for my performances but rave reviews for the material. My agent is the one who convinced me to pursue a career in writing.
And I do not feel that I am paying him money that I can ill afford because the first job he got me paid more than five times what I was making as a secretary.
And during the lean times he has lent me money interest free and even co-signed the loan on my car. In fact, I couldn't get a car loan (since it was a '62 Studebaker Hawk GT, and no bank would give me an auto loan on such an old car) He pulled strings with the bank his agency uses and got me a personal loan.
So you see, there are some good guys out there. My agent and my car (which is so beautiful) have never let me down.
And now you know what my screen name means.
Subj: Re: agents2 > stress 95-04-02 16:46:35 EDT
From: Stryklone
Posted on: America Online
Nahh, not doubly stressed later or even singly. It's simply a matter of recognizing there are different creatures and different people and the motivations aren't always clear -- the old "Would you blame a snake for biting you?" argument or not be surprised, because the snake is doing what comes naturally?
I just go in hitting all the legal numbers and let people reveal themselves rather than me make assumptions which can really mess things up. The only incidents which really irritate me for longer than 2 seconds are when people go out of their way to hurt other people.
No worries, mate.
Subj: Re:Hi Pottree - boat slip 95-04-03 13:27:18 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
It's always great to hear a positive and heartwarming story! Too bad most writers aren't the adorable, female, sketch-comedy type... many of us are not so loveable either.
Hope your agent and car continune to offer good service.
Maybe one day you can start sharing your garage with an Avanti!
Subj: ICM defection 95-04-03 15:04:04 EDT
From: Kyesekiya
Posted on: America Online
any thoughts on what the defection of the ICM agents might mean to screenwriters.
they were literary agents. does that mean that screenwriters are gaining in status and money?
Subj: Stress 95-04-04 03:00:25 EDT
From: MurphWrite
Posted on: America Online
Ah, Pottree, "What are the odds?"
I always allow as how everybody on God's earth has a 50/50 chance of being an ass!
Subj: Re: Pottree 95-04-04 09:07:47 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Did I come off as adorable? Damn.
I've always wanted to be edgy, dangerous, the kind of person who uses swears words in her posts. Straight up, no asterisks. Yeah, I read the terms of service agreement, I'm swearing anyway.
I'm gonna beat this adorable rap. : )
P.S. If you know of a homeless Avanti I have a nice warm garage for it!!
Subj: Re:Stress 95-04-04 13:42:02 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Murph,
You are much more generous than I am!
Subj: Re: Avanti 95-04-04 13:43:49 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
If I knew of a homeless Avanti, I might be temped to jump on it myself!
It's not so bad to be adorable, as long as you have mettle in your heart.. something like Goldie Hawn or Lucille Ball.
You catch more flies with sweetness than you do with sour puss.
Subj: Stress 95-04-05 01:58:42 EDT
From: MurphWrite
Posted on: America Online
LOL! But seriously, what gets me is that in H'wood (and creative endeavors all over) the powers always seem to go with the "known ***holes" just because they *know* them. Sheesh!
I finally got a mouse. I'm about to point, click and post. So exciting!
Subj: Re:Stress 95-04-05 02:51:06 EDT
From: ScrWrtr
Posted on: America Online
Murph,
Yes, fear is a factor. Fear of not feeding your kids, paying the rent, or of becoming a, gawd forbid, a...a producer.:)
Subj: Re:Stress 95-04-05 15:05:58 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I became a producer at one point in my checkered career and lived to tell the tale. It isn't nearly so bad as putting the kiddies to bed with empty stomachs!
Subj: Re:Stress 95-04-05 16:58:28 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Yeah, this is smart. Let's start crapping on producers now. Nobody really wants to work anywhere, do they?
"YOU'LL NEVER WORK IN CYBERSPACE AGAIN!"
Naw, never mind. Crap away.
Subj: Re:Agent fees 95-04-05 19:31:23 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I've received a couple of e-mail questions regarding this so there must be some confusion, though it's really very simple.
An agent cannot charge you for expenses. An agent can only collect 10% of a fee that he negotiated for you. That's it. If anyone asks you to pay any money for anything, walk away. They are not legit.
Attorney's and Managers (who take anywhere from 5% to 25%, I don't believe they are limited to how much they can take. I'm not sure though) are allowed to charge for expenses. But if you are in a situation like this I would suggest you go over the expenses with a fine toothed comb. I worked for a short time for a publicist who had one huge music publishing client and the rest were actors and writers etc. It's very difficult to keep track of faxes, copies etc, so they would just charge the big music publishing client the bulk of the expenses and just sort of divvy up the rest. Very shady.
The agency business is very closely watched because there was a lot of abuse. Agents are also not allowed to force you to use a certain photographer (And again, writer's don't need photos!!!) or any sort of reading service, or any vendor of any kind. They may make recommendations, but they are not allowed to make that recommendation a condition of representation. That is another scam that some shady agencies were using and usually in those cases the agency received a kick-back from the vendor they are compelling prospective clients to use.
Do not have anything to do with an agent that asks you to pay for anything up front. They are not kosher and they will probably do you no good.
Subj: Re:Stress 95-04-06 08:57:22 EDT
From: Eurolydon
Posted on: America Online
Murph,
Me too! I just got a mouse in the house, but every time I point and click my wife gets mad. What am I doing wrong!?
Subj: Stress? 95-04-06 22:46:40 EDT
From: MurphWrite
Posted on: America Online
Yo, Eurolydon, er... I think you're supposed to use the mouse on the computer, not the wife. IMHO. :->
Subj: finding us agent 95-04-08 17:11:12 EDT
From: Mebrennan
Posted on: America Online
Dear Colleagues:
I have written a serial for the BBC as well as a number of documentaries and short films. I need an American agent -- just had a huge row with my British WMA representative -- and have never really had to set out on foot to find one before. I'm sure many of you would have excellent quick, concrete suggestions, which I would appreciate very much. Presently I am in Seattle to begin work on a doc set in Alaska, and would appreciate very much if you could send any e-mail on the subject to my American producer at mebrennan@aol.com. Thanks very much; happy to give London contacts in return. Also: I've been browsing this writer's club folder(s) and am curious about what seem to be a huge mass of contests -- does anyone have information, addresses, for these warners', disney, austin etc programs? Would appreciate it a good deal.
Thank you.
PS -- Have some Australian contacts as well, if these would be of use (perhaps more for a television than a film writer.)
Cheers.
Replies to:
TLJackson
c/o:
(e-mail)
mebrennan@aol.com
Subj: charging for screenplay 95-04-09 00:37:28 EDT
From: RB 571
Posted on: America Online
If you were an English teacher and a famous person wanted to pay you to write their screen play, how would you charge them?
Subj: Re:charging for screenplay 95-04-09 00:43:54 EDT
From: MSalsberg
Posted on: America Online
by the hour and take your time.
Subj: Re:charging for screenplay 95-04-09 00:49:46 EDT
From: RB 571
Posted on: America Online
What's the going hourly rate?
Subj: Re:charging for screenplay 95-04-09 05:05:03 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
If I were you I wouldn't write a word until an agreement is negotiated between the two of you and I would ask for much more than just an hourly rate.
The bulk of the money a writer makes is for the actual writing of the script.
If you are dealing with an individual, you probably cannot expect them to pay guild wages or even close, but I think a small fee up front is in order, in addition to an agreement for your participation in any profit the script should make. You could write a wonderful script and they could make a bundle and you'll have no part in it.
If they give you a really fleshed out outline then it would be fair to give them the "story" portion of the script and you would take the script portion. If the story is sketchy and you will be asked to come up with major plot points you should split the story fee.
If the person you are writing the script for plans on being in the room with you, helping with the writing you may want to split the script as well.
(By Guild fee schedules, the story counts for about one third of the fee and the first and final draft of the script make up the rest. In profit participation, you don't have to come up with actual numbers just percentages of the story and script. These fees will change depending on how the script is produced.)
All these things should be decided before you start writing. Once you start writing you may find that things change. In actuality, the division of labor is hardly ever the way you described it in the original agreement. Just do what's best for the script and a deal's a deal.
Even if this is a good friend of yours, you should have some sort of agreement. You'd be amazed at how people's perceptions are. You might think it's obvious that you are coming up with all the ideas while your collaborator thinks he's doing all the work. It has nothing to do with people trying to cheat you, it's just human nature, everyone thinks they are doing all the work.
Since it's rather unusual for an individual to hire someone to write a script, there really is no going rate for the up front fee. You're just gonna have to wing it there. But I would make it a lump sum rather than hourly because you should want to make it a good script (especially if you are participating in the possible profit!) and you should take as much time as is needed.
There are sample collaborator agreements you can follow. I believe you can get something like that from the Writer's Guild.
Or you can just write something yourselves and both of you sign it. Remember to include things like your possible credit. You don't want someone saying that they wrote the script alone.
This is a rather sensitive subject to broach with someone, but remember it protects both of you. There is nothing to stop you from taking this person's ideas and writing them on your own.
Talk with your collaborator, find out what he expects of you, write some informal notes and come up with an agreement. Then both of you should sleep on it and then sign. Then concentrate on writing the best script you can.
I have seen too many long-standing friendships break up, and wonderful projects blown to bits all because people were too shy to work things out first.
Writing is more than just knowing English. And if you have a talent for writing, and you are the one actually writing the script, you should be compensated. Everyone has great ideas, the execution is the hard part. That is the writing part.
The only reason you should accept an hourly fee is if you are simply taking dictation, editing and proofing it. But if you do any "writing". You are doing the hard part and should reap the benefits.
Subj: Re:Stress? Murphy & Euro 95-04-09 19:51:24 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Was that a mouse or a gerbil?
Subj: Re:charging for screenplay 95-04-09 19:54:17 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
With grammar like yours I would be embarassed to ask for much! Go back to school!
What makes you think an English teacher knows how to write a screenplay? What makes the famous person think so? Is there any truth to the theory?
And, most important: how much money does this fomous personage have and how much ego?
Subj: Re:Stress? Murphy & Euro 95-04-10 07:50:15 EDT
From: ScrWrtr
Posted on: America Online
Pott,
LOL. A mouse. I assure you it was a mouse.
ScrWrtr (Eurolydon)
Subj: re:charging 95-04-10 15:42:17 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
I lean toward charging something up front for script work. Some people think the fact that they have an idea constitutes their fifty per cent of the labor of writing a script. And if their ego is attached to their idea, and it needs to be modified in some way...I'm not sure a contract protects you in the end. And do they understand what's involved in the process of creating a story? The rewrites, even of good material if it doesn't quite serve the story as it comes to life on the page? Just be careful. I've ended up owning a half of something I couldn't sell in my own name. Worse, because of some hurt feelings, one project ended a friendship with someone I thought would be my friend for life. Have no oral agreements or understandings.
Subj: Re:re:charging 95-04-11 13:26:15 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
An oral agreement isn't worth the paper it's printed on!
(Famous Hollywood aphorism attributed to LB Mayer)
Subj: Re:WGA list 95-04-14 20:59:25 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
"Franchised" is the word often used. I don't know if it fits any legal definition, just a common reference.
Subj: Finding Agents! 95-04-16 20:44:43 EDT
From: AspasiaD
Posted on: America Online
Someone give me some good advice (maybe GThawk - I've been enjoying your commentary). I'm just another one of those wage slaves with dreams of someday being able to write and actually get paid for it... I have one finished screenplay and several others in various stages of development - but I haven't had much luck locating an agent. (I live in Seattle - that might be part of the problem.) I followed the instructions in several "Sell Your Screenplay" type of books, sent out over 200 well-written (in my opinion) query letters and got not a single answer back. What should my next step be? How does one locate an agent to believe in you?
Subj: Re:Finding Agents! 95-04-17 15:20:06 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
>How does one locate an agent to believe in you?<
Ah, the question of the Century! You're on your way to becoming a real writer!
Subj: Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-19 22:34:16 EDT
From: EvilCabal
Posted on: America Online
Hey, please dont bust my bubble. I want to keep this little boost to my sagging ego--at least for a few hours longer. Today, on my cheap answering machine I got a message requesting a script from a Hollywood agent I queried way back in December.
Because I live in the Midwest, I was impressed that he felt I was worthy of the $1.50 it might have cost to call me cross-country rather than send a letter.
My twisted mind starts working: Maybe the reason it took so long is that he bumped into a hot star that would be perfect for the role. Or knows some production company thats dying to pay $4 Mil for a script just like that.
Frantic now, salivating, the agent trudges back to his office:
Agent: Wheres that query, Agnes?
Agnes: Query...?
He probably had to dig it out of the Hollywood land fill, wipe away the grit smearing the phone number, rush back to the office, hoping some other agent hadnt snapped me up first.
Hmmmmm.......
Hey, Im entitled to dream a little. Anyway:
Does a phone call from an agent rate any higher on the expectation meter than a form letter?
(Needless to say, its the first telephonic response for me.)
And get this: I never even completed the script he called about.
This brings up an even more important question: Should you send out queries before your script is a final draft?
Now Im debating whether I should call this guy and give him a stall. Or should I throw a rewrite on that baby and ship if off in, say, two weeks. But then:
You never get a first chance to make a second impression...Or is it first impression to make a second chance...or is it.... Well, you know what I mean.
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-19 22:53:16 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Evil - First off, depends on the agent. As many others on these boards will attest, there "agents" and there are REAL agents. Also, if you send out a query letter w/o a finished script, what the hell kinda game are you playing? Time is very precious. You take the time to query about a script that isn't even done, resulting in an agent's expenditure of time for some that isn't even done and now we burn unregainable minutes yakking about something that isn't even done.
Besides - when you finish it, it ain't finished. There are so few one-pass scripts that sell it ain't worth talking about. How's about a couple rewrites?
Last script I optioned was gone over maybe 6 times before I really felt it was at least ok.
It's games like yours that give the rest of us a real hard time. Next time I query an agent he/she will be thinking "Does this guy really have the script he's offering or is he dreaming like ol' Evil?"
When a dog chases a car, he should know what to do if he catches it.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-20 02:32:19 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
Kinda stuck between the rock...
Because the agent's calling now, may only mean he just got around to it. But a phone call is good.
Unfortunately, you don't have the script he's calling about. If you don't call him back, you come off as a flake. If you do call and say you haven't finished the script, you come off as a flake. Probably best to say you got some other reactions from friends since querying and decided to do some more work on it. But whether he'll be open when you're ready is another matter.
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-20 12:11:34 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Evil--GET THIS--you piss me off. You got an actual telephone call from an agent (let's assume for the sake of arguement that he's a REAL agent, as DW would say)--a PHONE CALL, mind you--about a script you queried him about that WASN'T EVEN FINISHED. I'd say that you are at the top of today's ham-slapping list, brother. What WERE you thinking about.
You just give Mr. Agent my number and have him call me. I've GOT finished scripts.
Barring that, set your ass down at the word-processor and finish the damn thing. Tell Mr. Agent that "you're just about done with your latest pass and you want to be able to show him your best, so you'll have the script to him in two weeks." But make sure you can PITCH the whole thing before you call.
Jeez....
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-20 14:54:38 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Aw, don't let them cow you too much, Mid-West.
The odds are the agent who called is a crook looking for a juicy mark (I am from NY and LA, you see; we think that way). You didn't say what agency the call came from. If it was a biggie (eg, Morris, ICM, CAA, etc.) you should try to return the call. That will probably take a while (phone tag) and in the meantime, get your ass in gear and finish the script.
If you do talk to the agent, and the agent is bona fide, you could always say that you are not completely satisfied with the script and have a few changes (they will understand that!) you're making and ask nicely about the nature of the interest and how pressing it is to have a script in hand -- when they need it. For example, if it's for a client who is in Tahiti and won't be back until July, you can promise to have it there before that time and then see what kind of reaction you get. The agent may want to talk about the project and not even be interested in the script. But do call back and see where you stand... don't just try to bask in the soft warm glow of the call!
And next time, follow the advice of the posters above, or I will slap you!
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-21 05:04:26 EDT
From: EvilCabal
Posted on: America Online
WrittenBy, Pottree, Dw in Oh, Writurguy, Oscar99, B Marsilii, Mosqx & others:
Thanks for the response. Although Id rather not mention the agencys name, I will say that it is significant enough that the name would ring a bell. Not a fly by night organization. Not one of the big three either. Ive never heard of the specific agent before, however.
Some have suggested that I give the agent a call. This agent didnt leave a number. I took that to mean hes expecting a script in the mail and not a phone call--perhaps not leaving his number specifically to discourage phone calls.
I think I will follow up on advice received here and elsewhere to send them another script with a note explaining the delay for the script they asked for. This finished script, I hope will serve as a sample of my writing and dissuade the possibility of me being perceived as a complete flake. What do you think?
Geez! The abuse a poor writer must suffer. I think I expressed myself badly when I stated that I queried for a script that wasnt finished. Clarification: At the time I sent the queries, I did feel I had that baby pretty much done. It was only afterward that I realized there were a few pot holes that needed to be patched. When I received no positive responses to my query, my attention drifted toward other topics.
For what its worth: Writers are never really finished. Even after their work is published and until the day they die I suppose any writer will continually say, Why in the hell did I use that comma, that choice of verb. What I should have done is....
The numerous kicks in the butt I received for my post does bring up an interesting topic for discussion:
IN THIS DAY OF PRIORITIZING AND OPTIMIZING OF ONES TIME, WOULDNT IT BE NICE IF ALL WRITERS COULD DELAY WRITING A WORD UNTIL THEY WERE SURE A POTENTIAL MARKET EXISTED FOR THAT EARTH SHAKER OF AN IDEA?
Its a luxury that spec writers dont enjoy. But wed sure save six bloody months of our lives by NOT working on a piece of crap that no one wants to even read.
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-21 12:53:04 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
> don't write until you know it'll sell <
You said it, bro!
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-23 13:35:17 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
True, a writer never feels finished with anything, however, there comes a point when they feel comfortable about letting other people see it. Your scripts should always be at that point before you start shopping it around.
A writer who spends six months on a screenplay that never gets produced is not wasting their time if they are writing something they feel is worthwhile. If, in the end you have a screenplay you are proud of and something that you think represents your writing well you have an invaluable tool.
In all likelihood, the agent who expressed interest in you does not have a star or anyone lined up to be attached, they were probably just intrigued by your letter and what sounded like a good story. Just as you shouldn't have shopped an incomplete script, an agent would know better than to shop a script they have never seen.
You said the agent did not leave a phone number, if it is a real agency he probably figured you had it. You should get the number and call the agent or his assistant. Tell him you've decided to make a few changes and give him a date when he can expect the script and stick to that time table. You might ask him if he would like to see another sample of your work in the meantime (providing you have something *completed* that you are proud of). A literary agent approaching a potential client is not looking for specific projects, he is looking for good writers. (Unless, somehow a talent agent or a director's agent got a hold of your query letter in which case this agent will not do you much good beyond this one script).
It's not a waste of time to write a spec script. It's a waste of time to send out query letters on an unfinished script. You do not get a second chance. Unless you are an agents prized client it is very unlikely that they will read more than one draft of the same script. So you better be pretty darn happy with the draft you turn in.
The fact that he called requesting the script means nothing. The call cost his agency $1.50 and a minute or two of his time. To dictate a letter and have his assistant take the time to type it and mail it would have cost much more. Calling is the norm for requesting material.
You have been presented with a wonderful opportunity. And unless you get your butt into gear you're going to blow it.
Subj: Re:Telephonic Script Requests 95-04-24 02:45:29 EDT
From: EvilCabal
Posted on: America Online
GThawk:
Your observations are well taken.
Evil
Subj: Re: Agents/Packagers 95-04-27 16:45:44 EDT
From: WStead0545
Posted on: America Online
Anybody know anything about Robert Kosberg? Also interested in his business adress, e-mail or otherwise.
Subj: Re: Agents/Packagers 95-04-27 23:04:10 EDT
From: MOSqx
Posted on: America Online
Bob Kosberg is famous as the one-line pitch guy. He's made a reputation for selling projects with a "Twilight Zone" meets "Home Alone" type pitch. His production company is located at Tri-Star Pictures.
Subj: Finally done 95-04-28 14:22:06 EDT
From: SUN PATH
Posted on: America Online
After two years of writing I've finally finished "RETURN OF THE SACRED". a hundred and thirty page action script with mystic power. I'll be popping the champaigne this week. Anyone who would like to share an agent contact or good and bad experiences with particular agencies; I'd appreciate the help.
Best, Sun Path
E-mail Sun Path
Subj: Re: Agents/Packagers 95-04-28 14:27:29 EDT
From: RenChi
Posted on: America Online
MOSqx
Thanks for your prompt answer
Subj: Re: Agents/Packagers 95-04-28 19:49:05 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
SUNPATH--
First off, congrats. CLINK--my toast with you. Nothing like finishing a script. Now, I have just one questions--does the script itself have mystical powers? If so, you may NOT need an agent.
Just...chant it on over to Richard Gere.
Luck wit'it.
Subj: Re: Agents/Packagers 95-04-28 23:28:57 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
WS - I've done business with Bob and hope to again in the future. He's strait-forward, honest and reliable.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: Agents/Packagers 95-04-30 13:20:12 EDT
From: WStead0545
Posted on: America Online
Dw in Oh...Thanks for info on R. Kosberg
W . STEAD
Subj: agents 95-05-02 17:17:19 EDT
From: R2PUDD2
Posted on: America Online
A while ago (month or two) it was posted that there was a listing of black agents in Black Enterprise magazine. I would appreciate more info. on this. Such as issue date and anything else you can supply, Thanks
R2PUDD2
Subj: Query Letter Format 95-05-04 19:25:32 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
I'm trying to put together a query letter to send to prospective agents. I got the WGA list, made some phone calls and was told my ten different people to send a query letter. That's what I expected. However, I'm at a bit of a loss as to what the content and form of the letter should be. I know it should be one page. I've been told it should be three paragraphs. Soooo...could I get a thumbnail sketch as to what those three paragraphs should cover? I'm not asking anyone to send me a copy of their own letter. Just an outline of sorts.
Thanks for your help.
Caroline
Subj: Re:Query Letter Format 95-05-05 07:31:28 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Genni--
Query should include the five w's--who you are, what you've written, when you'd like to hear from them by before you "call to make sure they got your letter," where they can contact you at, why you're writing to THEM in particular about your script (they handle a certain type of writer/actor you'd like to get the script to/etc.).
Rememeber--be brief, be professional, be persistent without being bothersome. Also remember that this letter is your first writing sample. Make it sing--and make it right.
No more than one page. Para's don't matter.
Wry
Subj: Query Letter Advice 95-05-05 15:50:58 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
Wryturguy,
Thanks for the quick response. Now I've just gotta figure out how to make it sound like I've chosen to write to these agents for a reason OTHER than the fact that they were on the WGA list and said I could query them...
Gennity666
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-05 19:08:03 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Genni---
A little research through the Blue Book or other biz directories should turn up a client list for some of these agents to peg your pitch on. If not, don't worry about it. They've given their okay to query for a reason, just blow by that part if need be and make the rest of the query rock. Luck--and let us know who responds bestest, I'm just about done with a couple of projects I need to pitch (yeah, I really DO write something other than AOL posts, hard as that is to believe....)
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-05 21:02:23 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
They're on the list...
Isn't that a good reason? Obviously, you're trying to find an agent.
Just tell them they're the best and that's what you are hoping for.
Ad astra per aspera.
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-05 22:03:51 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Big agencies have their spiel that they use to lure clients to them and small boutique have theirs. Use which ever one applies as your reason for pitching to them and only them.
Big agencies - You want the packaging power, negotiating clout and prestige of a large agency.
Small boutique agencies - You want the personal attention and "hungrier attitude" of a small (they prefer boutique) agency.
If they're somewhere in between, then you just combine the above two. "I want the packaging power of a large agency with the personal attention of a boutique agency, and that's why you guys are so perfect to me."
Whatever they are, that's what you want. ;-]
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-06 00:22:07 EDT
From: VenusWI
Posted on: America Online
Your best bet is to tell your story as simply and as intriguingly as possible. One paragraph, two max.
Mention a little about yourself if it has to do with writing. If you have other screenplays available, mention that.
The agents don't care why you've chosen them. They will choose you...if your writing looks like it's something they can sell.
Go for the newer agents. They'll be looking for clients. You find them in Hollywood Reporter.
When you call to follow up, make friends with the assistant. They guard the door. They often do the first reading for the agent. And many of them are on their way to becoming agents themselves. Always ask their name.
I wrote a roundup article for the Wisconsin Screenwriters Forum newsletter about agents and what they are looking for and how some of them like to be (or not be) approached. It was based on a roundtable discussion with a number of agents who spoke at the Selling to Hollywood Conf. in L.A. last August. If you're interested I can e-mail you a copy.
-Peggy
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-06 07:00:52 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Wisconsin--Now THERE'S a hotbed of screenwriting and movie-making activity!
Sorry, Peg, it's JUST a joke. Don't go postal on me.
Subj: Query Question 95-05-06 11:12:42 EDT
From: CarSpin
Posted on: America Online
Has anyone ever gotten a good response from a query letter. How successful are they? Would love to hear others experience with this.
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-06 14:21:34 EDT
From: VenusWI
Posted on: America Online
Wryturguy,
No offense taken. Surprisingly Wisconsin writers do a *lot* of networking with people in the industry. A lot of talent has come out of Wisconsin...Zucker Bros., Michael Mann, David Koep, Linda Seger, Steve Peterman (former exec. prod. of Murphy Brown), just to name a few...and they don't forget their roots.
...also, a number of established agents and well known actors, most of whom will do anything to get their hands on homegrown beer and brats.
The Wisconson Screenwriters Forum has 250 members nationwide (a third of whom reside in state), both hopefuls and working, produced screenwriters.
Don't underestimate the power of cheese!
:) Peggy
Subj: Re:Query Question 95-05-06 14:26:48 EDT
From: VenusWI
Posted on: America Online
CarSpin,
My experience, and that of many writers I've talked with, is that if you flood the market with queries (to agents, producers, and actors' production companies), you're likely to get about a 50% response...of which 50% of those will invite you to send your script along. That is, of course, assuming the story pitch sounds intriguing enough to warrant a read.
My partner and I started with about 50-60 letters. Some we followed up with phone calls, but generally those who were interested called us. Rejections generally came by mail, but a few invites came that way, too.
-Peggy from WI
Subj: Re:Query Question 95-05-06 15:07:09 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
CarSpin-
I became involved with both my former and present agent through Hollywood Reporter (after running down the whole length of the WGA blue list).
The former handled only actors and wanted to add a writer/director to his stable. Now I know why he handles actors-- it doesn't require reading, and understanding material. The guy was hopeless. Didn't know what to do with me. I left after 6 months.
My current agent is kind and pushes hard. She only handles writers; and has a great nose for finding players. Not big players yet, but I'm working.
Good luck!
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-06 22:16:23 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Oo, good advice.. You could write ad copy. Bennies, bennies, bennies!
But what's the clout of why you want THEm... isn't it more important why they should want YOU...
Eg, how much did you sell last year... and what's 10% of that and how much might you be worth to them in the future based on past performance?
I've been with agents small, medium, and large... and none ever did a blessed thing for me once I signed on.
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-07 00:37:48 EDT
From: Stryklone
Posted on: America Online
Follow the normal procedures of writing a sales letter:
Answer the questions they will ask. Answer the negatives first. Be succinct. Be interesting. Ask your question near the end.
Also, include a SASE. Typically, you'll get a response from 3-25%. Note: I didn't say you'd get positive response. Be patient. I got a response last week from a query I sent in mid-September.
It's a game of numbers, many different methods, and probably phases of the moon. While you wait, write more stuff people will want to buy.
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-07 06:26:57 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Peggy--
Cheese is the food of life. Please send me some cheese. I like you. I like your posts. YOU may come play down in MY folder if you like. Bring the brats.
NAMES. We want NAMES, woman. WHICH agents whom you queried responded--save the class a bit of time.
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-07 15:28:12 EDT
From: VenusWI
Posted on: America Online
Wryturguy,
Names are everywhere. I can send you via e-mail an article I wrote that names some agents who spoke at a conference and described what they are/are not looking for. Names are listed in Hollywood Reporter almost daily.
The point is not who responded to *me*...the point is to write a great script and an equally great query that makes the agents want to read that great script. It's also shortsighted to write only to agents. (Probably because most agents are shortsighted about writers) Writers need to query producers and actors'/directors' own production companies. Agents are more likely to read through referrals or if a producer is interested in buying the piece.
The cheese is good. The brats are better. Must be nice to have your own folder to play in.
Peggy
Subj: Re:Query Letter Advice 95-05-07 15:57:47 EDT
From: Nanstan
Posted on: America Online
Can a former lit agent in LA, highly successful, add a few thoughts? The key to an agent's future, either at a large agency or small, is finding new writers, new scripts. That's because most of the successful writers can't be stolen from their current agents easily. Survival for an agent depends on getting work for their current clients, who occupy most of their time. In truth, there's little time for reading, either mail or unsolicited scripts. You are either on the phone or on the road, making the rounds on behalf of your writers. Most of the writers an average agent represents are in television, and the challenge is to keep your tv writers working steadily during the season. Even before a script is finished, your client is hustling you for the next assignment. Your standing in the agency is gauged by your bookings, and these are looked at on a weekly basis. The agency pays its bills and your salary as an agent by sales, not be promising material. That said, and there's much more to be said of course, I don't know of an agent who wilfully passes by the chance to take on a promising writer or a promising script. The problem is, if the letter suggests the writer is going to function less than professionally, or if the project is badly presented, it isn't going to catch the agent. Professional, used here, means that the writer understands the ground rules of the game. The problem usually is that, just because you know how to write "fade in" and "the end" doesn't mean that you know how to spin gold. Finally, at least for this posting, I'm amused at the fast quips and put-downs by some of the respondents to fellow-writer's queries. You're acting like some of the agents who you accuse of the same thing. It's a business, folks, not a granting process from a local arts group. If what you've got to offer looks salable, it'll float to the top. Scripts are like babies; they all look beautiful to their creators.
Subj: The Endeavor Agency? 95-05-07 18:51:40 EDT
From: Writer38
Posted on: America Online
Can anyone provide me with the address of the Endeavor Agency, (formed a month ago by four agents who fled ICM). Also, if you know the names of the four agents, it would be appreciated.
According to Daily Variety, they recently auctioned off Lou Holtz Jr.'s spec script THE CABLE GUY to Columbia for a reported $750,000.00 (note: it was Holtz's first script). Two days later, they sold Kurt Wimmer's spec script EXIT ZERO for $1 million to Renny Harlin and Geena Davis' The Forge production company.
Subj: Re:The Endeavor Agency? 95-05-07 20:20:35 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Nan--
Great post. Thanks.
Peg--
I didn't make the folder, and the folder of one's own goes back to before you arrived. We have a faux-poster on here who does this every once in a while to get people tearing each other up, but we're onto him/her so it's not working.
Names are always good, regardless. Having a good script is a given, but the narrower one makes the odds with said script, the better the chance at a pay off. So, e-mail away if you think about it sometime. Thanks for reply.
Subj: Re:Query Question 95-05-07 22:57:22 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Car - A few years back I received wonderful response to a cover letter. It led to an agent, my first deal and enough encouragement that it's still keeping my widdle fingers pounding away.
It has to be well written. It has to be directed to the right person BY NAME (no impersonal "Dear Sir" stuff). And it has to represent a good script.
Period.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Agents vs. production comp's 95-05-07 23:53:29 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
As-yet-unrepresented screenwriters may find this of interest:
I finished my second feature scrip two months ago. Initially, I sent queries to a handful of agents and alleged producers (you know -- the kind that "seek scripts" on AOL, and place ads in the Hollywood Scriptwriter). I heard nothing for weeks. I finally decided to deal with the situation more aggressively.
Nineteen days ago, I started mailing queries to selected agents listed in the "1995 Guide to Literary Agents" (and a few from the WGA list). So far, I've sent queries (including SASE's, and in most cases, a one page synopsis) to a total of 41 agents. To date, I've received no response from 26, a negative response from 9, and positive responses from 5. Two agents have "passed" on me and my script. (One agent had gone out of business.)
Here's the good news:
Two weeks ago I started calling (and, in a few cases, writing to) selected production companies listed in the Hollywood Reporter's 1995 American Film Market special issue. Since 4/20, I've contacted a total of 45 different companies.
I've received no response from 7 (I had mailed them queries).
I've received negative responses from 17 companies - but virtually all of these were due to the fact the company in question (A.) didn't do features, or (B.) was, in fact, only a film distributor, or (C.) had a policy of not accepting scripts from anyone other than an agent or an entertainment attorney.
Four companies asked me to send a synopsis.
EIGHTEEN companies have asked me to send the script -- including some of the "biggies."
I've already heard from one of these eighteen -- one of the larger ones, in fact. Their story analysts worked my script over thoroughly, and gave it a "CONSIDER - with reservations" appraisal. (They were kind enough to fax me a copy of the coverage. It seems they thought the script might be a bit pricey for them to produce. They also thought it might contain a bit too much humor in places. Otherwise, thumbs up.) Such an appraisal is not so good as a "RECOMMEND," but it's a far sight more encouraging than a "PASS."
The news gets better:
The head of development called me. Apparently, he was quite impressed with the coverage. He told me his outfit's production slate is full for the next year, or so, but that he would like to personally pitch the script with a bigger, more financially robust company. He seems to think my script will be "just what they're looking for." (He apparently intends to get a $5000 finder's fee from them.) I told him to go for it.
Even if this comes to nothing, seventeen other companies are now looking at my script. This approach has not yet resulted in an "option" or a "sale." On the other hand, it's been a lot more rewarding than waiting months to learn dozens of agents aren't even interested in reading my script, much less representing it.
If anyone is interested, I offer the following practical advice: Don't waste time calling agents. Check the WGA list or Guide to Literary Agents to make sure they're at least willing to consider representing a novice screenwriter, then send them a query with a logline or a one paragraph synopsis incorporated into the text. Conversely, don't waste time and money writing to production companies. Give them a call. If they're willing to read your script at all, they'll usually tell you to go ahead and send it. If they want a synopsis instead, they'll tell you.
I hope and trust some of you will find encouragement in this. (I, of course, look forward to hearing from those self-proclaimed posting pundits, DW IN OH and Wryterguy -- the "Wishbone" and "Charlie Wooster" of our beloved BB)
A Leonis
Subj: Rotting on the vine 95-05-08 08:44:29 EDT
From: FILMRYTER
Posted on: America Online
I'm in a similar situation, except I have an agent and am looking
to change representation.
I've got two screenplays that have been optioned, a third script
that I am possibly going to direct and a handful more that need
to be shopped.
Problem is, that I was the last one to be signed at this agency
and my agent's plate is too full. She is throwing all her
attention to the clients she has had for years and I am not
getting the push that I need. In the past year I've given her
numerous scripts, but I have recently discovered she has been
sitting on most them, out and out shopping just one and sending a
second to only three people. Of all the people who actually read
and liked my work, my agent only nailed down four meetings.
She just isn't doing it for me.
What do I do? Before I got signed there were other agents who
seemed to like my work. Seeing how I've already got an agent,
should I start contacting those other agents and getting the word
out that I want to switch reps? Or should I start from scratch
with query letters all over town?
Those of you on these boards that have more experience, please
help me out...either with advice or by introducing me to your agent.
Or if you are an agent looking for a new client who is prolific
as heck, please contact me.
Thanks,
FILMRYTER
Subj: Re:Agents vs. production comp's 95-05-08 14:33:23 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
A,
Nice post. Hard work may pay off for you yet! Best luck!
I confess this much: I wear glasses. If I read a script wearing them, it's one thing. If I try woth them off, quite something else.
I think all material can be read in two ways: with the "glasses" of a personal interest (eg, a recommendation, a third-party endorsement, an attachment, etc.) and with the fuzzy-sightness and strain of a cold reading.
So, the other side of your Horatio Alger efforts would be to cultivate relationships with people with relationships; in other words, buy clout.
From a somewhat different angle -- by all reports Waterworld is an absolute disaster. Do you think this "floated" because of the quality of the script? Or was it something that got done for another type of reason?
Subj: Re:Rotting on the vine 95-05-08 14:54:36 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Film,
My agent experience at 3 shops (ranging from a solo guy to ICM) ws just about like yours.
Just because you have an agent doesn't mean they'll really be doing the selling. I guess you've got to do it and let them just step in for the curtain call and the commish.
If your agent isn't working for you and is actually sitting on material you're sending, she is obviously no longer for you. Have you told her this? What have you got to lose, especialyl as she's not doing much of a job now? Tell her to get on the stick or your agreement's history - then give her some time to turn over a new leaf and start working for you instead of the older (eg, more easily saleable) clients.
At the same time, inquire of the agents who liked your work on the first go-round... don't complain about Ms. Represent, but let 'em know you think it may not be a marriage made in heaven and you're looking to move... and what you've been up to i the productivity and deals dept...
Good luck!
Subj: Agent Hell 95-05-08 22:25:33 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
I'm shopping around an action-adventure right now, and what amazes me is that I've had my script recommended to some of the biggest name producers in Hollywood by an industry insider, but I can't get an agent to read it. Guess I have to wait until someone makes me an offer and then what? Hand it to an agent to collect a commission on?
Ahhh . . . the more annoyed I'm getting at agents, the more I hope I can find a good entertainment lawyer to negotiate my contracts and let the agents feed off someone else's carcass.
Do I sound bitter? I've had a trying day. I'm working on a fiction piece and fiction always makes me see the dark side . . .
I guess I need to relocate to Hell (L.A.) next year. It's hard to dance with the devil when he's not within physical reach.
Congrats to the guy with the Production Company Search. I have been hesitant to call companies, but reading your post encouraged me to go for the Production Companies and forget about the sharks.
Subj: Re:Agents vs. production comp's 95-05-08 23:14:13 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
A - Wishbone? An insult after you break your arm smacking yerself on the back? HA!
Actually yours was an instructive post and I've been down your same path with good results. Please - no more nyah-nyah's, ok?
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Rotting on the vine 95-05-09 03:23:25 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I think you should contact the other agents that were interested in you and let them know you're considering a change in representation.
Then, you should seek out any other agent that interests you and let them know that there are other agencies interested in you. Let them sell themselves to you. You are in a very good position, If you have *serious* interest from those other agencies.
Agents work much harder for clients they had to work to sign.
There are agents out there that work hard. They're just difficult to find. But a good agent is worth hunting for.
Subj: Re:Rotting on the vine 95-05-09 17:16:22 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I'm in a charitable mood, Thwak, but I think ALL agents probably work hard. The question is will yours work hard for you... or spend time on easier sells or easier-to-package talent? All that hard work and time they lavish on others is just a big excuse not ot get you a job or a sale IMHO -- who cares what they do for another client, you can't eat that!
Subj: Re:Rotting on the vine 95-05-10 04:49:42 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Having worked in a agency for a period of time I know for a fact that agents do work for the "difficult to sell" clients too. And I know that agents feel terrible when clients that they personally like a lot do not get work.
You have to find someone you really connect with.
Yes, there are a lot of agents who only want to make a buck but there are agents who put themselves on the line and push clients they truly believe in. Agents who let their clients crash on their couch when they don't have a place to live. (Ask Soderburgh why he dedicated Sex, Lies & Videotape to his wonderful agent, Ann Dollard. She believed in him when he was just a kid out of school with a film that had yet to hit the festivals and make all that noise.)
And it's hard, time-consuming work to negotiate a deal even for a writer that is an easy sell. It's not just an excuse not to work for you.
It's hard to find a good agent. It's like finding a good relationship. Once you're with the right person it will be night and day compared with what you've been through.
Subj: Re:Rotting on the vine 95-05-10 12:41:27 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
GThwak,
If I found a good agent -- one who would push for me aggressivley and had real relationships to work -- it would be more than the difference between day and night. It would be a magnificent dawning after a long and pitch black night of neglect.
When I was with ICM I had the feeling that I was a kid pushing his snotty nose up against the window of a houseful of friends. They were all busy chatting away, packaging deals with each other, and I wasn't being introduced to the players at all. My feeling (could well be wrong) was that their interest was packing groups of talent they represented, and that to be in the game, you had to be in the small circle of those who were known. I always had the feeling that they were reluctant to even bring up my name for fear some director or actor would be insulted that they would mention an unknown in their own illustrious company. It may have been paranoia, but it was certainly poverty.
What else to say about someone who "loves" yur work but doesn't produce leads or return phone calls?
Subj: Re:Rotting on the vine 95-05-10 21:40:54 EDT
From: FILMRYTER
Posted on: America Online
Well, I had the dreaded "talk" with my agent.
First let me say that this is someone that I personally like and
they like me. We get along well AND she loves my scripts. But she admitted that her plate was just two damn full to give me the attention I was due. That is insurmountable physics. I understand her loyalty is with clients she has had for 15 years or more and I was the last on the boat at just over a year.
I don't think either one of us wanted to let each other go. We
both know it's for the best and I should maybe start looking for
new representation, but until I find a new agency if I need her
for anything, she'll be there. And we both cried a little.
Oh, well. Time to move on and find a new agent. If anyone has
one they want to introduce me to, e-mail me.
Thanks,
FILMRYTER
Subj: The Next Step 95-05-11 03:31:43 EDT
From: RSheely
Posted on: America Online
Hello:
I'd like to introduce myself. I've been a playwright and professional scriptwriter for a little over 15 years now. About four years ago, I wrote my first screenplay. I learned a lot and found I really enjoyed the medium. I sent it out and got some moderate interest. (Davis Television was interested as a pssible Movie of the Week, then my contact left Davis and the interest fell through.)
Two years ago I began another screenplay. It went a lot better than the first one. I wrote and rewrote. A reading followed in Santa Monica (with actor friends). Then more rewrites. Then a reading at the Playwrights' Center here in Minneapolis where I'm an alumni member (they didn't mind that the script wasn't a play). Then one final round of rewrites.
Thus I now have a screenplay I feel very proud of. The plot points come at the right places. The characters each have their own voice. The humor rises out of the characters and situation. It's even a Romantic Comedy - a genre which suddenly seems to be in vogue. In short, it's the best I can do.
I'm now faced with the challenge of placing it in the right hands. I've begun my networking, looking for agents. I've got a couple of leads from friends in L.A. and I'm seeking out more. I would appreciate any leads and suggestions. I would also appreciate any comisseration with other writers in the same situation.
Please EMail me at RSheely@aol.com. I look forward to talking with you.
Subj: Re:The Next Step 95-05-11 07:45:51 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Sheely--
Same advice at to the rest:
Get your WGA agency list and start writing/calling/being professional.
If you've got an actor in mind, contact their contact. You can get an actor's contact from SAG.
Find a company that produced the kind of script you have. Call them. Write them.
Make a killer query letter and start mailing them out.
Luck
Subj: Hey, Wryturguy... 95-05-16 14:20:34 EDT
From: JerSoule
Posted on: America Online
Are you a playwright, screenwriter, etc? Where are you based? You seem very knowledgable in the area, and have been doing it for a while.
I wondered if I could e you for advice from time to time...as I'm just starting out, I would really appreciate it.
Thanks, JerSoule
Subj: THE LETTER 95-05-19 20:17:51 EDT
From: MixedMedia
Posted on: America Online
The script is done, it's time to write the query letter. Do any of you agented writers, or actual agents, out there have any examples you could post? I've seen one example but it seemed over-blown. Is that what most people send?
Subj: Re:THE LETTER 95-05-20 02:25:13 EDT
From: Finaldrft
Posted on: America Online
Is this your first screenplay? You can't possibly be expecting an agent to represent someone based on their first and only screenplay. Can you?
Subj: Re:THE LETTER 95-05-20 11:07:36 EDT
From: CarSpin
Posted on: America Online
Mr. Finaldraft,
Read your post. Understand your comment. But don't agree with it.
My first screenplay attracted several agents. Big ones. Some wanted to represent me. Some were honest and wanted to hip pocket me. Other just wanted to take a chance on a spec sale and then discuss it.
It all started with a letter.
Subj: re:letter 95-05-20 16:54:11 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
Mixed,
I think, buried back through this folder, you might find some hints and examples of query letters. To go back through the folder, tell "find" to go back say, 15 days, then 25, then 40. You'll get different chunks of postings, and be able to go back to the beginning of the folder. There's much great information by some really talented pros in this folder covering just about everything.
Good luck.
Joe
Subj: Re:THE LETTER 95-05-20 19:21:02 EDT
From: ANN3RDTRY
Posted on: America Online
Finaldrft,
It is not necessary to respond to a question posted if you do not understand it. Let the people who have good advice to share. I'm sorry you had to write several hundred screenplays before you sent out your first query letter. You should have asked someone if that were necessary to do. Would have saved you some trouble.
Subj: Re:Finding Material/Producing 95-05-22 01:32:31 EDT
From: TORMAN212
Posted on: America Online
I'm interested in producing/directing a small film/tv project. I have my own material but because of my own time limitations I haven't been able to flesh out my own ideas to their full extent. So I looking for new material from new screenwriters. Having worked in the television business for over 25 years my contacts are plenty. So If you are new, struggling and eager to get your work produced send me a message.
My login is "Torman212"
Thanks,
Victor Patterson
Burbank, CA
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-23 23:06:12 EDT
From: Kcolorado
Posted on: America Online
We WGA Signatory agents are not actualy as you hinted. As business people it is
necessary that we judge the market denmand and the supply and evaluate where our
time and money is best spent. Hollywood markets and agents do deals. To do a deal one must have a willing buyer and a capable seller.
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-24 16:27:58 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Final Draft--
Just because YOUR first 37 1/2 screenplays sucked doesn't mean everyone's does. I got an agent in my first writing round long ago to send out my very fist script. So NYAH.
Whoever asked if they could ask me questions, sure. At the risk of offending Bad Cog, of course, who would prefer you ask HIM questions so he can insult you and make you feel as useless and unemployed as he is. E-mail me if you like. But there's a lot of good advisers on here more knowlegable than I, so just keep asking.
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-24 22:21:39 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Wry - Welcome back from your desert sojurn. Hope you found some truth out there.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-24 22:23:22 EDT
From: CBertolet
Posted on: America Online
Oh, nice viber here, fellas.
Think I'll move on.
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-24 22:24:12 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Wry (take 2) - Uh, make that SOJOURN, son. Sojourn.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-24 22:24:13 EDT
From: CBertolet
Posted on: America Online
Whoops. I mean vibe.
Subj: Re: The list 95-05-25 12:59:25 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
I don't know, I kind of like sojourn viber, personally.
Desert trip next week. Central Park was last. And, of course, there is no truth to be found in New York (watchout, Charlie's coming down with his slapper).
Subj: Re: Search for Truth 95-05-26 17:47:16 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Slap! There's a lot of truth to be found in the City, but it is heavily taxed.
And weren't you referring to Sojourner Truth?
Subj: A new "getting an agent" story. 95-05-27 13:09:07 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Hi! I'm new to AOL and the internet. I'm a working screenwriter and would like to help out fellow writers if I can. I'm not exactly sure what to say so I'll just share my little "getting an agent" success story in hopes that it may help.
Last year around July or August, I decided to write my first screenplay. So I took a week vacation from my full-time computer job and wrote it. I then wrote a query letter and teaser, bought a Hollywood Agents Directory, and sent the letters out. The next day, I got about fourteen calls from agencies ranging from ICM all the way down to the small agencies. Over the next few days, I continued to recieve calls from assistants and agents requesting my script. I sent my script out only to the few that I felt really showed interest (following the age old advice to find an agent who really believes in your script). After they read it, they called me up literally yelling over the phone, "please let me represent this script" or "if this is a sign of your writing, I not only want your script, I want you." I have to admit, my silly grin was so huge, it shoved my two ears to the back of my head.
And this is where I'll try to give a bit of advice--there's a difference between the writer in you and the business person you need to be. Separate the two. Know when to be the passionate writer and know when to be the level headed business person. Despite my eagerness to sign up and get going, I forced myself to go to several agents and meet with them. I'm not sure if this will be helpful advice to everyone, but when you go to these meetings, go with the attitude that you're going to interview them (don't be cocky, though, polite and business-like is best). The agent will be interviewing you also; but remember, it's YOUR CAREER you're talking about.
I feel I'm becoming lengthy here--a writer's typical fear--so I'll be brief.
I chose an agent at a small agency. Very small. You probably haven't heard about them. But I chose her because she "believed in my script," had experience, yet was relatively new enough as an agent to be "hungry" and motivated enough to give me the time and energy that I wanted an agent to put into my script--and my career.
My agent began soliciting my script around February. In about a month, it was read by various production companies and studios around town. It got me meetings and my first writing assignment before it was even sold. Currently, my first script is about to be sold and produced by an eager independent company, but my agent is playing hardball with them--she's fighting for more rights (it paid off to be patient and do the "agent research"). I am now writing a feature film for a production company who's worked with stars such as Ford, Nicholson, etc. They also recently offered me the potential opportunity to do a rewrite on a Jeb Stuart script.
I would like to add, though, that much of my success came from a healthy balance of my storytelling ability, writing ability (storytelling and writing is two different things), a good business sense (how to market yourself), and a team effort made by my agent and myself (I got my first writing job because my agent got me in the door and I took some initiative and did some special pre-writing work).
Well... that's my story. If anyone is interested in hearing details in hopes that it may help them, let me know. There are a few "writer's marketing" tactics and other writer's information that I've picked up that may help you.
Sincerely,
Jason
Subj: Jason lives! 95-05-27 17:14:38 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
Dear Jason,
Yours is certainly an interesting story. Only eight days from FADE IN on a first draft, to fourteen agents begging for your script! (As I recall, ICM told me over the phone there was no point in even sending a query!) Assuming you put in eight hours a day on the script, you were pumping out more than two pages of polished copy an hour - from scratch! Not bad. God supposedly took six days to create the universe. Sounds like he was dragging his feet.
With regard to your observation that "storytelling and writing is two different things," I'm sure most of us would agree - "it are." I'd like to hear more. Particularly, I'd like to hear your last name, the name of your script - the one that's about to be "sold by" and un-named production company, and the name of your agent. Please post the requested information on the board, along with your other writer's tips, for all of us to enjoy.
Sincerely,
A Leonis
P.S. Jason, you didn't, by any chance, show up in a hockey mask for any of your early show-biz meetings, did you?
Subj: Re:Jason lives! 95-05-27 23:35:15 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
The story sounds highly unlikely but it don't mean it ain't so. Still, I'd like to hear more particulars before firing off huzzahs. From time to time you do hear of stories such as Jason's but on-line you hear LOTS of stories.
I had a script that a producer told me a name star was "very interested in" Awhile back and I was ready to throw out posts, pop corks, etc. You can guess the rest ... I now own the script again.
Still, I wish Jason the best. If the story is true, I'm jealous to the point of a hissy fit.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:A new "getting an agent" stor 95-05-28 00:53:09 EDT
From: SERVANT10
Posted on: America Online
Congratulations on a job well done. It's nice to hear a success story now and then. Just hope Wrtrguy doesn't get to you. He's sure to find some flaw.
Subj: The lie detector test. 95-05-28 04:40:16 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Okay, DW, after personally reading some of the stuff "on-line" I can understand your skepticism. So right now I've hooked myself up to a lie detector that will shoot 200,000 volts of electricity through me anytime I tell a lie.
Let's try a few testers...
Yes, A Leonis, I am the "Jason" from all the friday the 13th movies-- Bzzzzttt!!!! Ouch!!! Damn that hurt!!!!
Yes, A Leonis, I am an expert in grammar and the phrase "storytelling and writing IS two different things" is actually correct grammar and is not a subject-verb disagreement-- Bzzzztttt!!! Owwww!!!! Well, I guess it works.
Now, for some true statements... I hope.
What I said in the previous post is true... (pause)
... Whew! Didn't think I could handle another jolt.
A Leonis, you're right, ICM are tight a-- ahem! Well, they are sort of "closed." But I sent one anyway!!! And I actually got--if I remember correctly--several agents calling from that particularly agency. But, I never sent them my script. I didn't like their assistants major ATTITUDES and the impression I got from them in general. They actually required me to get a notary public to confirm that it was my script before I sent them it (no other agency or agent asked for that). Anyway, I went with another more enthused agent.
The name of my script is Dead Aim. It's an action film about a female assassin. Sorry. I'm new to AOL and so I should practice some discretion before giving out other personal info like names (I already heard some horror stories in other folders about that).
I know refraining from telling that info sort of blemishes my credibility but maybe if I tell you other things in detail, I'll past this test...
Writer tip: Use your word processor's merge and database (tables) features.
When I decided to take the query letter route, I bought the Hollywood agent directory and entered all the pertinent information from the LITERARY agents' entries. I then merged the table with my query letter and fax cover page (I designed the cover page myself with my company name and slogan--no I don't have a company, just sounds nice, doesn't it?). The merging feature allows you to somewhat personalize the numerous letters.
Anyway, I don't recall the amount of agents I had on my list, but with a three page fax for each agent--cover sheet, teaser, and query letter--I had a hard copy stack about four to six inches thick. Maybe 100 to 200 literary agents (many of them from the same agency). This is basically called the "SHOTGUN!!!" approach. I opted for this marketing strategy over the more precise strategy of careful research into agents that deal with "that type of script." I then faxed my query letter to the agents. So I solicited my script to 100-200 agents in one night and all of it relatively for free (no postage).
By the way, if your modem can do it, you can fax right off your computer (I did mine from work, shhh, don't say anything). The word processor I used was Word 6.0 but I'm sure the other processors have merge and database features (a little read of the manual will save you a tremendous amount of time).
One last point on this tip. Just because you send the query letter to 200 agents, doesn't mean you'll get a response. What your query letter and teaser (if you have one) contains is the most important point. The contents of mine is what did it for me. The shotgun approach just speeds up the long process of looking for an agent. **This advice isn't for everyone. We all have different situations. But if you can use it and it helps, good luck!!
Sincerely,
JSI
P.S. A Leonis. Regarding the time I took to write the script, I didn't mean to come across as stuck up or anything like that. As I looked it over again, it certainly sounded like it. Sorry. I guess my storytelling philosophy and writing style and technique helps me to be able to write a little quickly and I take it for granted.
Subj: Re:The lie detector test. 95-05-28 06:16:20 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Servant--
I resent that! What, do you think that I might perhaps be a little...skeptical about this post?
Well...yes, I'm afraid so. But then there's no way to tell unless A) Jason tells us the rest of his name and the name of his agent, B) We see "Dead Aim" (great title for the female assassin genre, btw) in the theaters or C) Jason volunteers some info the rest of us can check out.
Also, do I believe even the fastest, bestest, most wonderour writer in the world can write a salable script in 8 days? What do YOU think ?
Subj: Re:The lie detector test. 95-05-28 07:32:11 EDT
From: BGBerg
Posted on: America Online
Everybody.....Chill.
Subj: Skeptical, skeptical 95-05-28 14:30:31 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Oh, well. Just thought I'd try and help out. Thought it might stimulate a discussion on methods and tactics of agent hunting.
P.S. I, too, hope you see "Dead Aim" in theaters near you. But the company I'm selling it too is a major video company and it has a huge chance to go straight to video. They're hoping it's going to be one of those movies that will turn out great and be able to go to theatre. Also, I'm in a delimma. We're in the last stages of the contract and I'm wondering if I should hold onto the script. It's being sold to an independent that's going to make it on a low budget--1.5 million or so. I'm getting the standard fee and will do the re-write. But I really wanted to direct. Do I sell out or hold on, maybe waiting to attach a well-known actress (I know it's a long shot). Any opinions?
Subj: Re:Skeptical, skeptical 95-05-28 18:04:25 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Just in case you're on the level:
If you can really turn out a script that fast, sell out this one. Then another. Get a name. Then start making demands. At the rate you work this should only take unitl the end of the year anyway.
Subj: Almost convinced. 95-05-28 21:51:02 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
Dear JSI777,
Your story is beginning to sound a little more credible. I'd sincerely like to hear more about how you developed your writing/story telling talents, and how and where you mastered the fine arts of story structure, character development, and format.
My knowledge of these subjects, such as it is, stems from the reading and re-reading of various screenplays and twenty or thirty pertinent books, and taking a couple of screenwriting courses -- all over a four-year period. If there are any shortcuts I've missed, I'd surely like to hear about them. In your original posting, it sounded as though one week, out of the blue, you decided: "Hey kids! I think I'll write a movie!" and the next week Hollywood was beating down your door. I trust this was a misapprehension on my part. In that case, I apologize for any lack of decorum.
Spelling Entertainment also asked me to send a notarized release with my script, which I was happy to do (nearly four weeks ago.) One other production company asked for a signed release, as did two agencies -- though none of these required that it be notarized.
I have a bit of advice to add to those you've already offered. If you're sending scripts out to independent production companies, it's probably best NOT to do so just before the Cannes Film Festival. Several individuals I spoke with admitted they wouldn't be able to get to my script until after the festival. One company (KMI) is currently running a message on its answering machine stating their offices have moved to the South of France!
In any case, it's now coming up on four weeks since the first of these twenty-one production companies received my script. Nearly all the others have had it in hand for three weeks. Though, as I stated in a previous posting, two companies have shown an interest (i.e., they've asked to pitch the script to a larger company), no one has yet called to offer a development deal. Of the nine agents who've received the script, three have passed on it over the last two months, and I've yet to hear from six others.
At least nominally, my script is a sci-fi adventure (though the "real story" is a character-driven romantic comedy.) Wryturguy, and others, have pointed out to me that "Hollywood is not at all interested in sci-fi." I assume this is, indeed, the case. I can only hope the appeal of a well-written, uplifting story with compelling characters, an abundance of fresh humor, and an original, thoroughly unpredictable plot, will outweigh this prejudice.
I fully appreciate and share your predilection for plot twists. That's one reason it has taken me almost two years to develop the script in question. The time was largely consumed in an effort to create believable, thoroughly integrated, and original plot twists (and, of course, compelling characters.) Creating unexpected and seemingly insurmountable obstacles for your protagonists is a challenge, but it's far more difficult to figure out credible, integrated, means by which these obstacles might be overcome.
You mentioned you "bought the Hollywood agent directory." I have the Writer's Digest "Guide to Literary Agents," the WGA's agency listings, and the "Agents and Managers" list in the "Film Writer's Guide." Somehow I must have missed the "Hollywood agent directory." Could you please tell me who puts it out or where it might be obtained?
I plan to take your advice with regard to faxing queries to agents. My computer does, indeed, have a fax capability. I simply haven't bothered to figure out how it works.
In any case, thanks much for the valuable insights.
Best regards,
A Leonis
P.S. On the face of it, your script sounds quite a bit like the 1993 Bridget Fonda actioner POINT OF NO RETURN, which was, in turn, a Hollywood re-make of LA FEMME NIKITA. Both films are action/adventure stories about female assassins. I trust DEAD AIM is substantially different. I look forward to seeing it on the big screen!
Subj: Jason re: query 95-05-28 22:08:04 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
Jason,
I have been following the posts re: your screenplay and since you stated your mission as being one of help, I hope you do not mind me asking you this.
The one favor I would love to ask you for is a copy of that merged query letter/teaser you sent out - names disguised to protect the innocent and so forth. I have no problem with writing a screenplay, it is just those damned query/teasers that nail me.
If you do not feel comfortable posting it, e-mail it please. And congrats on the *heat.*
P.S. Unless you have a background in directing, say perhaps a sample reel, I think Wryturguy is steering you in the right direction. Make the cash on this one, ask for the headaches later.
Subj: Agent Hunting Resources 95-05-29 02:23:05 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
A Leonis and others:
Here's the info on the book I used for my agent hunting:
"Hollywood Agents/Managers Directory"
Hollywood Creative Directory
3000 Olympic Blvd., Suite 2413
Santa Monica, CA 90404
Phone: (310) 315-4815
Fax: (310) 315-4816
This directory has the addresses, phone and fax numbers of over 1,025 talent and literary agencies and managers in LA, NY, and elsewhere. (If you're an actor too, there's casting directors and stuff like that). It comes out quarterly and costs $45, so get it only when you're really ready to send out your polished script. A little on the expensive side for me at the time, but because they publish quarterly, it's relatively up-to-date. Don't get an old one, apparently agencies can change often. The Directory also flags the agencies that are relatively new (that doesn't mean the agent is inexperienced) but it may be helpful for looking for that "young and hungry, up-and-coming agent" that may take you on. In my opinion--and I've been told this by other people in the industry--for a new writer, this is the agent to look for. That's why I opted to go for the smaller agency than the bigger ones. I haven't regretted the choice yet. But, it's your call. Another tip: people in the mail room and assistants at the bigger agencies like CAA and ICM are agent wannabes (there are even lawyers in those mail rooms!). Don't rule them out, if you're both new and you hit it off with each other, both of you might build careers together. Keep your eyes open.
Another insightful book that I read regarding agent hunting that you may have read is K Callan's book "The Script is finished, Now what do I do?" Sweden Press, Boc 1612, Studio City, CA 91614. I got the directory from Samuel French's here in LA. K Callan's book should be in a mainstream book store. If you're a fast reader or good at hiding in the back of the store between the book stacks (not that I ever did this<grin>), you can read most of the good stuff in the store without buying it. Most of the book is a listing of agencies. But you can get that from the directory.
I feel a little uncomfortable... it feels like I'm promoting this stuff (I'm not getting any kick-backs!). But if it helps, that's great.
Sincerely,
Jason
Subj: Re: Agent resources 95-05-29 02:28:03 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
P.S. Don't forget, the merge and database features of your word processor will save you a great deal of time! I worked as a professional word-processor for several years. Your processor will take those hundreds of addresses and numbers and make short work of it--and you can use it again and again. It may take time to read the manual, but it will be worth it--you want an agent and a sold script, right? After you read the manual and you still need some help, let me know. I'll tell you how to set it up. Good luck.
Subj: Re: Whoops, almost forgot. 95-05-29 02:31:08 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Regarding the directory, look for only the agents marked literary. Sometimes agents who represent directors will also take on writers. I don't think "managers" will be helpful at this point. But I may be wrong.
Subj: Re: Sci-fi 95-05-29 03:02:48 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
A Leonis,
I don't know about the rest of "Hollywood," but I'm actually working on a type of sci-fi feature film for the major production company who hired me. The emphasis, though, is placed on the assassin/action aspect of the story, not the sci-fi. I also have heard of other major sci-fi productions in the works. So there's hope. I'm not sure what kind of sci-fi you're talking about (there are different types and levels of sci-fi), but depending upon the degree, it may lower your chances of your script (production values, studio execs who aren't "with it," etc.). There's a lot of possible advice regarding the marketing of your script that I could give, but I need to know more.
Subj: Re: Female Assassins 95-05-29 04:41:30 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
CLJUNG,
Female assassin movies are difficult to get produced. In fact, leading, credible females in action movies are rare. Hollywood isn't ready for it. But I believe there will be a strong movement of lead females in action movies soon. Of course, Shane Black recently wrote "A Long Kiss Goodnight" that sold for about 4 million to New Line. It will star Geena Davis and be directed by her current husband. I read it but I though the script was pretty bad. The word is I'm not the only one with that opinion. Shane's probably doing rewrites. Anyway, CLJung, if your script is about a band of female assassins and they are the leads in the movie, I think you're going to have a difficult time. But nothing is impossible. Don't give up!!! I was told a lot of "opinions" in my life and I still did what I wanted to do--and I got it (with careful and thoughtful planning).. Just be aware of what people think out there so that you know what to fight against. Good luck.
Subj: Re: "more about story telling" 95-05-29 04:52:20 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
A Leonis,
I don't think I've "mastered" the art of story telling and writing. I think I always want to learn and strive, hone the craft, and grow as a storyteller for the rest of my life. That's why teaching and learning, knowledge for the sake of knowledge, and collective, thought-provoking discussions are exciting for me. I would like to share and discuss with everyone story structure, characeter development, format, etc. However, I'm not sure if this folder would get the audience and response that we need. I'm new to this place. Does anyone have any suggestions where everyone can talk about this?
I also have certain ideas like starting a collective list of screenwriting, writing, drama, etc. books/resource materials that we can share with each other). I'm quite sure I haven't read everything out there and would like to.
Subj: Query/teaser example 95-05-29 05:18:45 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
I've got the teaser but I can't find the query letter (got a new computer and might of lost files in the process). I'll keep looking for the query letter and will let you know soon.
Subj: Robbed! 95-05-29 05:19:58 EDT
From: MurphWrite
Posted on: America Online
Well, Jason, I basically have no comment other than congrats on your agent/sales story. However, I was pretty horrified to see you suggest that people rip off another writer by reading her book in a bookstore rather than buying it. Sort of a bad idea, don't you think?
Subj: Oooops 95-05-29 05:23:08 EDT
From: MurphWrite
Posted on: America Online
Jason said:
<I've got the teaser but I can't find the query letter (got a new computer and might of lost files in the process). I'll keep looking for the query letter and will let you know soon. >
I'll bet his/her check's in the mail too.
Subj: Re:Murphwrite 95-05-29 06:21:41 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Sorry about the "bad idea." A bad joke in bad taste. Just to let you know, I did buy the book and have it right here next to me. (honestly) Thanks for the putting me on the level. For the record, if you like the book, buy it.
Subj: Re: Query letter 95-05-29 06:25:48 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
From Murph's cryptic comments, I may not have made myself clear. Several people have mailed me requests for my query/teaser letter so that they can have an example of one. I will try to send it out once I get find it.
Subj: Re:Murphwrite 95-05-29 06:26:17 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
<I assume this is, indeed, the case. I can only hope the appeal of a well-written, uplifting story with compelling characters, an abundance of fresh humor, and an original, thoroughly unpredictable plot, will outweigh this prejudice.>
Yo Al--
You bet it will if it's all that.
Wry
Subj: Re: Female Assassins 95-05-29 13:27:08 EDT
From: CLJUNG
Posted on: America Online
Thanks for the comments. Actually, my script doesn't need the female assassins to be "leads" per se. The story was developed around two female characters who are not, initially, part of the assassins' group (and was originally designed as a limited run TV series).
--cj
Subj: Re: "more about story telling" 95-05-29 15:18:12 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
Dear JSI,
Relax. I intended no sarcasm when I used the term "mastered." As far as I'm concerned, if you've managed to break into this business from out of nowhere with a spec script, you've demonstrated some degree of 'mastery."
Regards,
AL
Subj: Re:Murphwrite 95-05-29 15:21:57 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
I truly believe it is, Wry. We'll see if I can get anyone with a checkbook to agree.
Best regards,
AL
Subj: Re:A new "getting an agent" stor 95-05-29 19:06:15 EDT
From: Yabbert
Posted on: America Online
<They also recently offered me the potential opportunity to do a rewrite on a Jeb Stuart script.
I guess Robert Towne and William Goldman were busy.
Subj: Query/teaser sample 95-05-29 20:42:39 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
I'm trying to post the query sample but it keeps giving me a message about not being able to post "characters" and then asks me to get rid of it so that I can post it. But all my text characters are normal--I think. Can anyone help me on this?
Subj: Re:The lie detector test. 95-05-29 22:36:15 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
JSI - You did not come off as anything more than you are ... don't worry about it. Like I said, it's easy to tell tales here. But congrats on your break through, partner. I'm ahead of the curve on the marketing thing and that's how I got an option deal in '94. Well, it was a pretty good script,
too - guess that helps, right?
Keep us updated and continued good luck!!
- DW IN OH -
Subj: any agents for composers? 95-05-29 22:41:34 EDT
From: ACancelino
Posted on: America Online
I am a composer and would like to know if agents are available in NY specifically for composers. Any info is appreciated.
Thanks,
alan
Subj: Re:Query/teaser sample 95-05-30 01:19:35 EDT
From: Fyzikul
Posted on: America Online
It's the 'tab' characters that are causing the problem. You can go through and replace them, or, if you prefer, you can email it to me and I'll strip/replace them for you and send back a 'clean' copy.
--fyz the ever-helpful
Subj: Re:A new "getting an agent" stor 95-05-30 02:37:28 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
Jason, it sounds like you have a great concept AND a great execution of the script, and you probably also write a killer query letter.
What was your format? You don't have to be too specific with log lines, but I'd like to know what kind of query elicits 14 phone calls so quickly (g).
-- Tracie
Subj: Re:Skeptical, skeptical 95-05-30 02:43:20 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
Jason, Stallone held out for the lead ROLE in Rocky, so sure, anything is possible. But IMO if the script sells and does well, it's an extra help to getting your NEXT script produced, with you as a director.
-- Tracie
Subj: Re: "more about story telling" 95-05-30 02:53:21 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
J and anyone else...
A good source of screenwriting chat running the gamut from characterization to craft to chaos is available via an email list on the internet. If you feel you can handle the huge volume of mail the List generates (200 posts a day isn't completely unheard of, 90% of it totally off topic) you can subscribe, totally free (except for email charges) by sending a mail to:
LISTSERVE@TAMVM1.TAMU.EDU
In the subject line and in the text, write:
SUBSCRIBE SCRNWRIT (your name)
...and get ready for the email deluge. To get the List as one longggggg email, send another message to the same address but type SET SCRNWRIT DIGEST.
One caveat: the Listers subscribe under their real names; those with pseudos are not taken terribly seriously. One other caveat: the List is reproduced on a number of professional writers' boards, in full, every day -- so don't type something there you wouldn't want Steven Spielberg to read, since one never knows where this stuff goes once it's off in the ether.
...Um...or...I guess we could just create some folders around here...
-- Tracie
Subj: Here's the query/teaser letter 95-05-30 10:50:40 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
For the people who asked for a sample:
The query letter contains only three brief paragraphs. Each has a purpose. The first paragraph attempts to establish some credibility and make a unique impression that will help me stand out from the crowd. It's just a little anecdote from my life; but, at the time, I had no hollywood contacts, no awards (in screenwriting), previous screenplays, or stuff like that. So, "Use what you can." (By the way, although I was accepted, I only attended one or two semesters and then I left--it got too expensive and I didn't care for the program. But one doesn't have to say this. Just include the information that will catch some attention without out right lying. I did "study" there. Just never "graduated." I think you get my drift.)
To continue, the second paragraph briefly describes what my script is like. The third paragraph states what I'm looking to accomplish with this correspondence.
The design of what your query letter says depends upon your particular situation.
I placed the teaser in front of the query letter. My reasoning was that if the teaser catches them, they're more likely to read my query letter sooner. If they see a query letter first, they're more likely to say, "Oh, another query letter, I'll shove it under the other stuff for later." They probably will get to it, but much later. I figured that agents and assistants know by a glance what a query letter looks like without reading a word. But most people will read a well designed, flyer-type teaser (like a bill-board or movie trailer ad). So I used my desktop publishing and graphic design knowledge for my teaser. It was much bolder and larger than the one here. Content, of course, counts most of all.
The Teaser:
DEAD AIM
A MAFIA ASSASSIN TURNS
U.S. SPECIAL FORCES COMMANDER.
HER DARK PAST RETURNS, AND HE CRUELLY RANSOMS
THE COMMANDER'S FIVE-YEAR-OLD DAUGHTER
FOR JUST THREE MORE HITS.
BUT ONE OF HER TARGETS IS HER BOSS:
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
HER CODE NAME IS: DEAD AIM.
AND SHE NEVER MISSER HER TARGET.
NEVER.
The query letter:
Date
Name
Company
Dear Name,
In the Fall of 1992, 864 hopeful students applied world-wide to the highly competitive USC Film School. Only a talented few were selected; all qualifying for the minimum 3.5 gpa requirement--except one. I was admitted on my first try despite a 1.6 gpa. Not because of connections or film experience, but because of one reason--my entrance essay. My compelling essay convinced the USC admission board to actually break their own requirements and admit me along with only 15 other juniors; testifying to my writing ability.
After studying at USC, I have written a feature length script. It is an action film that features a female James Bond and written in the tradition of Die Hard and La Femme Nakita. The tagline is attached.
I am currently seeking an agent and hope you are interested in this script and future writings. Please contact me if you are. If not, I understand you will not be able to contact me, but I sincerely thank you for your time.
Well, that's it. I hope it gives you some insight and helps you somehow. If there are any other questions regarding this, let me know. If you want any suggestions on your query/teasers, maybe I can help out. By the way, I've been exploring the internet and I found a screenwriting place. It gives a lot of information from pros about agents and a lot of other kinds of stuff. You probably already know about it, but if you don't, here's the address: http://www.teleport.com/~cdeemer/scrwriter.html
Good luck,
Jason
P.S. Maybe someone can help me out there. I'm trying to send an e-mail to all those people at screenwrit. But I'm not sure how to go about it. I tried it once but I'm not sure if anyone got it.
Subj: Re:Jason lives! 95-05-30 13:46:08 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
A Leonis,
I think Jason did just as he claims. He obviously has a flair for dramatic fiction. Of course, that and negotiable debentures is two different things.
Subj: Re:Jason lives! 95-05-30 13:49:18 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I once heard that Francis Copolla write Reflections in a Golden Eye over a weekend. It didn't seem possible, but who knows -- he's so much better than me. I have written a fair number of feature length scripts over the years, and on average it takes me about 3 months to get from a notion to a first draft worthy of reading if I'm working alone, and a bit longer if I'm working with a partner.
How about you others? Am I a slowpoke or are Francis and Jason wunderkinds int he speed department?
Whaddya think?
Subj: Re:The lie detector test. 95-05-30 13:54:18 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Boy, Jason makes it all sound so EASY! What have I been missing for the past 25 years?
Still, anything -- and I mean ANYTHING -- is possible in the zany world of Hollywood. Just listen to some of the reasons stuff is rejected or need to be changed if you weant a taste of this town's most brilliant fiction.
Subj: Re:Skeptical, skeptical 95-05-30 13:57:40 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Even more skeptical about the low budget indie deal, since we have all heard about them in one way or another. Watch it, Jason.
I personally do't believe you can get anyone well-known to work on a picture budgeted at only $1.5 mil, unless you go for a cameo shot with a semi-retired character actor who only has to work a day or two.
Of course, if you were famous, successful, and had favors to call in...
Subj: Fast scripting 95-05-30 14:12:07 EDT
From: CLJUNG
Posted on: America Online
I'd say it depends on several things, when it comes to how quickly one can do a script.
We (the partner I am currently working with) spent two evenings discussing a treatment he had written on spec nearly twelve years ago and jotting down notes for crucial scenese. He had lost all copies of the treatment so was recalling what he could of the idea. Fortunately, for us, I remembered the beginning and the ending, he remembered the middle. It took me two days (okay, long days) to type up the first draft. I'm fairly proficient at touch typing.
Does that count as a quick first draft or does it have to be from scratch?
By the time we get to the point of actually writing down text, we've already spent a good deal of time discussing everything, including dialogue. The actual typing doesn't take much time, relatively speaking. It's already in our heads.
I don't find it so amazing that Jason can or did produce a script in a short number of days. Maybe he can type faster than others. I'd be interested to hear how he went about getting to the actual typing. Did he work out his ideas before? Either in his head or on paper?
I'm disappointed that some feel it necessary to criticize how quickly something is written. If it's good, it's good. If it's not, it needs work. But why does it have to take a long time to type in order to be valid?
Subj: Re: "more about story telling" 95-05-30 14:13:52 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Jason,
JoeRieux has posted a lot of iteresting, basic material on understanding
story movement and story structure in another folder here in the screenwriting area, and he is planning a edited version available soon. This stuff should be quite helpful to a newer writer. Keep poking around; you can never tell what little gems you might uncover.
Subj: Re:Robbed! 95-05-30 14:15:30 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
MurphWrite's right. Murph for president! We need a little honor and sense of right and wrongness around here!
Subj: Re:Jason lives! 95-05-30 14:31:07 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
I think you're absolutely right, Potty. More power to him. Success are grand.
Your pal,
AL
Subj: Jason and the Golden Fleece 95-05-30 15:38:25 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
Dear JSI,
I just don't get it. I'm happy as hell you've had some success, but if I had submitted an essay containing your various constructions to my high school English teacher, I wouldn't have received a passing grade.
"because of one reason"? -- as opposed to "for one reason"?
"It is an action film that features a female 'James Bond' and written (sic) in the tradition of 'Die Hard' and 'La femme Nakita' (sic)." It's "La Femme NIKITA," for Christ's sake!
I'm honestly not being willfully dense here, but I didn't get your "teaser" either.
"A Mafia assassin turns U.S. special forces commander"? Does that mean she "becomes" a U.S. special forces commander? Or does it mean she "turns" (subverts) a U.S. special forces commander to work in the interest of the Mafia?
"Her dark past returns, and he..." Who the hell is "he"?
"...he cruelly ransoms the commander's five year old daughter for just three more hits."
Your guess is as good as mine. Presumably the "commander's" five year old daughter is going to perform "three more hits" while she's being held captive.
Please don't be affronted by my comments. I'm sure my posting will be viewed as "sour grapes" by some. This is not the case. I'm properly ecstatic you've made the "big time," and you have my respect and admiration for having done so. With all appropriate humility, I just don't see how in the world you did it.
Please clarify,
A Leonis
Subj: Lit Agent for New & Established 95-05-30 18:04:22 EDT
From: DeeringLit
Posted on: America Online
The Deering Literary Agency, Inc. is now seeking queries through email and the internet.
We now have several openings in our client list for talented new and established authors and screenwriters. Email me at one of the names below to get our brochure.
Along with our main screen name, DeeringLit, you can email me at one of the following to ask questions about the agency and it's services, send a query about your manuscript, check on the progress of your evaluation and clients can request an update on their manuscripts in the submmissions process. If you don't know exactly where to send your question, email the main screen name (DeeringLit), to my attention (ie <subject of letter> Attn:Rich). These screen names don't change.
DeerngINFO manuscript queries
DeerngEDIT agency editing & other services information
DeerngMAIL client's updates
DeerngMISC anything else we didn't think of
A word about fees: the Deering Literary Agency *does* charge an evaluation fee for the service of manuscript review. The agency employs several professional evaluators, and there simply is no way to do this for free. *All* manuscripts submitted to the agency pass through the evaluation process as part of the decision to offer representation. The evaluation takes 4-6 weeks to do (depending on the volume of mss received this could vary +/- a couple of weeks), and the author receives a six page critical review of their work.
Thanks for your time, I look forward to hearing from you.
Rich
Subj: AGENTS/PRODUCERS BEWARE!!!!!!!!! 95-05-30 18:22:01 EDT
From: Spfool
Posted on: America Online
Theres a new, vital audience for the theater thats soon to die of starvation.
It seems everything marketed to the Generation X sensibility was borne not out of a desire to reach the minds of these young people, but out of a condescending capitalist race to cash in on the demographic; to condescend, not communicate.
Domestic Animal Instinct is the art theyve been hungry for.
A play written for the young sensibility by the young sensibility, this bold, hilarious story is a tragic farce about inertia as a form of advanced procrastination. With a dynamic mixture of classic slapstick and poetic profanity, Domestic Animal Instinct takes a lacerating look at the greatest
social ill facing the younger generation and the future of our planet: their lack of desire to work, to care, to survive. The evolutionary process has so far removed us from our relationship with the wild, that our behavior more resembles that of fat, stupid house cats than of predatory wolves and lions who must hunt and fight to survive. This is a wild comedy about a group of young people, some who struggle to realize their animal nature, some who struggle just to get out of bed.
(OMMITTED PLOT SYNOPSIS. TO QUOTE GABRIEL BYRNE IN EXCALIBUR, "I'M WARY OF WEASELS!" ...OR WAS THAT 'BATTLE?')
As fits its subject matter, Gregory P. Dorr wrote Domestic Animal Instinct almost two years after first developing the idea with friend and fledgling actor Alan E. Ryman. Between the conception and fruition of the script, Mr. Dorr toyed with journalism, screenwriting and television, co-writing and
developing the first fifteen episodes of the sit-com Huckleberry Inn, which is currently on hiatus somewhere between Santa Barbara and Purgatory. His childrens book Santas Lil Gimp, illustrated by Michael E. Russell, was published this last Christmas.
If you are interested in seeing a full script for the play, or have any other questions, please get in touch.
Subj: Agencies & Fees 95-05-30 21:54:50 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
What is it with all these agencies saying they are looking for new clients and eager to read script submissions - for a fee!? Is it my imagination, or have they been springing up like weeds?
A VP at William Morris once told me that if you are stupid enough to pay an agency, who is supposedly interested in representing you, money to read your script, then you deserve to be ripped off.
Subj: C+ from the English teacher 95-05-31 00:50:47 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
A Leonis,
I guess I'm lucky that agents aren't English teachers! And that they're more interested in making money than giving grades. Or that they aren't national spelling bee winners. Whew! Close call!
A Leonis, this is what I mean when I say there's a difference between a "writer" and a "storyteller." A storyteller can "write" to tell a story, but a writer doesn't necessarily tell stories. Is a journalist considered a "storyteller." What about an English teacher, essayist, or technical manual writer? Can stories be told only through writing? What about oral storytellers and, of course, filmmakers? As paint is to a painter, stone is to a sculpter, so to is human passion, thought, and drama to a storyteller. Words are not the storytellers material. They are only one among many tools for the storyteller. Granted, the storyteller must be adept with words, but if there are a few stumbles here and there, most people dont care. Ever see a movie where the director uses a camera movement or edit that sticks out like a sore thumb? It is the equivalent of bad grammar. But if the rest of the movie grabs you, moves you, thrills you, do you care? Most people dont. Only filmmakers may point it out. And so too will an English teacher, or a fellow screenwriter, point out grammar mistakes (if thats what he or she is concerned about). Dont get me wrong, Im not "affronted." Just clarifying.
Anyway, when I wrote the teaser, I had realized that there are more grammatical ways to write the teaser. But these choices were also longer, rhythmless, or colorless. Take the word turn for example. You did understand it. It was your first choice. Yes, youre right. It could also be interpreted the other way also. But most readers got it. I hope. I preferred that word over others because the connotation appealed to me more the the denotation of other more "appropriate and correct" words.
Just to let you know, not everyone got it. Or my script. I had studio executives doing a big ????? after reading my script. They actually said, I dont get it. And this is right after a major producer ran to them yelling, Shut your doors for two hours and read this right now!!!! Which they did. But nothing came of it. Oh well, Cant please everyone. But doesnt that apply to most things? My sister was probably one of the few that didnt like Forest Gump. But that didnt stop it from being a hit. (I dont expect my script to be succesful like Gump).
So if you didnt respond to the teaser, thats okay. Like I said, everyone will have their own situation--and style. So when you read this, understand the essence of what I was trying to do. Maybe that will help. Or say what I say when I see something crappy up on screen, "They made that?!! That means my script will sell. I could do better than that!"
I did appreciate your comments. I know that the teaser isn't perfect. Your reaction just tells me that I have to improve more.
Again, don't worry, I'm taking this in stride.
See ya around.
Best Regards,
Jason
Subj: Re:Fast scripting 95-05-31 00:56:02 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
You're right CLjung, it's content, not speed. I'm surprised it got such a reaction as it did. Don't worry, the script I'm working on now will take a lot, and I mean, A LOT, longer than my first. Sometimes it just sort of pours out of you. Sometimes not.
By the way, I heard the writer who did "Highway to Heaven" wrote those episodes over the weekend.
Subj: Re: Agencies and fees 95-05-31 01:24:26 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
ABSOLUTELY RIGHT, Sophrosyne!!!
In my experience, and from what I've heard of anyone in the biz who knows what they're talking about, no--and I mean NO--well-respected, legitimate agency asks for money. They get their money on the 10%. The closest thing that I had to pay regarding my agent is when she needed copies to send out. She told me straight out that until the client earns some money, they won't make copies. When they do, they'll be happy to. But I didn't have to pay courier fees or stuff like that (not like that other agency I heard horror stories about in this or another folder).
It's kind of funny, and appropriate, the company's name. Ever see what a four legged, brown, forest creature looks like when they're about to be rammed by a car? They freeze in the middle of the road, wide eyed, staring, mouth slightly open, breathing, with the expression, "Oh shit!!!! I'm f-----!!!! " I hope none of the gullible, unsuspecting screenwriter's out there looks like that.
Subj: Request for help 95-05-31 03:07:00 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
AryeDirect,
No problem with giving info. I hope I won't be repeating myself. (If it doesn't hit the mark, let me know).
As in writing and storytelling, one of the keys to marketing is placing yourself in the other person's shoes and trying to give them what they want. Basic psychology.
Bottom line: Agents want someone who they can get their 10% from.
This doesn't necessarily mean they're leeches (my agent is great). But it does mean you need to show them that you're worth their time. In one way, agents are like us screenwriters (surprise, surprise!). How? They work before they get paid. So make their time worthwhile. I'm not making a plug for agents. Just getting into their minds. Here's a few thoughts:
An agent is concerned with your credibility/credentials. If you've sold, that's a plus. If you haven't (like me at the time), give them something that will make you stand out as a writer or at least seem very passionate and serious.
Keep it short. Agents are busy with getting jobs for their current clients. I certainly hope mine is!
Talk a little about your screenplay. What's it like? Why is it different? Why is it good? And, bottom line, why is it saleable. Again, keep it short! This part is probably going to be the toughest paragraph to write in your letter.
Finally, tell them what you want. What you're looking for. Be polite. Sound "understanding" to them. Remember, the good agents--the one you're looking for--does want to get a writer and build a succesful career with them. They'll want to have a long-lasting, profitable relationship. It's nice for them to know you're a nice person too. They may work harder for you. My agent often tells me that it's nice just to talk with me (apparently it's refreshing; her other writers give her a hard time). I think it pays off for me. She's willing to talk with me more often (gives me more info) and she puts more energy and effort for me (she's been working for the last six to eight months with no fee and she's working on my contract so that I don't have to pay lawyer fee's--it's a standard contract but she's making sure of protecting all my rights).
I guess I can go on and on with advice. But I'll stop here. Look at what I just said and then back at my own query letter to see that it applies. Also, read some of those agent books I mentioned and hook up to the "screenwrit" place on the internet and access the FAQ. It has more info on agent hunting. Haven't read it, but it may help.
If you want to, let me know more about yourself so I can give specific information, or send a draft of your query letter to me via e-mail and I'll give you some feed back. No fee. Well... maybe a chocolate chip cookie. Wonder what it'll taste like after it goes through the internet? A cyber-cookie?
Best Regards,
Jason
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-05-31 07:28:54 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Dear Rich--
You can here from me right now. Take your goddamn fee-for-service crap to the Classified Section. Jesus, this is really starting to piss me off, people of no repute swooping in here trying to make a few bucks off newbie writers.
NEVER NEVER NEVER pay to have your script read by ANYONE, especially by an agent. I think it's time to find out of this one is registered and make a formal complaint.
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-05-31 07:35:46 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Jason---
Hmmm...one wonders whether you meant Special Forces Commander...or Commando.
I have a little...nay, a GREAT problem with this "A storyteller doesn't work in words," idea of yours. Excuse me, but aren't you the one who just told us that the only reason you got into USC with a crapola GPS was because of your brilliant writing? The more you post, the more contradictions pop up. Interesting.
As for time needed to finish a script. The first draft of the very first script I wrote took the five days I had for vacation from my day job. I've been re-writing it for the past 12 years.
Subj: Jason's Story 95-05-31 12:33:16 EDT
From: CarSpin
Posted on: America Online
I was post surfing. Read all about Jason's Hollywood adventure and all the comments regarding it.
Congrats, Jason. Don't let some of the more pissy posters get you down. We're a cynical but good spirited lot.
I, too, in this last year became a working writer. A sold a spec that I wrote in two weeks. (Never mind the story had been stewing for 15 years while I read every screenwriting book published.) It attracted top agents as well. I didn't however go with a small one. I chose a nice reputable medium sized agency. My primary agent has a good rep in the spec world. I've been very happy thus far. I signed with the agent one week, had a top director attached to my script the second week, and by the third week there was a bidding war. These things happen. Not often enough but they happen.
The dust has settled somewhat and I've come down from the clouds and I'm starting to experience the It's Not As Easy As I Thought Syndrome.
I, too, wanted to direct my spec. But my agents said it would never happen. It was such a hard sell script to begin with I needed a name director attached to help the sell. I don't regret the decision. After the script sold I had 21 meetings set up all over town in less time it took me to write my script (meet and greets my agent told me they were called) and from that a writing assignment followed.
I've just completed my second spec. My agency read it, liked it, (had some notes), but plans to go wide with it. Here's my dilemna. I want to direct. Do I insist on this? My agent says another spec sale would serve my career better and open the door for me to direct later. Is this a line? Will I hear this again? There's no guarantee in this biz. The script may fizzle on the spec market anyway. Let's face it. What are the odds I'll sell my second spec? Should I hold on to it and try to set it up with a small indie? Are there any writers out there with experience or insight with any of this?
Appreciate any response.
P.S. Jason--Did I meet you at the WGA orientation? Your story sounds just like a writer/director from NY who had just landed a studio writing assignment based on his spec.
Subj: Re:Agencies & Fees 95-05-31 17:32:49 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
<Morris agent says if you pay for an agency review, you desrve to be ripped off>
After all, as a writer you are providing a salesperson, gratis, with something (inventory) to sell, on a consignment basis, as it were. In this instance I'd have to say William Morris is RIGHT.
Now, how many times would you get that out of me?
Subj: Words, words, words 95-05-31 20:46:00 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Wryturguy,
Nay, there is no contradiction. If you look back at my analogy of an artist and his/her materials, you will see that as paint is to a painter, so to is human emotion and thought is to a storyteller. To continue, a paint brush is to a painter, as a word is to a storyteller. Don't get me wrong. I don't mean to belittle the importance of words and writing, but by making the distinct differentiation, I think it helps a storyteller to focus on what's truly important--human passion and drama. But maybe the word "doesn't" is a little extreme. So, yes, a storyteller uses words and they have importance. But a "writer" caught up in the words and writing, will often lose sight of the story.
An interesting story I heard once. The "writer" of Clan of the Cave Bear only had a high school education. When she sent the manuscript to the editor, it was "writing" was atrocious. But the story was great. As the best selling series testifies. Don't know if this is really true, but I think you can see my point.
By the way, when I "wrote" to USC, it was in an essay form, not story; the intent, the audience, the style of "writing" is different than in storytelling.
Hopefully, one day, we can all have discussions on writing "philosophies."
Good luck on that first script. Maybe it'll turn out to be just like wine. The older it gets...
Subj: Re:one-line guy 95-05-31 23:07:19 EDT
From: Vance V8
Posted on: America Online
Awhile back you mentioned the term "one-line guy."
What does it mean?
Please tell me so I don't have to watch Jeopardy.
Subj: Re: Agents 95-06-01 00:26:23 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
How long do you wait before calling re: your script?
I talked to Garry Marshall tonight (in person) and he said he is going to read my script. And I believe he will. But even if he does not get to if for a year, it will probably be before the agents actually get around to it.
Argh, argh, gnashing of teeth, WHY IS IT SO DIFFICULT TO GET AN AGENT TO ACTUALLY READ A SCRIPT? Or are they waiting for me to start calling to make sure I really want them to enough?
Alright, enough of my bad-tempered rambling . . .
Subj: Re: Agents 95-06-01 02:19:25 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Know how you feel, Sophrosyne. Patience, Patience.
Maybe you should get to know their assistants. They're the ones that often read the scripts, not the agents. Good luck.
Subj: Re: Time/Fees/Directing 95-06-01 02:42:24 EDT
From: CdBourbon
Posted on: America Online
Gotta be some of the more interesting posts we've had in a long time. Just makes me wanta respond to a few things in no particular order:
Pottree wondered how long it took others to wrap up a script top to bottom. You know, you hear how fast some write a successful (apply your own definition) script/book/whatever and just wag your head--Jason's in a week; Robt. James Waller w/Bridges of Madison County in 14 cartons, etc. For me, by the time I sit down to write a spec story, the majority of the work is done--in my head, in notes, in conversations with others. It simply comes down to there being no alternative other than to sit down and commit to a fit of writing in order to excercize the demon. The physical writing of it is the fun and fastest part: Craft and execution! Puzzles & play!
Even under contract and smothered by a deadline, like many others, my personal habit is wait to the last minute. Without a deadline, hell, it's all I can do to write my name. It's coming up with a unique spin on a plot and the rewriting that's a killer. But when there's no time to vacillate about which word works better here, or what focus to imply where, and there simply won't be a rewrite--just raw writing from the gut and riding the rails directly to the end--time and again I'm amazed at the quality and clarity of the words on the page. I've written 1/2 hour episodic television and 32-page biographical comicbooks overnight; done 1-hour episodic in 2 days; and a feature in 5 (because I told the producer who like the synopsis that is was done). But the simple fact remains, I got paid for it. Money's a great motivator. Was the work the best that I could do? Given the circumstances, at the time it was. I've taken months and years on other scripts. Meandered my way through, being fussy, being "deep" and "poignant." The writing any better? Not necessarily. Communicating effectively when it needs to is what it comes down to. Some sell. Others don't. Seems I can fathom why one does and another doesn't. But scratchin' yer head and wondering why is what the writer's life is all about, isn't it?
Next thing: Agents. Your agent works for you. Your ability to provide them the means to an income is what your value is to them. Their ability to turn what you do into an income is how you guage their value to you. It's no different than marriage. Each party has expectations of the other; each is ultimately accountable for the success of the relationship. Reading fees? Some very legitmate agencies, both screen and literary, charge fees. Is it ethical? Is it smart for the writer to pay them? To each their own. Thing I ask, if you want to sell your house, do you pay Century 21 to come out and look at it so they can decide whether or not they'd be interesed in marketing it for you?
Your scripts are you property. And in today's market, it's not totally beyond the realm of possibility that their value exceed the price of your average house. Without you, and agent has nothing. If you pay them to decide they're not interested in representing you, they do have your money. What do you got? A rejection. I'll sell you a rejection cheap.
Jason and holding out to direct: Just sell the script. You'll get your chance. You need the credit, the credibility, and the gob of insight you'll gain by watching something you've written being interpreted by another director. Then write something manageable you really want to direct.
Now back to our regular programming.
msg
spent preparing for the moment to done that to not sit down and write would be
Subj: Re: Fees 95-06-01 05:10:23 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Never, never pay a reading fee.
Think about it. Why is it so difficult to get an agent to read your script? Because the agent is busy working for his current clients. And when he's not negotiating for them, he is reading their stuff. I worked in a literary agency. Every weekend you'd see agents walking out the door with tall stacks of scripts. Most would read ten scripts a weekend. (Stack two reams of paper and imagine that each page is filled with words and you have to read them all this weekend, then you'll see why it takes so long to get read.)
But you want your agent to be busy. The fact that they are hard to get is a sad fact of this business, but they are hard to get for a good reason. The hardest working agents are the hardest to get read by, but they're the ones you should want.
This "Reading Fee" agency promises that everyone will be evaluated. How can they find time to do that? Simple. This agency is in the business of evaluating. That's how they make their money. Evaluation fees. If they made their money by getting people jobs they would not have time to evaluate everyone who submits to them.
If you just want an evaluation, I'd suggest you get it done by a screenwriting teacher at a university or film school. Most offer script evaluations for a per script fee. At least then you'll get an evaluation from someone who knows what they are talking about.
Subj: Re: Agents 95-06-01 08:22:52 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
Soph,
If it were me, I'd call the agent about once a month "just to say hi" and check if he/she had read the script yet.
My first agent intended to sign me but forgot to call and tell me. I doubt I'd have signed with him if I hadn't called him.
My current agent read my script within a few days of my giving it to her -- but if memory serves right (and it might not, it's only 8:30 AM now and my synapses aren't quite firing yet) I think I called her too.
Subj: Reading Fees 95-06-01 08:27:34 EDT
From: TF Hines
Posted on: America Online
What GT Hawk said. Good agents don't have to charge reading fees, since they make their money by selling scripts, right? An agent who has to charge reading fees probably isn't selling enough scripts.
Subj: Re:Fast scripting 95-06-01 10:03:30 EDT
From: Mark MLP
Posted on: America Online
Doesn't speed ( of scriptwriting) depend upon the source? If it comes straight out of your imagination it would ( or should) take longer than if it's an adaption of a novel like 'reflections of a Golden Eye'. I've written 2 scripts that took about 6 weeks to first draft in each case but both came from short stories I'd written previously. Without the short stories as a base they would've taken a lot longer. But that's the beauty of scriptwriting - -it writes fast and it reads fast!
Subj: Re:C+ from the English teacher 95-06-01 10:04:55 EDT
From: Mark MLP
Posted on: America Online
Dear Jason,
Isn't it Forrest Gump?
Subj: Re: Fees 95-06-01 13:55:00 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Thwak-o -- right on re: the fee scam.
BTW, Wry evaluates for cookies instead of cash.
Subj: Obst 95-06-01 14:37:10 EDT
From: Mebrennan
Posted on: America Online
If anyone has a moment and feels so inclined, I wd greatly appreciate an address (e-mail if at all possible) for Lynda Obst's production company. My HCD has just become a giant milk sponge, courtesy of 2-year-old. Thx.
mebrennan
Subj: Re: congrats JS 95-06-02 03:00:46 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
JS-
Just got in from out of town. Very glad to see your success story!
Now, regarding attachments:
Have you ever directed before? If not, I'd say don't do it-- for your own sake! Remember the fellow who wrote Moonstruck, then had his butt kissed and went on to direct Joe Vs. The Volcano?
Unless one is an Orson Welles, the set is no place to jump in and learn. (Unless it's a zero-budget film. Then you can make all the important mistakes and not feel guilty.)
The director must not only have talent, but command respect, think far ahead of the moment and be decisive. If the DP senses a chink in your armor they'll probably butt in and end up composing the shots and staging the action. The producer may smile and give you lip service but undermine your decisions.
By the way, (Pottree) wasn't Resevoir Dogs' budget about 1.2 mil and it still had Keitel? Good writing attracts talent.
Subj: Re: congrats JS 95-06-02 07:02:56 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
Yes, but Harvey Keitel will work for free as long as he gets to take his clothes off.
Subj: Once upon a time... 95-06-02 08:52:15 EDT
From: Big Words
Posted on: America Online
Hello, fellow neurosurgeons! -
Say, I have this AMAZING idea for a surgical technique that I thought of in the shower? Beleeve me, it's THE BEST TECHNIGUE EVER, all I need is how to get ahold of the MEyo Clinic. Does anyone know Mr. Mayo's number? Theyd be CRAZY to pass up on this idea, because the last thing I thoughtup, this 50-pp. racecar design presentation, (one night after a little too much pasta), anyway, several smaller car companies were SCREAMING AT ME on the phone to send it to him right away!! I think taht this may be easier, cuz I once mentioned to Harvard that I wanted to learn medicine their, and they said OKAY!
Meanwhile, I'm willing to hep anyone of the 2,000,000 million people on the Internet Online with any questions he has, because its easy, man. Just go for it!!
(A mini-fable by Kris Johnson)
REMEMBER:
> Hollywood is like high school with a lot of money. (Martin Mull)
> To become successful, act as if you already are. (Various personal development speakers) which unfortunately gets mutated into:
> Create your own heat, even if it means a tiny fib here or there.
But just in case my story is actually true:
> Nobody knows anything. (William Goldman)
> Anything can happen. (Um... Shakespeare?)
> It only takes ONE other person that truly loves your stuff. (Positive industry-folk)
Good luck, everyone. I wish us all success.
(Okay, maybe me a day or two before you...)
- Kris
Subj: Re: clothes off 95-06-02 12:30:09 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Unlike Harvey, I get paid to take my clothes off... and extra to put them back on.
Don't know the $ aspects of Dogs, but HK is both a talent and also a vey unusual case; you couldn't count on quality to be a draw or even get recognized as a rule, sayeth the cynic.
Although, I confess, in tandem with a former partner who had decades of experience and a recognized name, we did manage to enlist a cast of notables once upon a time for a project that of course never got made, including Mildred Natwick, Helen Hayes, Vivian Vance, Stacy Keach, and a few others. But the issue I believe is people with Q or a certain amount of boxoffice appeal both domestic and foreign when it comes to attachments that grease a deal. And those folks want bucks before the facelift falls.
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-06-02 18:19:09 EDT
From: DeeringLit
Posted on: America Online
I'm quite surprised at the reaction given to my recent posting.
Our agency *is* new to AOL and to the internet. If there are conventions of *where* to post, such as a classified section, my apologies for missing it.
As for being of "no repute," The Deering Agency is a signatory with with Screenwriters Guild. We charge a fee because we have to pay evaluators for their time in giving a detailed analysis. We're not bankrolled by a Hollywood production company to finance this.
I encourage any and *every* writer to work only with agents (or anyone) they feel comfortable with. If you don't like the idea of fees, by all means, there are other agents who don't charge, and I wish you the best. We say that we charge fees up front so that you *don't* waste your time if you don't believe in fees.
If you would like our input, please email me.
Rich
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-06-02 19:28:48 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Okay, Rich, first of all, for the past decade or two "The Screenwriter's Guild" has been renamed as the Writer's Guild of America.
Second of all, I just got off the phone with the WGA and they do not have a listing for The Deering Agency. I told them you were on AOL claiming to be signatory and that you were charging reading fees. The person in the Agency department said that perhaps you *were* signatory but aren't anymore because of the reading fee dealie.
Writer's beware. Stay way far away from this agency. Everything they've posted looks really, really, scammy. They have this whole computerized set up just to evaluate "potential" clients. What agency can spend that much time and effort just on finding new clients.
And that bit about "not being bankrolled by some big Hollywood Production Company". What agency is? Do these guys have any idea how this business works?
I'm gonna check the classified section and see if these crooks have indeed posted there. Spread the word, writers, NO UPFRONT FEES -- No matter what they call them.
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-06-02 19:33:10 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Also, this points out a very good lesson. Just because an agency says they're signatory does not mean that they are.
Always check with the Guild. (on the West Coast) (310) 550-1000, ask for the Agency department.
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-06-02 22:37:03 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Great going, GT!!! Go get'em!!!
Subj: Re:RE: Agents 95-06-03 07:53:03 EDT
From: Delta Wire
Posted on: America Online
Kev-
Where do you live?
Subj: Re:RE:Using Agents 95-06-03 18:17:28 EDT
From: No name998
Posted on: America Online
I'V WRITTEN WHAT I THIN WOULD MAKE A GREAT MOVIE. HOW DO I GO FROM HERE? I KNOW ABOUT DISCLOSURE FORMS. ARE THEY A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION? WHATS MY NEXT MOVE
Subj: Re:No name 95-06-03 21:30:42 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
First, fatten up your story. Then read through the folders on agents and writing query letters, and formatting your script.
Joe
Subj: Re:No name 95-06-04 01:24:38 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
No name998,
As Joe says, read this folder and others like it. It'll give you some insight and further places to get info. Check out screenwrit on the internet. The address is also in this folder. In screenwrit FAQ, there are information on agents and other stuff to get you going.
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-06-04 14:40:15 EDT
From: Mark MLP
Posted on: America Online
Thanks, Hawk for all your vigilance ( and research) on our behalf. I those dudes sounded suspicious.
Mark
Subj: Hmmm... 95-06-05 02:35:41 EDT
From: Chuckleboy
Posted on: America Online
I don't want to piss on anyone's parade, really, but I just read about the Jasonic miracle and I am somewhat sceptical. Maybe I am just being my goofy, suspicious self, but let me point out a few things, and then perhaps Jason can tell me where I've gone wrong. I hope my suspicions are misplaced because I want the same thing to happen to me.
First of all, I have to agree with A Leonis -- the teaser didn't grab me and I had trouble deciphering it in the same ways he did. The only teasers that I have heard of with the kind of magnetism this one apparetly has have been for high concept films. This is about a female assassin -- that is not high concept.
Jason countered the qustion of the odd grammar and strange sentence structure with the "words are to a story teller as tools are to a sculptor" analogy. This makes me think that he is saying that his ideas are so good they need not be polished to work their magic. The words don't have to be exact as long as the sentiment is there. If that's what he's saying, I have a real problem. Hollywood is full of ideas. Full of 'em. It is not the ideas that sells so much as the way they are presented. You can't say that your ideas are just so good, fresh and new, they need not have a vehicle to convey them. That is what words are for -- they are the vehicle for the sentiment. To create my own analogy, you can't win a race with a crappy car, no matter how good the driver.
I have some experience with this. I am a stand-up comic and, like the screenwriters (which I also am or I wouldn't be here), words and ideas are my business. However, unlike the screenwriters, when I work I see the effect immediately. One word has made the difference between a working joke and a non-working joke. The words are THAT important, the idea is lost without them. I don't think it is possible to break into the business selling ideas -- the big boys have trouble just selling the ideas.
I hope you can show me where I'm wrong Jason, I really do.
I think it is possible for lightning to strike twice, I just don't think it strikes often enough to power your car.
--Chuckles.
Subj: Re:Lit Agent for New & Establish 95-06-05 14:02:14 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
The WGA hasn't been called the Screenwriters Guild for more than a decade or two, it has been about 40 years, I believe. Further underscoring GThwak's point that the Deering people don't seem to be in the swim of things, Hollywood-wise... most strongly suggested by their statement idicating they believe agencies are somehow funded or backed by studios. IF this is true, hasn't the Supreme Court and trust busters heard about this?
Subj: Re:Hmmm... 95-06-05 14:23:20 EDT
From: CarSpin
Posted on: America Online
Chuckleboy,
I agree with everything you expressed I just think you missed Jason's point. He chose to write it his way, not your way. And apparently his way worked.
Also, I read his query letter. It was very smart of him to include his USC story and how he was a top contender. No studio exec. or producer wants to miss out on the next hot film school grad. It would definitely be worth an assistant's phone call.
With regard to words. No one is saying words are not important. I didn't get that at all from his posts. In school, English was my worse subject. It's not so hot today (however I'm constantly working on it). But I sold my first spec, my first script, my first anything I put on paper for a large sum of money to a large director at a large studio. And I didn't sell it because of the proper use of grammar, sentence structure and syntax. Believe me when I say an English teacher would have cringed. But the story worked. Putting the words together to tell the story I wanted to tell outweighed the few liberties I took with proper English, grammar, syntax, etc.
Anyone can write words. And do a damn proper English teacher approved job of it. Putting words together to tell an interesting, exciting, moving, dramatic, humorous story is another matter.
Subj: A good reader. 95-06-05 16:25:50 EDT
From: Rosepetl69
Posted on: America Online
CarSpin,
Thanks for being a good reader. You got my general meaning from my posts. It may not be the most concise, clear writing, I don't have time to edit my posts. Sorry everyone.
Subj: Oops. 95-06-05 16:31:11 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Just realized my fiance was the one who signed on and so her screenname showed up in the previous post. Either that, or I'm leading a double life!
Jason
Subj: Ha, Ha, Ha 95-06-05 17:15:07 EDT
From: JSI777
Posted on: America Online
Chuckles!!!
Like your name. Funny.
Okay. I guess, my writing in my posts doesn't seem to be very clear. But as you can see, CarSpin, who also has has some success, also sees my point that it is the story that counts.
So, to go on record (I think I've done this before), WORDS ARE IMPORTANT!!!!!
There. Now I won't get any more of these posts. To continue...
My posts were speaking on a matter of EMPHASIS. My reactions were to previous reactions. People said, "Hey, you're lying or really won't succeed because I found your stuff to be ungrammatical, etc." And I said, "I'm not lying, I'm a little successful, and don't worry to much about grammar -- concentrate on story and drama."
By the way, I'm also an award-winning and published poet and short story writer (not anything big! So don't jump on me on this one. I'm just trying to make a point!). As a poet and short story writer, I do know the power and beauty of words, syntax, etc. And so I UNDERSTAND your point of view, Chuckles. You're stand-up comedian stuff demands precision of words, etc.
Regarding high concept. You said >this is about a female assassin -- that is not high concept.< Tell me. Is it the "female" element or the "assassin" element that isn't high concept? You seem to state that it's gender or subject matter that makes it high concept. Does that mean that there aren't any movies with top "female" stars that wasn't high concept? Or maybe that there aren't any "assassin" movies that aren't high concept. Or maybe it's the combination. From what I understand, it's not the subject matter that is high concept (it can influence it though). High concept is the ability to communicate what the story is about in a brief, concise way. But tell me what your definition of high concept is.
You also say you have experience in "this." Presentation to you is important as a comedian. I can see that. And I guess that if someone presents it very well, crazily, they can make someone laugh even if the "idea" isn't that great. They can be "succesful" without the idea. But "STAND-UP COMEDY" is different than screenwriting. You trying to apply stand-up to writing sounds dangerous. Presentation, or "execution" as I've been told in the industry, is important in screenwriting. But the idea is also. If you had a choice to be a good presenter or good idea person, which would you choose... ? You say that THE IDEA IS LOST WITHOUT WORDS. But what are you going to say with those "words" without an idea? A good one, that is. You think people will read your perfect, grammatical, "nice presentational" words if the idea doesn't interest them? Hmmm.....
Give me a great idea any day... I'll work on those words. Again, a matter of emphasis... what's slightly more important? Hmmm.... ??
So, if you really want me to show you where you're wrong, I'll give it a shot. Maybe it's because you're narrow minded (I don't mean that in a mean way, really). What I mean is that you are so stuck on words, presentation, and everything else you believe in that maybe you lost sight of other ways of doing things. Although I emphasize the story, drama, etc., I still recognize the importance of words. Just because my analogy compares them with tools doesn't mean that I think they're worthless. So relax when I de-emphasize them for a moment. People wanted to know why I had a little success. And so I told them. It's because some people out there liked my "IDEA." I got hired for a writing assignment not because of my "writing" as much as it was because they think I can tell a good story. Bottom line. They can always hire an editor to correct it. But can the editor tell the story? Hmmm...
So as CarSpin mentioned, I did it my way. You do it your way. Maybe one day, I'll find a situation to do it your way. And, maybe, you'll see it my way and give it a try. You don't have to agree or do it, just keep an open mind and keep looking for that answer that works for you. I am.
Subj: Re:Ha, Ha, Ha 95-06-06 01:40:24 EDT
From: Chuckleboy
Posted on: America Online
Jason,
What I was trying to say about words and grammar is in no way an attack on style. It is very possible to tell a good story without following the rules, often great power comes from flaunting the rules. This, however, I believe to be the exception. The reason there is such a thing as grammar and syntax is to make all our sentiments clearer. That's all. You might have the best ideas in the world, but if they are presented in an unclear manner, they don't work. Also, I am not saying that one area is more important than the other, the story is very important as are the words that make up the stroy. You can't have one without the other. If I told a joke that was perfectly structured, but wasn't funny, then it wouldn't make people laugh. Similarly, if I told a funny joke that was poorly communicated, no one would laugh. The point is BOTH are important and I don't think it is possible to be a good writer without mastery of both ideas and language. Furthermore, I was not comparing stand-up to screenwriting. As I said in the last post, I do both and I am well aware of the subtleties of each form.
I was not attacking your writing, by the way, I know nothing about it. You may be very good at voice and plot, the most important elements of any story. All I had to go by was the teaser, which is primarily an example of your style and writing. All I was saying is that the idea of the female assassin and the mistakes in the writing would not have me banging on the door of any of my film associates as your story indicates other people did.
My definition of high concept, the type of idea that grabs you by the collar and won't let go in a teaser, is this -- a film idea that can be fully expressed and understood in one sentence because of its gimmick. BIG is an example -- a young boy wishes to be a man, has his wish come true and must deal with adult life, TWINS -- Danny DeVito and Arnold Schwartenegger are twins, JURRASSIC PARK -- a theme park featuring live dinosaurs fails to control the beasts with dire consequences, ET is one and there are many more. I am not saying that these are the best type of movies, far from it, they typically wind up being fairly bad, but they have the best chance to create electricity with a teaser, as just an idea. Your film, about the female assassin, requires more depth to understand and that's why I don't understand the killer reception you said it got. It has to be better than its gimmick. None of my favorite films, BTW, are high concept. Yours could be very good but if I were an agent that teaser would make your script an addition to the slush pile -- it would get looked at in its time and then could prove itself but, by your own admission, action films with female leads are difficult to sell, so why did so many people leap all over yours? Because of the teaser? That seems difficult to believe, but maybe you got lucky.
--Chuckles.
Subj: Re: Rules, Rules, Rules 95-06-06 02:51:36 EDT
From: CdBourbon
Posted on: America Online
Rules, rules, rules. Everybody's spouting off about rules. "It couldn'ta worked yer way, it wasn't my way!" "My way rules!" "You don't know the rules--follow the rules!"
What nonsense. Any professional writer in this folder--that is, any writer who's sold consistently--should know full well this simple axiom:
THERE IS NO SINGLE RIGHT WAY--ONLY AN INFINITE NUMBER OF WRONG WAYS. If it communicates swiftly and effectively what you set out to communicate, every argument/objection & colorless-smoke-
blowing-up-yer-keister-criticism is moot.
Subj: Re: Rules, Rules, Rules 95-06-06 12:38:29 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Re: right and wrong and wronger ways to sell:
I think Chuckles hit upon the MOST important word in his missive to Jason, almost as a throwaway -- LUCK.
There are tons of lousy scripts bought every day, and great ones that go begging. All isues of concept, quality, etc. aside, the single most important factor I've discerned (and I have been at this since the Johnson administration) is just dumb luck. Or Dumb and Dumber luck.
Good luck, all!
Subj: Re: agent list 95-06-06 13:38:20 EDT
From: AryeDirect
Posted on: America Online
Anyone out there with a current WGA agent list he/she would be willing to e-mail me?
AryeDirect
Subj: Re:The lie detector test. 95-06-07 01:55:42 EDT
From: VenusWI
Posted on: America Online
I once wrote one in 10 days. Of course it had six months worth of research behind it. And, okay, I wrote it with a partner. And, well, no, it hasn't sold yet. But a producer did take it to NBC. So that's something. And several other producers have asked for it (on spec, of course...it's MOW--nobody want's to pay for MOW specs unless they get the nod from the network.) And right now it's at the packaging department at ICM.
Anyway...that's my fast story.
Subj: Re:The lie detector test. 95-06-07 14:59:21 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
TRUE--
First script I sold was a rough draft written over a period of three weeks - though the actual time spent on the keyboard, and not scarfing pizza 'n beer with my partner, was more likely a solid 40 hours.
Truth to tell, I think the property (never produced) was unfocused, unweildly and lacking in a decent 'arc' for the lead.
I was actually on a flight out from Philly to LA, ostensibly looking for an apartment to move into, when a Producer seated next to me saw that I was proofing the draft.
We struck up a conversation, he read the rough draft, and by the time we landed I had a deal. Freaky!
The thing is probably languishing in some safety deposit box 'cause it sure wasn't shootable -- but who was I to argue with a pen-weilding Producer?
Never sold another one that way, though. My advice is to fly United, rack up some miles and proof ALL your scripts on in flight!
Gershwin music UP & OUT.....
Subj: New twist on agency fees 95-06-10 01:02:32 EDT
From: Merqu
Posted on: America Online
I was recently contacted by an agency that wants to hip-pocket one of my scripts. The catch -- I must sign a 6 month exclusive with the agency, and pay for messengers, handling, and copying services at $50 per submission (payable by non-refundable cashier's check) in advance of submissions.
Sound kosher?
Subj: Re:New twist on agency fees 95-06-10 12:38:33 EDT
From: RDMize
Posted on: America Online
Definitely not kosher,
NO legitimate agent who is a signatory to the WGA is allowed to charge you fees. A few very small agencies might ask you to submit multiple copies of your script (at your expense). And if you have a good agent, you might want to buy an occasional lunch. But that's it.
Best of luck,
RDM
Subj: Re:New twist on agency fees 95-06-11 01:12:37 EDT
From: Copoll
Posted on: America Online
DON'T YOU DARE!!! If your script is good enough, you can get a LEGITIMATE agent who won't charge you ANYTHING except 10 percent! Period!
Subj: Got A Nibble 95-06-13 17:20:43 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
Hi All:
Here's the set-up: I finished my 1st screenplay, sent query letters to several agents on the WGA list and to about fifty production companies from the HCD. This was two weeks ago. Got several "thanks but no thanks" responses, one "not interested in this but send us what else you've got", and now I just got a phone call from a large prod. co. that says they'll look at my screenplay if I have it submitted by an agent or an entertainment attorney. I have neither.
The question: Should I start calling agents and tell them that I've got an interested party willing to look at my script in the hopes that they'll send it on my behalf? Or, should I just go get myself an entertainment attorney tomorrow?
Any advice would be appreciated either here or via e-mail. Thanks all.
Subj: Re:Got A Nibble 95-06-13 23:44:49 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
G - My advice? Just send the script and worry about an agent if & when an actual contract is offered. I know it's exciting but the odds are astronomical that this anything special. Most likely the script will be read by a low-level reader and rejected. Pls don't get me wrong - I'm pulling for you. But this has has happened often to anyone writing and submitting with regularity. Don't start jumping for joy and making needless calls just yet. Prod co's employ many readers to sift through inquiries such as yours - it's like "let's throw a bowl of spaghetti against the wall and hope one noodle sticks."
In the worst case - let's say your script is purchased for $2.37 and goes on to be a #1 film ... the money will be the least concern as long as you get credit as writer. If this happens, your phone will begin to glow deep red - rather than azn agent, you'll need a secretary.
Good luck.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Got A Nibble 95-06-14 00:03:12 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I agree with DW. The production company probably wants you to submit through an Agent or attorney in order to avoid being sued. Perhaps if you ask to sign a release form they will be willing to read it. An attorney can be very expensive and most of them are not as connected as agents. Continue with your agent search and see if you can submit your script with a release form.
Subj: Best way to find an agent? 95-06-14 00:37:48 EDT
From: ChSims
Posted on: America Online
I'm a newbie screenwriter who completed his first script about 3 weeks ago. I am now in the process of rewriting to add some character dimension and additional motivation to give it "more life."
But enough background, my question is this -- Basically, what is the best way to go about finding an agent? I currently live in Philadelphia (not the best place to be for this type of work) and have limited resources.
The advice I've heard runs the gamut from cold calls, to letters, to simply dropping in at an agents office with script in hand. I was planning to make a trip to New York to do the latter and was wondering if this is something that is likely to prove effective. If not, should I just stick with the standard letter and/or phone call?
Finally, if anyone can offer their experiences on finding an agent outside of LA (i.e. can it be done) I'd appreciate hearing that too.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Please E-Mail ChSims with any advice.
Subj: Re:Best way to find an agent? 95-06-14 03:37:29 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
Can't offer any advice on how to find an agent from out of town, but I do know that dropping in unannounced will probably not work. Stick to letter and phone calls. Personally, I think the phone call route is more effective. But I've known people who've had great success with letters.
Subj: Agent/Attorney Advice 95-06-14 14:45:24 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
GT & DW:
Thanks for the input. I'm not jumping up and down (although my sister has been). I've read the war stories and refuse to get too excited. I spoke to an attorney in LA (a friend of a friend...) and he's giving me a call sometime today with the names of some specific agents I can call. He understood that his firms $5000 retainer fee might be a little too rich for an underemployed screenwriter wannabe... :)
Caroline
Subj: Re:Best way to find an agent? 95-06-14 23:10:48 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
GThawk - Isn't there a standard library file for these constant questions about finding an agent?
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Agent/Attorney Advice 95-06-14 23:16:23 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Caroline - Please PLEASE don't pay 5 grand, 5 hundred or 5 bucks, ok? That's just not the way it's done. Hang out here, read trade publications and eventually it all makes sense. And it's ok to be excited -
that's one reason we all do this. It's such a rush. Just know that the vast majority of the thrills we get are usually false alarms. Don't give up!
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Agent/Attorney Advice 95-06-15 01:33:22 EDT
From: MSalsberg
Posted on: America Online
caroline
Pay the five grand. It'll sell your script. When I paid my lawyer twelve thousand, he guaranteed me he would sell it for over seven hundred thousand and he was right.
Tell you what, send me a check for two thousand and I'll submit your script to my attourney. He's very sharp, perhaps you've heard of him. His name's Vinnie Gambibi. Did I mention he was my cousin?
If you do opt to pay the five grand to your guy, just remember that there's one of you born every minute. Who said that again?
Subj: Re:Agent/Attorney Advice 95-06-15 02:29:03 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
DW - There really should be a permanent file filled with the answers to frequently asked questions. Then again, most of these answers are in any "how to" screenwriting book.
Gennity,
It's really not worth going the Entertainment Attorney route. They are expensive and unnecessary until you get to the point where you need someone to negotiate complicated deals. There are only a handful of attorneys who have the connections that any decent agent has. And an agent is perfectly capable of negotiating standard and even some not so standard contracts. Generally, an entertainment attorney is someone to have "in addition" to a good agent, not "instead of".
Subj: Re: Attorney Fee 95-06-15 22:20:57 EDT
From: CarSpin
Posted on: America Online
Instead of a retainer, give the lawyer 5%. This is fairly standard in the biz. If the lawyer won't go for it. There are a lot who will.
Subj: Re: Attorney Fee 95-06-16 04:25:55 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
A 5% deal is not all that standard. Especially if you don't already have a job. It's very difficult for an attorney to justify to his firm time spent on a client who is paying 5% of nothing.
An agent *expects* to put out some effort out before seeing some return. The only thing he has to justify to his agency is that you have the *potential* to make money.
An agent can only commission a job he gets you. If you change agents while you have a job, your old agent still gets paid. Your new agent will have to find you a new job before he sees any dough. An agent also does not get paid on certain non-commissionable monies like program fees and residuals.
An entertainment attorney gets 5% of your *income*, period. Even if he had nothing to do with getting you the job which produces said income.
That is standard. There may be attorneys willing to work on another sort of contingency (attorneys, unlike agents, have a wide latitude as to what they can charge) but they probably won't be with a firm. And they probably are not that busy and that's not a good sign.
Also, Attorneys can (and most do) charge for expenses. That includes copying, messengers, faxes, postage, etc. If you go the retainer route, you can almost certainly expect to be charged for all of the above (at cost of materials plus labor) as well as being charged an exorbitant hourly rate for every phone call that attorney makes or takes.
Agents cannot charge for any of those things. (If they try to, hang on to your wallet and walk away fast.)
Attorney's are much less discriminating about the quality of writer they represent. As long as you got the cash, they're there for you. I know that can sound tempting when you've been banging your head against a wall trying to get representation but you gotta do it. You need an agent.
Maybe as a last ditch effort you could hire an attorney to submit something for you. If you really had faith something will come of it (or you have the money to burn). But you'll still need an agent to help you find your next job. (Attorneys, for the most part, are not there to look for jobs. They help you negotiate a deal once an opportunity has been found.)
Some bigwigs use only an attorney, no agent. But they are usually paying through the nose for their super connected attorney who probably doesn't have too many other clients besides them.
Subj: Good News But Worried 95-06-16 20:14:50 EDT
From: DaynaBayna
Posted on: America Online
After a year and a half, I've finally found an agent who is going to pitch a screenplay of mine to a couple of her contacts. But I'm wondering if I should be worried because I've never signed any legal papers or anything. Is this the usual? Should something legal happen once an agent decides to pitch a screenplay for someone? If anyone has any advice, please eMail me for I usually just check my mail everyday. I'm excited that the agent's finally accepted the script but I don't want anything to be messed up because nothing legal has been signed.
Thanks, Dayna
Subj: Re:Good News But Worried 95-06-17 01:34:26 EDT
From: Mindrew
Posted on: America Online
Dayna, imho as long as your work is copyrighted the agent has more to fear than you. Congratulations. You're what's referred to as a back-pocket client.
Subj: Attorney Fees/Agents/Etc. 95-06-17 02:23:13 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
DW & Co:
I never said I was going to pay anyone five grand or any money. I just mentioned what the guy said his retainer fee would be. I met with an entertainment attorney on Thursday. It's a large firm and well known. He's forwarding my script to the production company that requested it. I paid nothing. If they want it, he get's 10%. The other attorney (with the massive retainer fee) isn't looking to rook me either. He knows I'm not at a point in my career (I'm using the term loosely, I know) to be laying out cash. He IS, on the other hand, willing to help me out a bit. I'm sending him a copy of the script and he's forwarding it to an agent friend of his for consideration. We'll see if anything comes of that.
For the record: I'm new to the business end of things here but I'm not an idiot, okay? I mention that someone calls about my script and you guys act like I'm wetting my jeans and dreaming of meeting Keanu! I mention an attorney's retainer fee and there's a reference to "one born every minute". Come on...I was looking for advice -- not condescention, okay? (venting completed)
Keep it up and you're all out of my Oscar speech... ;)
Subj: Re:Got A Nibble 95-06-17 06:09:15 EDT
From: Doninge
Posted on: America Online
From experience... Agents are basically "legal" reps who are supposed to
make sure you don't get ripped off by production companies/publishers, and you COULD get ripped off unless you fully understand the terms of the contract. My suggestion: Send letter stating your dilemma to
L. Harry Lee Literary Agency
P.O.Box 203
Rocky Point, N.Y. 11778
516-744-1188
They will not charge any fees (beyond usual percentage upon sale) to
represent you as long as you legitimately have a REAL production company interested in your script. Lee isn't the biggest agency, but he
has a track-record and he's a square-shooter. Good luck.
Doninge.
Subj: Re:Got A Nibble 95-06-17 14:06:59 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
Doninge,
Thanks for the suggestion. I don't see this agency on the WGA list. Do you know why they're not a WGA signatory agency? Actually, for now, I'm in "wait and see" mode. I've gotten my script submitted to the prod co and it's on it's way to an agent at a midsize LA agency as well. But one never knows, do one? :)
Gennity
Subj: Re: proto-tykes 95-06-17 19:31:22 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
MSalsberg-
There's a twinkle in my eye who has a "great concept perfect for Willistallonegger." Which way to the depository?
Subj: Re: Which way 95-06-17 21:11:01 EDT
From: MSalsberg
Posted on: America Online
Phil
Follow the yellow brick road and they'll all be waiting for you with a check in hand.
Subj: Re:Attorney Fees/Agents/Etc. 95-06-18 23:35:46 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
666 - Gee, excuse me. Your post came off if not wetting your pants, at least knock-kneed at the powder room door. Methinks you're way too sensitive but I can't win. I try to give straight advice, I get attitude. I toss a little flame toward a blithering idiot, it gets hot again.
Have a cool drink, 666. And before you accuse us of condescension, try learning how to spell it.
Venting complete.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Advice from the great DW? 95-06-19 00:17:19 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
DW,
Is it bitter in here or is it just you?
Wishing you all the success you deserve!
-- Gennity666
Subj: Writing Credits 95-06-19 00:28:23 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
I've only got one completed screenplay and am working on another. I make no bones about my lack of experience in the film industry. Some of the people posting in the screenwriting folders give the impression that they've had enough success in the business to qualify them as some sort of authority on the subject. I'm sure some of them are but I've been having doubts about the credentials of our more vocal and abrasive members. Is there someplace around here that these folks have listed their writing credits? If so, I'd love to see them.
How about you DW? Impress me.
Subj: HCD 95-06-19 13:24:30 EDT
From: Mebrennan
Posted on: America Online
Does anyone know if the new Hollywood Creative Directory is out yet? Also--does anyone have a phone# from which HCD can be ordered from out of town? Wd appreciate an e-mail very much.
Thanks
mel
mebrennan@aol.com
Subj: Re:Advice from the great DW? 95-06-19 13:51:17 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
666:
Anyone who's been around tends to leak a little of the bitterness now and then. It's an occupational hazzard quite divorced from the quality of the advice tendered.
Subj: Agents/Prod. Co. 95-06-19 19:11:20 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
Just a note . . . awhile ago we had a writer online who went on about how many prod co/agents he had gotten interested in a script he had just written, and he left a copy of his method and teaser/query on the boards. I know there were a lot of doubters, but I tried it. After all, what could it hurt?
Bought the HCD and I faxed a few places that I thought might be interested in my script - changed my style of teaser, pumped up the query - and I`ve been surprised at the amount of interest it has generated.
It`s not as much heat as established writers get going by any means, but it`s better than I have been doing!
Thanks, Jason.
Subj: re:DW 95-06-19 22:29:25 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
I've found that DW says out loud what others might say in a whisper, or behind the back. There's a sting in his words at times, but also knowledge. It for each person to figure the tradeoff for themselves.
I just feel greatful to be able to listen in to the living, on-going conversation.
Joe
Subj: Re:Advice from the great DW? 95-06-19 22:57:46 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
G - PLEASE not another Sensitive Sue. You asked for advice, got it from several IDs and then become defensive. I grow weary of word wars.
G, I got all the success I can handle, ok? I'm writing for money and the love of movies - I'll let you be famous. But I'm not fighting with you so drop the stance. Peace -
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Writing Credits 95-06-19 23:21:09 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
G - You're new and this question has been asked to death over the years. If you want only advice from big-time writers, it ain't gonna happen.
If you want adive from only specific IDs, please note them. Otherwise, when you ask a question, it's pot luck, ok? I have no interest in impressing someone with one completed screenplay. Keep writing.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Writing Credits 95-06-19 23:23:30 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Joe - Don't sell yerself short, partner. You've added a lot to this board.
- DW IN OH -
MAN! The posting is slow tonight ... what gives?
Subj: Re:re:DW 95-06-19 23:37:08 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Dawn - If I used the term "art-moron," it's harsh and I apologize ... but I truly don't remember it. I will admit to an opinion that avant garde anything is as useless as a side saddle on a pig but ...
As for your credit ... wonderful. But you miss the point. You could tell me you wrote anything and who cares? If you wrote "Dumb and Dumber" I'd only be impressed by your tax bracket, not your writing. This is a wonderful endeavor. A new 20 something writer strike big with a first effort
and a grizzled vet can do the same.
I want out of all this endless wrangling. It's up to you ... stay with the drooling baboons like Cog or go your own way. As for me, I'm through
arguing with you ... at least about this fluff.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Writing Credits 95-06-20 01:42:59 EDT
From: Gennity666
Posted on: America Online
DW,
Just thought you'd like to know that your wonderful attitude over here has you mentioned on other on-line services as well. Seems you're loved all over. Myself, I'm heading to friendlier waters where the folks are more supportive of their fellow writers. Don't miss me too much!
Gennity
P.S. If you're going to give advice I suggest *you* learn how to spell it.
Subj: Yo DW! 95-06-20 17:16:35 EDT
From: CarSpin
Posted on: America Online
Enough with the double posting. Fix your thang.
Subj: Re:Agents/Prod. Co. 95-06-20 17:23:12 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Population explosion:
There are now two or more born every minute!
How shallow and tawdry if the Jason technique is the most successful on the block!
Subj: Re:Advice from the great DW? 95-06-20 17:25:25 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
What is it about DW that seems to bring out the worst in people?
Is it something like Adolph's and meats? MSG and hon shu gai? Beer and burritos?
Or is it just the frequency of exposure, like a sunburn?
Subj: Re:Pot Luck 95-06-20 17:26:33 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
DW,
Are you trying to send all the newbies in my direction again?
Subj: Solicitation a Necessity? 95-06-27 00:57:25 EDT
From: ChSims
Posted on: America Online
I know I've been posting here with a lot of stupid questions recently but, lo and behold, another one has popped into my head. I'm becoming increasingly aware through the messages posted on this and other boards that agents are absolutely unwilling to read material unless it, or the writer, has been referred to them by someone they know.
Is my assumption correct?
Subj: Re:Solicitation a Necessity? 95-06-27 13:34:12 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I don't think it is necassarily true that reputable agents will only read material preented by someone they know... but it is a btter route than a cold presentation -- both more likely and also a stronger opening than a wannabee twisting in the wind.
Agents -- refute me and prove that I am wrong!
Subj: copyrights 95-06-27 18:28:00 EDT
From: TracesOf
Posted on: America Online
Can someone help me? I've done a little writing and would like to inquire as to how one goes about getting something copyrighted. I haven't the foggiest idea. Would someone please email me as to how one goes about getting one as well as WHERE one goes. I would realy appreciate any help someone could give.
Thanks,
Gary
Subj: Re:copyrights 95-06-27 20:15:44 EDT
From: Bryboru
Posted on: America Online
Gary,
You can get the information you need by calling the U.S. Library of Congress in Washington, DC.
Technically, if you have written something and you put the copyright symbol on the manuscript it IS copyrighted, and anyone reading your material should consider it so. However,that does not mean you can just leave it at that. You DO need to file an application for Copyright with the appropriate office in order for your piece to be fully protected.
This is what I've been told. Good luck.
Subj: Re:Solicitation a Necessity? 95-06-27 21:49:20 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
They`re in no hurry, even if they do know you.
You could always try becoming a reader for an agency and recommending your own script.
Subj: Re:copyrights 95-06-27 21:51:41 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
You should also register it with WGAw (it costs $20) and will prove that you wrote the script in a dispute.
But if you want big bucks in a law suit you also need a copyright.
Subj: Help 95-06-28 02:32:10 EDT
From: Mlazlo
Posted on: America Online
I have an Agent interested in my script. He told me it's very "HIGH CONCEPT" and that he's willing to represent me. He said his firm is one of the big three. My question is this ,what does High Concept mean? I would assume it means a serious story. My story is not, it's very simple actually . Also, what are the big three ? He's with a firm called I.C.M. with offices in N.Y. and L.A. Any help would be appreciated. I started writing two months ago, so I'm a newbie.
Thanks Lazlo
Subj: Re:Lazlo 95-06-28 03:17:10 EDT
From: MSalsberg
Posted on: America Online
Lazlo
Is this another Jason? What the hell's the deal here. You've been writing for two months and have an agent at ICM. How? Is he a friend, a lover?
ICM is one of the three biggies and if he wants to represent you, then let him represent you. How did you get to him?
Subj: Re:Lazlo 95-06-28 03:27:56 EDT
From: Mlazlo
Posted on: America Online
A lover?
I don't know what to say but no.
What I meant by two months is the time it took me to write the script.
Who is Jason? Friday the 13th Jason. nO I'm not he.
Subj: Re:Lazlo 95-06-28 12:16:48 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
I'm dying to see this script. Are the agents at ICM on five martini lunches now? I feel a mighty chain yanking....
Who is this Freddy? I am not nightmare.
Subj: Re:copyrights 95-06-28 12:41:05 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
All material that is unpublished is coyrighted automatically.
For screen writing (treatments, scripts) your material shoudl be registered with the WGA so that you have a way to show what you did and when you did it should someone try to swipe it and shoudl a rich uncle pay for a lawyer for you to go after them.
Most screen work does not need to be copyrighted as it is not ever "published" in the way a book is published.
Get a copy of Dealmaking in the Film and TV Industry by Litwak for a whole gloss on the legal issues of the dodge.
Subj: Re:Help 95-06-28 12:44:32 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Laz,
ICM is one of the biggest talent agencies, and very above-board. I knew; I used to be represented by them. It was so big I was losty in the shuffle of packaging projects for their superstars, which is their main business, but you are off to a great start and I wish you the very best luck. If ICM wants to sign you after only a couple of months of trying, grab a pen and sign!
High concept means that the story is based on a simple premise that any child or studio exec could understand, and that it doesn't depend on characters, relationships, or anything too erudite or fine for its impact, that's it's a viscereal piece rather than an emotional story. Most action pictures are high concept (robot from the future tries to influence the past is a high concept).
Best luck!
Subj: Re:Help 95-06-28 22:05:27 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Pottree - Nice, polite and PC reply but our collective chains are being yanked here by Jason II.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:copyrights 95-06-28 22:43:55 EDT
From: Dsugimoto
Posted on: America Online
Call the Library of Congress (202) 707-3000. Ask for Form PA. It costs $20 and takes about four months for them to send your copyright document.
Subj: Re:copyrights 95-06-28 22:46:24 EDT
From: Dsugimoto
Posted on: America Online
Sorry for the addendum. You didn't specify the nature of your material. Form PA is for performing arts material (scripts, music etc.) only.
Subj: Re: Jason 2 95-06-29 07:53:07 EDT
From: Mlazlo
Posted on: America Online
Allow me to retort,
I do not pull chains, I link them together.
A little ol' newbie asks for some advice and gets laughed at and mocked. Well I never.
But as my Grandmother always says some good comes out of everything. Now I have a writing partner. Jason's coming over tommorrow night to discuss my next "High Concept" idea.
Speaking of Grandmother, she play's bridge with a group of ladies, it turns out one of the grey hairs has a grandson in the picture business. She told my Nanna to get my script to her and then she would pass it on to the right people. My question is this, who is Joel Silver and what movies has he done.
Thanks again Lazlo
Subj: Re:Help 95-06-29 12:55:09 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
DW, my momma raised me right.
Subj: Re:Help 95-06-30 22:17:26 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
Go for it!
He`s right, ICM is big. And high concept kind of means simple and easy to market.
Congrats!
Subj: Re:Help 95-06-30 22:20:37 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
Well that`ll teach me to post before I read further into the board!
Jason, Lazlo, who`s next?
Subj: Re:DW in OHIO 95-07-01 14:07:04 EDT
From: Terry17591
Posted on: America Online
I have scanned the postings in the screenwriting section and have come to the conclusion that DW in OH and the Wryterguy don't have jobs. If they did, they wouldn't be spending half their life posting messages....
As far as anyone else is concerned, I thought this was a place where one could exchange ideas and possible contacts. Better luck in the World Wide Web...
Subj: Re:DW in OHIO 95-07-03 06:51:26 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I, for one, am quite glad to have DW and Wryturguy around. They spice things up and they say things that others in this business would only whisper behind your back after giving you the polite brush off.
So a newbie gets burned every once in a while. It won't be the last time they get burned if they continue in this business. It may be the only time they get burned so honestly and frankly. And if it curbs the newbie urge to gush and ask questions without any prior research than I think they are doing a great service in helping newbies to not sound like newbies.
Long live DW and WG. (Mainly because I like to see how huffy and flustered they make other posters.)
Subj: Re:DW in OHIO 95-07-03 13:09:17 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Right on Thwak. But, I think our pal Wry is semi-retired from the board for now as he is busy on some project (you could call that a job, I guess) and DW, from what I know, works in radio, if you call that work.
The thing is, these guys don't SLEEP or probably have KIDS, accounting for their surplus of free time.
Subj: Re: Jason 2 95-07-04 20:18:55 EDT
From: Mebrennan
Posted on: America Online
Dear MLazlo:
Joel Silver is a dentist and he has pulled many teeth. Ask for Novocaine.
Subj: Frustrated 95-07-06 13:08:34 EDT
From: Ravelin
Posted on: America Online
I am not a happy person. Unrepresented writers of the world UNITE I say. I have been on the phone for the past hour and half, in contact with, like 30 friggin agencies, and you know how many have agreed to even LOOK at my work? Huh? Do ya? ZERO!! None I say. I can't even get my work someplace to BE rejected. I'm not saying life is fair, (See the production of Judge Dredd - how that guy got an agent I'll never know). I'm not saying this business is fair, I'm not saying I'm in this for the money(Although it would be nice). What I am saying is that I am fed up and tired of this whole system. Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got more phone calls to make - sigh.
Subj: Re:Frustrated 95-07-06 16:12:33 EDT
From: A Leonis
Posted on: America Online
Dear Frustrated,
If you think you feel bad now, take a look at JSI777's posting on 5/27/95. (Re: the "Jasonic Miracle") In this and subsequent postings, Jason offers a promising alternative method for reaching agents and producers.
Best regards,
A Leonis
Subj: Re:Frustrated 95-07-06 20:13:57 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
Ravelin,
If I try a door over and over and can't get through, I find another door. Try writing a great query letter. Try some smaller agencies. Read Hollywood Scriptwriter. Contact production companies directly. Read through the postings around here about how to put out your ideas over the phone, about how to write a query letter. Check out Charles Deemers screen writers page on the WWW. It has tips on query letters, etc.
Joe
Subj: Re:Frustrated 95-07-06 20:45:12 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Ravin' Rav:
The WGA list highlights agencies willing to look at unsolicited submissions/new writers.
Subj: Need Agent with huevos 95-07-10 17:09:56 EDT
From: MookLaredo
Posted on: America Online
Me: Writer with ganas. You: Agent with huevos who
will help me market my completed zany (l20 pages)
script featuring a thirtyish, Latino, rag-tag street
musician in Vegas. A plot with lots of twists and turns, a roguish hero, a despicable villain, a cute young couple in cahoots with hero. Very commercial.
Any takers? Contact mooklaredo@aol.com.
Subj: Re:DW in OHIO 95-07-11 01:42:40 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Terry - Sorry to disappoint but I have MUCHO job. I just don't waste a lot of time doing useless stuff like ... scanning past board messages to see who posts often. Geeesh - talk about needing a job!?!
DW IN OH
Subj: Re:DW in OHIO 95-07-11 01:45:56 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
GTHawk - Hey, thanks. I love it when some net-surfer swoops in with a proclamation like Terry's and then disappears into the ether w/o adding anything after criticizing some of us for doing the same damned thing.
This board is an idea exchange AND a fun place (usually) to hang out and shoot the breeze with writers of all levels. Gee, Terry - sorry it's not a seminar on hidden character motivations or Effective Foreshadowing 101.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:DW in OHIO 95-07-11 01:47:44 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Pottree - Well, you're right. No kids, sleep 6 hours a day but the radio thing is a great gig. Like anything else (including writing) it SEEMS easy to those outside but the trick is MAKING it seems easy. It's tough to do well.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Know Jodie's address? 95-07-11 15:01:34 EDT
From: Poe24
Posted on: America Online
TO DW IN OH
I had a 10th grade teacher tell me what I was not going to do in life. "Put your feet on the ground and you head out of the clouds," she said.
Well that is exactly why I will never be common. It is people like you who restrain those of us who dream. Lets just hope there are those like me who use such sarcasm to excell....
A dream is all we have,
Poe24
Subj: Re:Know Jodie's address? 95-07-11 22:20:16 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Poe - Aside from your presumptuous ID, I hope your scriptwriting is as ringing as your self-congratulatory posts.
Keep dreaming.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH 95-07-12 00:31:36 EDT
From: Lotus 2
Posted on: America Online
Dear DW,
Don't let anybody on this board convince you to move to CA. It sucks, believe me. L.A. is a pit, an endless traffic jam. I live in SF; it's O.K. because it's the least city-fied of any urban area in the U.S.; but it's very expensive and earthquake prone.
Keep writing.
Might I suggest you pick a producer whose work you really like and who produces the genre/s you write about, then write him/her, or better yet, try to meet them at a film festival. Schmoozing does work occasionally.
It might hearten you to read Elliott Weinberger's Wannabe, a true tale of insider Hollywood at its worst.
You've got to find that one intelligent, perceptive and creative individual out there and hit it off with them.. I know your dream contact is out there -- find it!
Much Luck,
A fellow wordsmith
Subj: Re:Frustrated 95-07-12 00:55:26 EDT
From: VenusWI
Posted on: America Online
Ravelin,
If you keep calling the agents cold, you are likely to keep on being frustrated. I've been in their offices and the phones are literally ringing off the hooks. They don't want to be bothered by unproven writers like us. But there are ways to get (remember, I said I've been in their offices).
1) Get some names of individual agents within the agencies. Where? Hollywood Reporter lists them all the time, but you have to read the articles to find them. Also, any of the agents who speak at the Selling to Hollywood Conference in August are usually approachable, and their names are listed in all the conference brochures.
Then...write to those individual agents with a great pitch (a la Jason in early posts). Then, you can follow up with a phone call, but generally those who are interested will call you. Honest. It happens.
2) Do call production companies, preferably the smaller ones. Look up the person to contact in the Hollywood Creative Directory (a very expensive, but very worthwhile book). Call that person and ask if you can pitch your story over the phone. Generally, they will say yes. If they're hooked, they'll ask you to send the script. If they like it (and this is the biggest IF of all) and want to buy it, guess who will answer your next phone call when you say, "I've got a script someone wants to buy and I'm looking for an agent to help with the negotiations"?????
Need more specifics?... it's okay to e-mail me.
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-12 13:35:48 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Lotus,
Oh, hogtobble! People in SF and Northern California generally like to disparage LA the same way New Yorkers like to dis the Deep South and... LA.
Like anywhere else, it's what you make of it, as a place to live and work. Sure, we have problems. Everyone has problems. I think from your tone you don't like the idea of living in any urban area and just barely tolerate SF. That's your way and enjoy it as you can.
But some of us actually like LA for the good things it offers. I've been here 20 years after Boston and NY and from where I sit, it's pretty nice (if you don't breathe, drive the freeways, drink the tapwater, get lost in the wrong neighborhoods, expect decent restaurant service, etc.) and has a number of advantages for those in or trying to be in the picture business.
Many very successful people are able to live in Idaho or Utah or somewhere, but the workadays who have to keep sellling selling selling should be here, or in NY, if they're serious, IMHO.
DW and I have discussed this before, and of course come to no agreement.
Subj: Re: DW in OH 95-07-12 22:42:56 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
'Preciate the kind words. I did the CA thing a looong time ago, just starting out in media biz and the thought of going back for anything other than a visit is so depressing. I hope LA can somehow reinvent itself but I think all the large American coastal cities are in for a tough ride.
I spend all my free time writing then go on flurries of submittals, weather the rejections, accept the minor victories, stock up more provisions and set sail again.
The best to you as well.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-12 22:50:45 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Pottree - Hey, a new tack in our discussion. Hear me out ...
It's amazing how adaptable the human animal is. Ever drive someone else'd used car? To the owner, it's great. But you notice stains on the seats, a cracked window, an oil leak, one turn signal out, etc. Over time, the owner has grown used to the ailments, adapting and ignoring. But the new driver notices them immediately.
If you've lived in LA for 20 years, you've probably gotten used to the degradation of lifestyle. You may have bought in to the mystique without even knowing it. I did when I lived in Southern CA. Where live is no Garden of Eden but it's a big step up in terms of enjoyment of life. And when we go to Canada or Idaho on vacation, the question ALWAYS arises ... "why aren't we living HERE?"
But we make friends with our surroundings and like a flawed relative, find all sorts of ways to justify our choices.
Years ago I saw a TV special showing a Russian family visiting the U.S.
for the first time. they were in a grocery store when they broke into tears, moved by the vast choice of food & goods we take for granted. When asked why they still wanted to return to Russia after their visit, they revealed a universal human trait by saying "because it's home."
I understand that. And if LA is your home and feels comfortable to you, God bless you. Hope I get to buy you a cold one someday on a Sunset Blvd. bistro.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-13 14:19:56 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Hmmm, hot and thirstifying today. Could use a cold one right now... or, perhaps, after the pitch luncheon I'm leaving for now.
Or, we coudl make it at John Barleycorn's riverboat in Cinncy!
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-13 15:04:17 EDT
From: Txt File
Posted on: America Online
>>If you've lived in LA for 20 years, you've probably gotten used to the degradation of lifestyle. You may have bought in to the mystique without even knowing it. I did when I lived in Southern CA.<<
If you don't like LA, fine. But would you mind shutting up about it? Degredation. Mystique. What the hell are you talking about? You sound like someone going way out of their way to justify a decision to not live here. Just say you don't live here and leave it at that. Not all of us want to live in rural areas and tip cows and spend our weekends avoiding house chores and going to Blockbuster and writing .4 pages of a screenplay that has to be Fed Exed to get in the right zip code.
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 02:02:50 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
I'm just curious, but when you tip over a cow, don't they just get up again?
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 05:20:45 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
I'm so tired of LA bashing. You know, we get it from everyone.
I'm not native to L.A., I was born and raised in Hawaii. Whenever I go back everyone seems to think we have drive bys on the hour. Yes, there are some really tough parts of town, but there are so many different ways of life here. A lot of our crew guys prefer a more rural lifestyle and live in Wrightwood and commute into town. You can live in the mountains or by the beach. You can live by docks or by an orange grove.
I used to live right off Melrose and really enjoyed being able to walk to really great restaurants and some of the funkiest shopping around. And some of the best people watching. True you had to watch your back at night (and in some areas, during the day!), but walking down Melrose or Hollywood is like reading a book. There is so much drama and comedy and it's all live and real.
Now I live in Burbank. In a very specific area of Burbank. Right next to the Los Angeles Equestrian Center. We have stables and so do all of our neighbors. When you turn the corner onto our street, it feels like "country". The area is bordered by riding trails and parks. You see cowboy types and proper English show riders. You hear roosters in the morning and the whinnies of contented horses. People hitch up carriages with jingle bells at Christmas. But we are walking distance to Disney, Warner Bros and Sony. And guess what, since it's such a dense studio concentration, and studios have very staggered start and stop times for their employees, there is very little traffic.
Whenever someone says they hate L.A. I want to say, "Which part?". There is so much here. The neighborhoods change so dramatically and there are so many wonderful pockets of peaceful living.
If you want to work in features from out of town, you are at a serious disadvantage. It's close to impossible to work from out of town as a TV writer (unless you live in New York and then it's only very much harder than LA).
And if you explore long enough you may find a place in LA that you like.
When we first moved to Burbank from Hollywood we went Christmas Shopping for toys for various nieces and nephews. We decided to get something to eat so we were covering up our packages in the back seat. A woman saw us and said "Oh, I'm guessing you have a little one at home and you don't want him to see his presents..." I said, "No, we just don't want anyone to steal our stuff" She looked so shocked and said "No one would ever do that!!" After living here for half a year now I see why. There is such a dramatic difference in the amount of crime. And Hollywood is less than 15 minutes away!!
Subj: Re: How now, cow tow 95-07-14 12:28:02 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
Joe, you can tip the cows all you want but they still won't let you into the Viper Club.
Phil (Bosco) Noir
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 21:12:31 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Txt File,
Whoa, partner! There are lots of places that aren't LA that ALSO aren't the rural, cow-tipping patch! Eg, my hometown of NYC, my former haunt in Boston/Cambridge, MA. There are others. The issue isn't whether you can take the urban heat, it's whether you need to live near the belly of the beast to get a writing career into high enough gear to live where you damn wll please... and not if your favorite song is Newman's I Love LA!
DW lives in OH because he like it (says he) and he also has a job there. TWo good reasons. Q: is that standing in the way of his progress int he writing dodge? No ad hominem needed.
-- Happy in LA
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 21:14:58 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Thwak,
Burbank doesn't count as LA, but it is close. About 2 miles from us! Plus, you have the zillion screens at AMC.
Subj: Re: How now, cow tow 95-07-14 21:16:30 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Phil.
Again, on LA!
I've been to the Viper Room a couple of times on a research mission (yeah, right... but truly!!) and anyone can get in, especially if you're on the list. Just make sure to bring scuba gear if you're bothered by smoke, of which there is TOO MUCH!
But it is way cool.
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 23:13:26 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Pottree - You and I know what happened at your luncheon. Now ... is the Hollywood custom that I pick up the tab? Do you accept out-of-state checks with no ID?
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 23:15:50 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Txt - After years on this board, your ID is new to me. But I thank you for injecting an intelligent and hearty post to my conversation with Pottree. And it's excellent evidence for my decision to remain a "cow tipper."
Your Friend In Ohio
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 23:17:39 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Joe - Not if they're tipped over anywhere near our annual Great American Rib Cook Off. But to keep Txt from doo-dooing in his Hilfigers, yes ... they do get up.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-14 23:23:22 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
GTHawk - We're pretty much cyber buddies so accept this in the spirit it's given.
1) I never stated "I hate LA."
2) My area of Ohio is not Camelot. All of America faces problems and while ours may be different, they exist.
3) I'm fully aware that living here is a conscious choice and will (and has) seriously impeded my screenwriting efforts. But it will not stop
them.
4) Your post was well taken, ok? Where I Iive, it's very tough to relate
to the problems of Cleveland 25 miles away. So I understand the
thrust of your words.
5) This is just harmless shooting the breeze, ok? No tub-thumping.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-15 00:05:28 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
DW,
My tub is un-thumped. And I completly understand and respect your desire to live where you want to live. When all is said and done, everyone's primary objective in life should be to make themselves happy.
I was just venting. L.A. has been my home for more than a decade now and I generally have to hold my tongue while people lash away at it. My family is from Hawaii and my in-laws are from Iowa and just about 99% of everyone I've met in both places (and many places in between) look at L.A. as just a gussied up version of Hell.
I'm proud to be considered your cyber-bud!!
Subj: re:cow tipping 95-07-15 03:10:49 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
I know I'm probably sounding...well, like I sound, but if you tip a cow over and it gets up, what's the point?
Subj: Re:re:cow tipping 95-07-15 16:19:10 EDT
From: Mkword
Posted on: America Online
Hey DW, as someone who's engaged you on this topic before, I think I understand the feelings of GThawk and Txt.
You really do give LA a good bashing every chance you get even if you think you are being fair and reasonable. Which is fine. That's your take on it. But now that I've been a resident for 18 months, I can sympathize with their anger at having their lives being deemed "degraded" simply for living here when in fact that is not necessarily true.
You gotta admit, you've thumped your tub a few times and tend to generalize about LA and its inhabitants.
Your friend ex-New Yorker friend now living in Los Angeles,
Mk
Subj: Re: DW in OH in CA 95-07-15 23:56:49 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
GTHawk - Glad you're happy. If there was any way I could feasibly see myself moving to LA, I'd be walking Sunset Monday afternoon, briefcase in hand, song in my heart. But I've worked too hard to even think of endangering what i/we have. Sooo - if I'm to do well, it will be that much more difficult. If I eventually give up, living here might be a major reason. The last thing LA needs is another desperate wannabe clogging up the works or pouring coffee. Besides, my reticence makes it easier for you, no?
Hey, I want to sell a script. I have stories to tell and am a commercially minded guy. If I can't tell a story at the multiplex for seven figures, I'll tell 'em at work for free. And if anyone feels my kind of writer lacks the courage of my convictions ... you're most likely correct.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:re:cow tipping 95-07-15 23:58:29 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Joe - If you tip a cow and it gets up, you receive no points. If it stays tipped, you're awarded 10 bonus points and Burger King has a few more Whoppers. It's a state law, ya know.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:re:cow tipping 95-07-16 00:01:41 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Mk - Maybe so, maybe so. There's also elements of jealousy, fear of failure, anger at how the "system" works, etc. But I DID live there, Mk -
2 yrs in So. CA, 2 yrs in the North.
It's an ancient argument, always good for running up the AOL bill. I wish you luck. When you sign your multi-script deal, remember who yer AOL buds were!!!
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Off Topic! 95-07-16 05:33:20 EDT
From: WriteTV
Posted on: America Online
Hey folks,
Thought this was a folder on AGENTS (and yes, I'm yelling). The last week or so all I've seen are posts about whether DW should move from OH. Please -- if DW wants to stay in OH, that's DW's business.
Now for a real question. I write one-hour TV, am currently Story Editor on a low-budget first-run syndie series, shopping for an agent. Last Friday I had a meeting with an agent at a small (2-person) agency -- she actually used the words "I want to represent you" during the meeting. I'm also talking to an agent at Gersh -- but the other two TV agents there have been taking their time reading me. I called the Gersh guy, told him about the other agency with the intention of gauging Gersh's interest, not to pressure or coerce -- which, unfortunately, is how he took it. So my question -- have I blown it with the Gersh guy?
Advice, please!
Genia
Subj: Re:Off Topic! 95-07-16 14:10:58 EDT
From: JonMacy
Posted on: America Online
Way to go Genia. I stopped even checking this board because of the lack of any dialogue remotely connected with agents. Hope this board will once again pick up the thread of what it was intended to sew.
JonMacy
Subj: Re:Off Topic! 95-07-16 14:43:58 EDT
From: Mkword
Posted on: America Online
DW:
You forget possibly that I've already had a studio sale and I did it when I was still living in New York! In fact, I refused to move to LA for many of the reasons you've cited in other postings. I couldn't possibly live in Los Angeles. Ugh. I was still able to get assignments and such, but it involved a lot of flying back and forth. Then I finally bit the bullet and moved. And I found out that: 1. I was stereotyping LA and it's actually quite a fine place to live ... and ... 2. I could get a lot more done for my career out here.
But it all comes down to personal choices. We each have our own lives and choices and things that matter most to us.
Genia:
It's hard to evaluate without having heard your conversation. Some agents get all weird if you tell them you are considering anyone else but them. Most do not. Most understand that a new writer has to check into every possibility they have at gaining representation. Most agents will be attracted to a potential client that is already desired by another agent.
Often it depends on how you worded the situation. If you said, "Hey Jack. I already got someone pounding down my door. If you don't jump, you'll lose. Get it?!" then you've probably blown it. But if you said, "Hey, howya doing? How's life? Oh by the way I just wanted to let you know that Agency X expressed some interest in me, and they're nice people and all, but since I met with you first and we really seemed to hit it off I wanted to make sure you guys got the first shot." ... well .... you should be fine. An agent understands the business and they should be upfront with you as you should be unpfront with them. If they get upset over something like that, then they probably weren't the place to go with anyway. It's always best to start these relationships off as open and honest as possible.
Subj: Re: Have it your way 95-07-16 14:52:07 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
DW-
Gee, I always thought those Burger King patties were grown in Dupont labs. Urp.
Phil
Subj: Agents 95-07-16 20:57:20 EDT
From: Sophrosyne
Posted on: America Online
Genia,
Agents sometimes pick up strange things that you don`t intend. I told an agent once that I would like him to consider my script (we had met before and actually, he owed me a favor) but not to feel pressured into accepting it, since I also had a nibble from some of the other agencies as well, like CAA (who has some kind of first look deal with my school). Well, he got all insulted and now he`s not talking to me.
Live and learn.
Subj: AFI writer seeks agent 95-07-16 22:55:03 EDT
From: JinHLYWOOD
Posted on: America Online
I'm currently a screenwriting fellow at AFI. I have never sought representation before, but afters years of writing, I think my craft is now at the level that I can get representation and sell my scripts. I have two scripts that I know can be sold and made into successful movies: one is a children's action-adventure, and the other is a comedy written specifically for Eddie Murphy, but the the lead role can be any comedic actor. I'm serious about my goals and am totally committed to a career in screenwriting. I would prefer correspondence by E-mail, and I thank you for your time.
John McKinzey
Subj: Changing Agents 95-07-16 23:57:29 EDT
From: RollFilm
Posted on: America Online
I understand that all agencies are bound by the Writer's Guild clause that
basically says you can drop your agent if no work is found for you after 90 days. If this is true, and one wants to get out of one's contract with the utmost grace,
What is required to officially sever the cord?
Can you shop for a new agent in the meantime?
And what about any scripts that the soon-to-be ex-agent had under his/her wing? If the agent "opened no doors" for any scripts they allegedly "took around town", they are not entitled to their 10% after the cord is severed. Are they?
Am I free to give those same scripts to a new agent for shopping around town?
Thanks, in advance, for all the wisdom that will undoubtedly be bestowed upon me.
Subj: Thanks 95-07-17 01:47:07 EDT
From: WriteTV
Posted on: America Online
Mkword and Sophrosyne,
Thanks for the advice. I'm supposed to call the Gersh guy first thing Monday -- fingers are crossed.
JonMacy,
Good to hear from you!
Genia
Subj: Re:Changing Agents 95-07-17 05:39:52 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
You can shop around for a new agent before you give your current agent the boot. In fact, you shouldn't fire your current agent until you have another agent confirmed.
You must sever your relationship with your current agent in writing. And since you aren't going to do that until you have a new agent lined up, the new agent can help you with the language of the letter. But it's really straight-forward. Basically, you say you're severing the relationship, the reason you're severing the relationship (no work in 90 days, etc.), and that they are not allowed to submit your work or negotiate on your behalf from this date forward.
Any scripts you gave to your old agent should be returned (But it's not a big deal if they don't, as long as you have copies.) The scripts are your property and you may show them to anyone you please. If your old agent got you a job then you must pay him ten percent for all monies derived from that job. That is all you owe your old agent. Any scripts that they showed around town are still yours and can be given to your new agent to shop around town. Even a script that was the result of a job your old agent got you can still be submitted to people as a sample of your work by your new agent.
Subj: Re:re:cow tipping point 95-07-17 12:57:41 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
The point is that if you having nothing to do, nowhere to go, and no imaginatin, you are mean to even dumer creatures.
Most outgrow this around age 4, but some suffer arrested development, abetted by sensory and cultural deprivation.
Subj: Re:re:cow tipping 95-07-17 12:59:06 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
MK,
You see how easy it is to come to the defense of LA after living in NY (my homwtown)? It is almost too easy -- and they've never even heard of key money!
Subj: Re:Off Topic! 95-07-17 13:02:14 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Genie,
IMHO if you feel you have to walk on eggshells with the hired help (agents) they are not the ones for you!
My personal criteria in the same current search: work at a place reeking with influence; pay rent, no mortgage (hungry).
Subj: Re:Changing Agents 95-07-17 13:05:48 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Roll,
Not all agenices are WGA signatories, so beware of mistakenly lumping the kosher with the treif.
Subj: Strategy? 95-07-17 15:50:01 EDT
From: SportIndy
Posted on: America Online
Am wondering the best way to market my work. I have more than ten diverse screenplays (of which nearly half need a rewrite), the sum of which was created in less than a year's time.
My question is this:
Should I market myself as a dilligent writer who will continue to produce large amounts material for years to come, bettering my craft with each effort, and send a large sampling of my work, OR, should I submit only the one screenplay I think best representats of my overall body of work?
Will an agent work for me due to my proven dilligence in hopes that I some day write the next great American film? Is that how they think? Or are they interested in the right now?
Also, to further muddle my dilemma, my work is diverse in genre and I'm not sure which ONE I would choose as representative.
Anyway, thanks for your time and assistance
Thinman
PS Interesting -- I've noticed the ones incessantly bickering over pointless, immature subjects on these boards (and on my time) are not the ones who offer much actual insight. Perhaps more time should be spent studying your craft. Just a thought. Much thanks to those who genuinely and solely seek to learn and help as I do.
Subj: Re:Off Topic! 95-07-17 23:06:56 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Genia - Here's some advice ... chill. Nothing's written in stone and these topics are very fluid. It's an open market bazzar of sorts. If the topic straying doesn't suit you, just do what you did ... post something to get it back to where it can help you. But no need to be patronizing to me, ok?
Now ... in my humble opinion, I have ZERO interest in series TV writing of any kind. But I'll allow you to interrupt my ode to OH, ok?
It's a joke ... geeesh!
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Strategy? 95-07-17 23:17:26 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Thinman - I generally try to avoid folks who use the word "craft" in the same paragraph where they admit writing TEN scripts in a year, a feat only Roger Corman could admire. I say that 'cause I know you were aiming your pea-shooter my way. Still ...
I face much the same dilemma (is that sp right?). I've been told that decade or so ago it might have been ok to submit a screenplay without extensive rewriting and retooling. No more. The competition is too great.
Where writing a script in the top 10% was ok, it's now more like top 2-3%.
My humble advice is to choose two, an A & B. Submit the A, mention the B as being available. This is ONLY after you're real certain that the two scripts are at submission level. The others can just lurk on the shelf until needed. I think mentioning the ten scripts or 20 or 30 will scare more people off than attract them to you. William Goldman maybe has written 10 or 20 great scripts ... not you or me.
Having said that, I often disregard my own advice. I get so excited by my stories that I day dream a producer, etc., will kinda feel the vibes jump off the paper. But I'm relying more on feedback and rewrites now than vibes.
Enough insight or should I e-mail you some killer 'shrooms?
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Strategy? 95-07-17 23:27:16 EDT
From: SportIndy
Posted on: America Online
DW,
Thanks for the reply. Shrooms are good.
Thinman
Subj: Re:Strategy? 95-07-18 01:02:22 EDT
From: GThawk
Posted on: America Online
In my experience, no one is overly impressed with how prolific a writer is in terms of representing them. You should concentrate on the scripts that are your best writing. Having two great scripts of different genres shows that you have range. But I don't think any agent is going to be impressed that you've produced a "large" amount of work if half of your scripts need re-writes. Volume is not a consideration except when you're talking about a volume of produced quality work.
When looking for an agent you should concentrate on one and maybe two of your best scripts. Once you are signed with an agent you can give him the rest of your scripts for him to submit (but only the ones you feel are up to par. Anything you feel needs a re-write should be not be submitted until it is in top shape) You can tell your agent about scripts you are working on to see if there is an idea he's especially excited about as a way of deciding which piece to concentrate on.
But nobody is going to start jumping up and down because you can "Crank 'em out". Yes, in TV it helps to have a fast writer on your staff, but given the choice between a quick writer and a good writer everyone would opt for the better writer.
And with features, speed is a moot point. As long as you're not so slow that you miss deadlines (and deadlines are mandated by the WGA and are quite reasonable) how fast you write is not a consideration. If the goods are there, they're there, you don't get extra points for turning something in early.
Subj: Re:Strategy? 95-07-18 12:34:20 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Forget volume and the future; forget what you like or believe in; choose your best work that you think has the most commercial appeal and write query letters touting that, as well as your overall efforts and send them to bona fide agencies as listed and koshered by the WGA.
Better still, exploit a contact.
Best luck!
Subj: Re:Secret Agent Man 95-07-18 12:40:39 EDT
From: Phil Noir
Posted on: America Online
Pottree:
< but some suffer arrested development, abetted by sensory and cultural deprivation.> -- Joel Silver?
DW-
Best 'shrooms grow in cow chips. Tip over a few Bessies and mail 'em to my PO box. I'll bottle some LA smog (extra crispy) in return. Great buzz.
Sport-
I have about 10 screenplays available. I've created a synopsis list which I send out for potential Production companies to peruse. I also include a full treatment of my best (well, most commercial) property, and a resume. Nine times out of ten this is enough to get a callback. That's how I landed my agent, too.
Diversity is terrific. If any of your stuff needs a re-write cross it off your list. Only put your most polished work on the market. With all the comepetition, why would any agent or studio want half a script when they can buy a complete one? They'll want their own re-writes anyway.
Hope this is of some help.
Phil
Subj: Re:Strategy? 95-07-18 22:26:10 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Thinman - Plus you can produce a movie in your mind reeeal cheap. Seriously, I share your problem but I'd rather deal with that than some writers who labor for years over one piece only to be destroyed when it's rejected. Best of luck to you.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Secret Agent Man 95-07-18 22:28:27 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Phil - You're correct. I also have 1-3 sentence log lines on my stuff. Less intimidating and pretentious. As for the shrooms, there's lowing in my Back 40 ... I gots some bovine bumpin' ta do!
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:Schrooms 95-07-19 17:49:40 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
I've had good luck with the little borwn-and-gray ones that grow on rotting caskets deep in some eldritch vault where it's always dank and fetid.
Last trip, I actually thought I'd met an agent who was interested in my development as an artist and was aggressive enough to get out and talk up my stuff at real studios around town, and even in Europe.
But when I woke up I still wasn't famous.
Alak.
Subj: AGENT NEEDED FOR THEATRE PLAY 95-07-20 02:12:18 EDT
From: Kardtrx1
Posted on: America Online
I have written a "one-man" play about Harry Houdini. The script is filled with magic, humor and fascination told my the master of mystery himself while performing many of his tricks and escapes (taking us back a hundred years). Many top magicians in the country love the script, but don't have the time to dedicate to making it come to a live stage. If you would like a copy of the script, please email me. KARDTRX1
Subj: INFO HELP 95-07-20 17:27:44 EDT
From: Mebrennan
Posted on: America Online
A couple of production companies have asked to take a look at my screenplay, but want a release. (Don't have an agent now.) Anyway -- I'm wondering if there's a bookstore or some place that might stock a standard release form that I could use? Anybody know? I'd appreciate an e-mail. Thnx.
Ed
mebrennan@aol.com
Subj: Re:Strategy? 95-07-20 23:54:56 EDT
From: JinHLYWOOD
Posted on: America Online
Send the best. Prolific means nothing. THey want something they can sell, not bulk. I read for producer, so don't blow a chance by sending out anything other than the very best.
Subj: What up? 95-07-22 22:49:12 EDT
From: NATEYNATE
Posted on: America Online
I recently had an agency request two of my scripts. I sent them and four weeks later they sent them back with a from letter attached. I looked at the scripts for evidence of them being opened and read, and they looked untouched. What might have happened? How should I take this?
Nateynate
Subj: Re:What up? Up? 95-07-24 01:49:29 EDT
From: Bitzman
Posted on: America Online
"It's Chinatown Jake, just walk away."
Subj: Re:What up? Up? 95-07-24 13:00:11 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Ignore it and move ahead smartly.
Subj: re:what's up 95-07-25 01:29:50 EDT
From: JoeRioux
Posted on: America Online
If you're formatting's okay, and you're under a 120 pages, one person might have asked for your scripts, and given them to someone else to read, who didn't appreciate the task, or....or....or....
Hard to say.
Subj: Begging for disillusionment.. 95-07-27 02:11:30 EDT
From: Clawe
Posted on: America Online
Howdy,
I'm another one of the "I just wrote my first screenplay" club memembers and was stopping in for some advice. I've sent out a couple loglines, and recieved several interested responses. I'm currently registering my screenplay with the WGA and preparing my teaser/query sheet. What do I do now? Attempt to search the WGA directory for an agent? Send out queries? Give up?
I've read many of the posts here on the BB, and am quivering in anticipation for the torrents of advice and sarcasm that will doubtlessly fall on me.
Subj: Re:Begging for disillusionment.. 95-07-27 16:02:49 EDT
From: MSalsberg
Posted on: America Online
Clawe
It's my opinion that you'd be wasting your time approaching agents with just one script, unless you have personal connections to them. The best advice I can give you is to look for production companies that have done similar type films that you have and to try and get to them directly. This could be done by query or cold calls. Generally, they'll tell you they take nothing unsolicited. If you tell them you have a release, it might help. They may budge.
If you're bent on an agent, forget going to the biggies. Try a list of WGA that will read new writers, but this proces is far more time consuming and frustrating than to go producers directly.
Good luck
Subj: Re:Outside L.A. Agents. 95-07-31 23:25:52 EDT
From: WRtx
Posted on: America Online
Dumb Question of the Evening:
Wouldn't having an agent on the West Coast provide the face-to-face shmooze factor for you regardless of your own location (provided, of course, that the agent is working for you)?
Subj: Just another silly... 95-08-01 14:07:48 EDT
From: PerkyDS
Posted on: America Online
stupid question!
OK, I just logged this whole folder and hopefully will learn a lot.
However, I am ready for email or public humiliation for the following...
First - JoeRioux - thank you for your help XOX.
Are there any groups of fledgling screenwriters (or those with fully developed wings) in the Orange County area who meet to discuss all the wonderful topics listed in these hallowed boards?
OR is there someone willing to chat with me on-line? (I'll send you a check for the 2 hours...
OR - is there someone in the OC area willing to spend a couple hours chatting w/someone - in the flesh. (Fully clothed flesh, of course.) Yes, I would be willing to pay the person...but I ain't rich, OK.
OR should I just see a shrink and forget about this stuff?
OR OR OR...sounds like a seal, eh?
(By the way Joe, I think my eyes have permanently crossed from trying to re-format my manuscript. Is investing in a computer program a good idea?)
Questions. Questions. Questions. Don't you just hate newbies?
Subj: Online referencing 95-08-07 20:08:09 EDT
From: Sn Coleman
Posted on: America Online
Hello to all the happy smiling faces! I'm an aspiring screenwriter and have only a little more experience doing that than I have getting through the 'net. I'm cruising through an AOL 10 hour freebie and am not entirely sold on it's usefulness (mostly, but not entirely).
Anyway, I'm looking for a detailed street map of the city of Sarajevo. Yeah, that place. Something with names of streets, outlying suburbs/areas and the airport, something I can actually hold in my hands. I'm certain there must be one published somewhere! I'd looked up the CIA World Factbook, checked out the Univ. of Texas' map library as well as a few other places until I had the feeling I could just stumble on forever. I've sent inquiries to Nat'l. Geographic and the Smithsonian. Perhaps there are some map wholesalers, specialists, whatever... How could I best take advantage of being online to pursue my search?
Unrelated: This message board is terrific. Lots of helpful into. Thanks!
Subj: Re:Begging for disillusionment.. 95-08-08 01:38:26 EDT
From: Oscar 99
Posted on: America Online
Brad,
What to do next...
Write, write and write some more.
Good luck.
Jeffrey Bryan Trudeau
Oscar99
Subj: Re:Online referencing 95-08-08 12:16:48 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Go to Travel and poke around there, you might find something. Then, try Library of Congress.
Subj: Two-year contract? 95-08-08 16:43:34 EDT
From: Screenfeem
Posted on: America Online
Does anyone out there know if a two-year contract is standard practice for agencies? My last agent signed me for one year with a four-month escape clause. This new one wants me to sign for two years. Seems like a long time. Help!!!
Screenfeem
Subj: Re:Two-year contract? 95-08-11 00:01:57 EDT
From: Merqu
Posted on: America Online
I had contracts for as long as two years, and as short as one day. Bottom line... know your escape clause.
Subj: To Merqu 95-08-11 01:27:56 EDT
From: Screenfeem
Posted on: America Online
Thank you! I see an attorney tomorrow to discuss the contract. Will check out the escape clause!
Screenfeem
Subj: Escape 95-08-11 02:53:49 EDT
From: WriteTV
Posted on: America Online
Screenfeem,
If the agency is a WGA signatory, there's always an escape clause. If 90 days go by without your receiving an offer of work, you can notify the agent in writing (via certified mail) that you're walking. The agent has the same out.
Genia
Subj: To: WriteTV 95-08-11 12:22:13 EDT
From: Screenfeem
Posted on: America Online
Thanks, Genia!
Screenfeem
Subj: Juanita Brown 95-08-17 14:17:18 EDT
From: MookLaredo
Posted on: America Online
A few years ago, I met a very nice helpful agent
who submitted some spec scripts for me. I met her
just by walking into her office on Sunset B lvd.
I have lost track of her and would love to know if
she is still active. Anyone know? I have a completed screenplay that's being held captive and
is bursting for release!!!
Mooklaredo
Subj: How to find an agent 95-08-22 19:30:50 EDT
From: WrtgCenter
Posted on: America Online
Yes, it's possible to sell your script without an agent, particularly to the
small independent producers that advertise in the trades and on AOL.
However, finding an agent is almost always a plus in furthering your career.
For a free, brief report on how to find an agent, e-mail your address to me.
I'm Dave Trottier, produced screenwriter and author of "The Screenwriter's
Bible. e-mail: WrtgCenter@aol.com. Good luck with your search.
Subj: Re:How to find an agent 95-08-22 23:24:43 EDT
From: Mindrew
Posted on: America Online
(waving to David)
Howdy! Nice to see you here as well as on GEnie.
Subj: Re: Success without an agent 95-08-23 19:19:34 EDT
From: Banzai1609
Posted on: America Online
The low down is this..........the chances of getting your script sold without the use of an agent are practically zero, BUT, that doesn't mean that they are totally zero. Just pick up the T.V. guide and pick a cable channel and you will find one or two crappy movies that had to have been peddled around by hand, SAM RAIMI did it with a little footwork.
Then there's always the writer's ace in the sleeve........SUBTERFUGE.
If you don't have the agent in your hand, lie; just a little. And don't claim more than you can handle. PENN and LEFF are good examples of this method.
Don't give up hope, true believer's, if you've got the desire; you'll find the way!
Subj: Playwright's Corner 95-09-04 18:28:19 EDT
From: PNNMTN
Posted on: America Online
After two successful months we continue on. All previous conferences can be found in the Chat Log Library in Writer's Club Chat Menu. There has been a motion for an earlier time. I have submitted a request for an earlier time for the conference. We will move to 10:30EST when a slot during this time frame opens up - otherwise hold on - drink some coffee -- and jump in.
September 1995 PLAYWRIGHT'S CORNER Schedule. Tuesday Nights 11:30PM EST, Writers Club Conference Room.
How to get there: Go To - Keyword: Writers, then select Writer's Chat Rooms, from the Chat rooms menu, select Writer's Conference Room.
* September 5 - Theatre X wants to produce my play - what now?
* September 12 - Playwright/Director relationship - we're in production now
* September 19 - Collaboration - the roll of the technicians
* September 26 - there will be no conference on this day. Host is on vacation.
*****
Please submit any suggestions for topics. Feedback is always welcome.
Thanks to all those who have participated these past couple of months. Murphy
Subj: Agents 95-09-08 00:01:57 EDT
From: HappyJS
Posted on: America Online
Hold readings of your plays in major cities and invite them. Be sure the plays in top shape, they don't forget. Would you if you went out after work to see a play that is just poorly read, written or both?!
That's how I got a small agent to seriously work with me. I freelanced for six months and he sent a contract. I called the Dramatists Guild and their attourney David Freidlander was great. He read over the contract made things clear and told me what made sense and what to ask for. We did that three times over two more months before I signed.
The agent is also a lawyer. He calls back, sends requests as well as rejections and handles things well. You've got to take your time and never sign anything without consulting an entertainment attourney. There are tricks to any trade.
Hope this helps in some way.
HAPPYJS
Subj: WGA 95-09-17 17:24:19 EDT
From: ANN3RDTRY
Posted on: America Online
After you register your scripts with WGA, would there be any reason and/or advantage in the pursuit of an agent, to become a member of the WGA? Are most screenwriters members? Are agencys impressed with the fact that you are a member?
Is there a list that is handy to agents? Does it make any difference to an agent? Had enough of these questions? Seriously, I need to know. Thanks!
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-17 23:04:07 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
ANN - It's not easy to be a WGA member. You need produced films, TV shows, etc. If you ask them, they'll send you guidelines. But your question shows your priorities are backwards - you must write some things that sell FIRST (via whatever channel) THEN worry about WGA for anything other than registration.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-18 18:00:35 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Ann,
You register you rmaterial with the WGA to try to avoid to come out of possible legal conflicts later on (who thought of what, and when). NEVER shop anything that hasn't been registered.
If you sell something to a bona fide production co. you will have to join the WGA. There are non-union deals where you could work and not be a member ,or where membership could be a "liability".
Being a member of the WGA won't make much of a dent on an agent, I guess, unless you are selling something.
BTW, joining the WGA isn't the same as joining a gym. Od-timers on the board will have heard it, but they have some VERY peculiar policies about membership, both new and continuing. If y9u ain't sold, you cain't join; if you don't CONTINUE to sell and make a certain amount of money, they boot you (Involuntary Withdrawl).
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-19 13:42:33 EDT
From: ANN3RDTRY
Posted on: America Online
DW and Pottree,
Oh!!!! Very interesting. Sure glad I asked.
Thanks!
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-20 00:37:42 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
ANN - Don't tell me - your ID comes after your first two efforts at a screen name were rejected by AOL? Very clever.
- DW IN OH -
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-20 13:09:00 EDT
From: ANN3RDTRY
Posted on: America Online
DW - Nooo, but that's very close. It really should be ANNseveraltrys. I live in the mountains. Signal problems, power on and off, major rains, major problems with AOL at the time. I was in a ...well, really...quite a mood. Still am. Also, screename represents a third career move. First two, were relatively, successful. This one is going to be the most difficult. Near impossible...but, what the hey? We'll see. I'm feeling lucky. All this love and support coming thru cyberspace. Cool!
Carpe diem! Ann
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-21 00:37:01 EDT
From: DW IN OH
Posted on: America Online
Doing this long-distance makes the impossible even more difficult but the odds can be beaten. There are plenty of chest-thumpers online who, by dint of living in a one room LA apt. that would be condemned here are "in the business," but pay no mind. As I read the trades over the years, I've collected success stories. Older writers, writers waaay far away from CA, writers who were constantly rejected or close to the poor house before hitting a home run ...
Like you, I've had considerable success in other "lives." I have no illusions but no doubt as to the outcome. Keep writing and do your best to stay above the fray.
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-21 15:39:54 EDT
From: Mkword
Posted on: America Online
>>If y9u ain't sold, you cain't join; if you don't CONTINUE to sell and make a certain amount of money, they boot you (Involuntary Withdrawl).<<
A note of clarification:
To join the Writers Guild of America you need to accumulate a certain number of points. You generate these points whenever your work for a signatory company and/or sell or option material to a signatory comapny. ("Signatory" meaning the company in question has agreed to do business by the WGA bylaws. That would include most production companies and studios and networks.)
One feature film job will give you enough credits to automatically make you a full-fledged member.
*You WILL NOT be booted out of the Guild for lack of work. The only way you can loose your WGA membership is by not paying your dues (if you didn't make any money from writing your dues are only 25.00 per fiscal quarter) or by violating any of the guidelines of the Guild.
The Guild is essentially a union ... a union structured to help protect and better the working conditions for professional writers in film, television and radio.
You acquire an *agent* by the commercial potential and quality of your writing.
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-21 20:00:34 EDT
From: Pottree
Posted on: America Online
Much truth in the description of the WGA, but some misleading items, viz:
If the WGA were a union it would act like a union, which it does only part of the time. One problem: so many of the members are both management and labor (hyphenates).
In a regular union, you do not need to amass brownie points to join to maintain Cureent staus; you are in or out. NOt so in the WGA, where your membership status depends on how much you earn under WGA jurisdiction. You can join as an Associate (don't earn much yet but have potential)... BUT, if you don't accumulate the right number of brownie point in the right number of months, you are placed on Involuntary Withdrawn status. This is against the law (NLRB) for a true union, as is representing people who both sell and buy labor's work product.
By comparison, my wife's in AFM (Musicians) and if you care to join, you join, pay the dues, and that's that until you break the work rules or stop paying your dues. There is no requirement that you have any level of union employment, during any period of time, and they don't have various "grades" of membership. And while some of their members are music execs, etc.,they are all musicians first and respect each other for that. Definitely NOT the case in the WGA.
It is amazing, and many not in the writing dodge don't believe it, but I have had to turn down offers of substantial money from non-sigs, have walked the picked lines in the broiling sun for the WGA, but they STILL gave me the heave-ho when I feel short of the number of points required to move to Current status.
Also, the benefits package available through the "union" is contingent on your earnings. In other words, like Republicans, they think that if you really find yourself in need (such as out of work an sick or injured) they can drop you like a hot potato for the "real" working writers, who are almost exclusively either TV staff writers for series or hypenates who can essential hire themselves or their cronies.
Don't get me wrong -- I'm a stong union supporter. I feel more than a bit mistreated, though, by the exclusionary policies of the WGA.
Subj: Re:WGA 95-09-21 20:49:44 EDT
From: Wryturguy
Posted on: America Online
CARPE PER DIEM!
(Sieze your daily allotment)
8/27/56 1:15:10 PM Closing Log file.
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